Models...no not those kind!

[jak3af3r]

I am sure there have been failures but any touring act brings spares of amps guitars etc. so the Kemper requiring a spare for touring is not a factor as I can tell.

Right. I take a spare guitar and have a small "B rig" I take just in case of catastrophe.

All the guys I talked to with kempers take 2-3 a person because they have all had at least one fail.

Mozzi, if you get one, let me know, I'll send you all my presets and IR's I made of my own amps.

 

[Glide-bpm]

I'm thinking of going the Kemper or Axe FX route. I'd like to hear some pros and cons. I love amps but I kind of just want some different (good) tones and don't want to spend more money on different amps. I mainly play at home and record. I have a nice setup in the basement and I can play fairly loud without complaints. My wife wears hearing aides and takes them out when she goes to bed. This is good on weekends when I stay up late!

Being the guy that's owned the following for extensive periods of time: Axe FX II and Kemper; and still own these: Helix (and Helix LT) and Axe FX 3,
I'll give the following ratings IMHO (I am a fanboy for no brands):

Number One King of The Hill- Axe FX 3! It's totally awesome and now has an easy to use interface, in addition to all the horsepower, goodies, and
frequent updates. I have two Fractal large expression pedals and a Fractal FC-12 controller pedalboard. The FC-12 is programmable and
very very powerful for customization (and great with the stock settings).

Close 2nd place- Line 6 Helix. I still gig this thing for shows and church. Unloading the Helix LT that was my backup to Helix until the Axe FX 3 took
over as the number one gig rig. I will keep the Helix for primary backup and will use it often when I only want one piece of equipment to tote
around (instead of a rack and a separate pedalboard). Helix is a really great piece of equipment and tool. It's very close to the Axe FX 3, but
if I could only have one, it would be Axe FX 3.

Close 3rd place- Kemper profiling amp. I still wish it would have been worth keeping all of the Big 3, but this one fell to the wayside first.
I had most of the major commercial profiler's full amp profile packs. I saw just about all it could do and enjoyed it for a few years. I still owned
it for the first several months to a year of Helix. I bought Helix with the first group of shipments (pre-ordered). Kemper is still never a bad
choice.

It all comes down to personal preference with any of these 3.

A friend of mine has a Headrush pedalboard. It sounds nice, but it doesn't have the power of the top 3 IMHO. A fairly economical solution, though!
I can't say "don't buy a Headrush"... it's good enough to get the job done well.

I rarely crank of my two custom built tube amps anymore. They are the only two I kept from what used to be a pretty full music
room of tube amps and pedals.

Just one guy's opinion who has owned about every digital modeler out there that's a major player.

 

[Glide-bpm]

Right. I take a spare guitar and have a small "B rig" I take just in case of catastrophe.

All the guys I talked to with kempers take 2-3 a person because they have all had at least one fail.

Mozzi, if you get one, let me know, I'll send you all my presets and IR's I made of my own amps.

I've had Helix the longest of any of the modern modelers. Never had a failure on it gigging regularly. I've owned it since the first
ones shipped since I pre-ordered from Sweetwater. I've had Axe FX 3 since pretty close to the first shipments. I was pretty early
on the waitlist when I pre-ordered. It hasn't been gigged as much as my Helix floor (or Helix LT), but it's built like a tank just like
my old Axe FX II XL+ was. I never had any failures on my Kemper when I owned and gigged it for about 3 years. I'd say they're all
a heck of a lot less delicate than any tube amp for sure. I used a Kemper rack, though and had it in a rack case. I had the Kemper
controller and Mission Kemper expression pedals.

I always had some sort of backup (even used my still owned Tonelab LE for it before buying a Helix LT).
I have NEVER had to use the backup. Tube amps? If it wasn't an amp failure, it was a cable failure in
the chain of pedals going to the amp or from guitar to wireless. In other words, I've had more failures from
analog devices of some sort more than I have the digital modelers. Mine always have a hardshell case or
a rack they're mounted in for gigging regardless.

Most of the electronic stuff is going to fail during the early times of ownership if it's going to fail. The exception to this would
be the early batches of Helix LT's that had the mechanical failure of the expression pedal. They were all honored even after
warranty with a free repair/replacement from what I understand. My Helix LT has never had this problem. It was not in the oldest
batch of Helix LT's.

Your mileage may vary, but I now trust the heck out of the major modeler manufacturers!

 

[11top]

I have over 700 amps in my Kemper. The price seems pretty reasonable once you do the math and consider how much I paid for each of those 700.

 

[Black Plaid]

For those of you that do run Kempers, do you run through your studio monitors or with a power amp and guitar cabs?

I have found the real weak spot of amp simulation to be the speaker IRs, they always sound fizzy or just wrong in some other way to me. But I have never tried a Kemper IRL.

 

[jak3af3r]

Your mileage may vary, but I now trust the heck out of the major modeler manufacturers!

I'm only passing along information that was given to me from members of Easton Corbin's band about Kempers and reliability.

I've only had two times where my helix powered on and refused to do anything but a power down and back on resolved the problem.

My amps thus far have been reliable apart from reverb tanks breaking springs. And I had one Wampler pedal footswitch nut loosen so the pins didn't connect to the board which disconnected the input and output even with the unit off.

The benefit to the modelling is it's exactly the same every time as opposed to a tube amp which will need to have maintenance (bias adjustments and whatnot) to run optimally.

 

[Herr Squid]

Thanks for posting this! It's very valuable (and altogether too rare) to hear the perspective of someone who's owned all of the above. I felt like I had to edit my prior post pretty carefully to not say things about the Kemper and Helix, which I have no actual experience of. i'm so satisfied with my Axe-FX III and Friedman ASM-12 rig I'm just not even tempted to try anything else out.

Being the guy that's owned the following for extensive periods of time: Axe FX II and Kemper; and still own these: Helix (and Helix LT) and Axe FX 3,
I'll give the following ratings IMHO (I am a fanboy for no brands):

Number One King of The Hill- Axe FX 3! It's totally awesome and now has an easy to use interface, in addition to all the horsepower, goodies, and
frequent updates. I have two Fractal large expression pedals and a Fractal FC-12 controller pedalboard. The FC-12 is programmable and
very very powerful for customization (and great with the stock settings).

Close 2nd place- Line 6 Helix. I still gig this thing for shows and church. Unloading the Helix LT that was my backup to Helix until the Axe FX 3 took
over as the number one gig rig. I will keep the Helix for primary backup and will use it often when I only want one piece of equipment to tote
around (instead of a rack and a separate pedalboard). Helix is a really great piece of equipment and tool. It's very close to the Axe FX 3, but
if I could only have one, it would be Axe FX 3.

Close 3rd place- Kemper profiling amp. I still wish it would have been worth keeping all of the Big 3, but this one fell to the wayside first.
I had most of the major commercial profiler's full amp profile packs. I saw just about all it could do and enjoyed it for a few years. I still owned
it for the first several months to a year of Helix. I bought Helix with the first group of shipments (pre-ordered). Kemper is still never a bad
choice.

It all comes down to personal preference with any of these 3.

A friend of mine has a Headrush pedalboard. It sounds nice, but it doesn't have the power of the top 3 IMHO. A fairly economical solution, though!
I can't say "don't buy a Headrush"... it's good enough to get the job done well.

I rarely crank of my two custom built tube amps anymore. They are the only two I kept from what used to be a pretty full music
room of tube amps and pedals.

Just one guy's opinion who has owned about every digital modeler out there that's a major player.

 

[Clashcityrocker]

Here is what the not released yes Axe FX FM3 looks like. https://www.fractalaudio.com/tmp/190423-Fractal-Audio-Announces-the-FM3-Amp-Modeler-MultiFX.pdf

 

[Glide-bpm]

Thanks for posting this! It's very valuable (and altogether too rare) to hear the perspective of someone who's owned all of the above. I felt like I had to edit my prior post pretty carefully to not say things about the Kemper and Helix, which I have no actual experience of. i'm so satisfied with my Axe-FX III and Friedman ASM-12 rig I'm just not even tempted to try anything else out.

Yep... Like I said, I'm not anyone's fan boy... There was a long stretch where I didn't own a Fractal product. Kemper is excellent, Helix is excellent, Axe FX 3 is excellent. I could live gigging any of the three. The Axe 3 is just more appealing to me right now. Unless you are able to spend a lot of time with all of them, you probably won't have a bias. And I mean a lot of time diving deep into them!

They all make it better for us guitarists with every generation of product!

 

[Glide-bpm]

I will say that if you get a Kemper, I highly recommend MBritt profiles! There are several people that put out great ones, but Michael Britt seemed to capture that groove I was looking for with not a lot of tone shaping. I might have tweaked the gain up or down a little, but I used his profiles more than any others!

 

[Boogie]

For those of you that do run Kempers, do you run through your studio monitors or with a power amp and guitar cabs?

I have found the real weak spot of amp simulation to be the speaker IRs, they always sound fizzy or just wrong in some other way to me. But I have never tried a Kemper IRL.

Done both. Each approach brings something unique to the table. Inserting into the FX loop in my MkIII works great and sounds like it’s own thing. Love it! The FRFR approach is my current fav and it simply rocks!

 

[WA Paul]

For those of you that do run Kempers, do you run through your studio monitors or with a power amp and guitar cabs?

I have found the real weak spot of amp simulation to be the speaker IRs, they always sound fizzy or just wrong in some other way to me. But I have never tried a Kemper IRL.

First through studio monitors (JBL LSR305), then Headrush FRFR 108, now PowerCab. But I only get to play at low SPL levels when others are asleep so my situation is different than most.

 

[11top]

For those of you that do run Kempers, do you run through your studio monitors or with a power amp and guitar cabs?

I have found the real weak spot of amp simulation to be the speaker IRs, they always sound fizzy or just wrong in some other way to me. But I have never tried a Kemper IRL.

I use two Headrush FRFR 112s for stereo effects (live rig). At home I use Headrush FRFR 108s. Both sound great.

 

[Huggy Love]

 

[László]

I have over 700 amps in my Kemper. The price seems pretty reasonable once you do the math and consider how much I paid for each of those 700.

I’m curious; of the 700 amp models in your Kemper, how many do you regularly use?

If you’re like me, you’ve tried a bunch, but there are only a handful you find useful enough to use regularly,

I have about a dozen different software amp packages, each with dozens of modeled amps. Of those many amps, there are four or five of the total number I find useful when I need a scratch pad. The rest are never going to see the light of day, even in a demo.

Having that many is I suppose a cool number to throw around, but of very little use in the real world.

Honestly, I don’t see much point in putzing around, scrolling through model after model to settle on a handful of amp models when I can easily have the 4-5 real amps in my studio (and that’s what I actually do).

YMMV, of course.

 

[László]

I have always said that the listener, the target audience generally cannot tell the difference - even in a Mix.

But they can tell if it sounds exciting, and they can tell if the performance is inspired. It’s irrelevant to your audience how you achieved that, but they do want to hear it.

So how do you put your best foot forward in a mix when recording? With what you can “get away with,” or with the best way to do it?

I can tell you with 100% certainty that the audience doesn’t care how many different amp tones you have in your digibox. They care if you sound awesome.

Here’s the thing: You only need one amp to sound awesome.

 

[11top]

I’m curious; of the 700 amp models in your Kemper, how many do you regularly use?

If you’re like me, you’ve tried a bunch, but there are only a handful you find useful enough to use regularly,

I have about a dozen different software amp packages, each with dozens of modeled amps. Of those many amps, there are four or five of the total number I find useful when I need a scratch pad. The rest are never going to see the light of day, even in a demo.

Having that many is I suppose a cool number to throw around, but of very little use in the real world.

Honestly, I don’t see much point in putzing around, scrolling through model after model to settle on a handful of amp models when I can easily have the 4-5 real amps in my studio (and that’s what I actually do).

YMMV, of course.

That’s a good question, Les. I haven’t been using very many; maybe 12-15? But I’m the new guy in a band that wants the tones of our guitars to sound like those on the covers, so I’m likely to be using quite a few more. So, let’s assume that I double the number on my playlist settings. It’s still pretty cool and convenient for playing live.

I also think it’s fun to dial through what’s available, but I admit there is a lot of redundancy. The point I was really making about “700” is the price of the Kemper seems reasonable to me based upon what one gets and what it can do.

Ironically, your name did come up while discussing modelers at Sweetwater this weekend. I commented that I understood why Les would prefer tube amps based upon the tones I’ve heard you use for your genre. I think the kind of music one plays determines in part the kind of amp one will be happy with. I understand tube preference with cleaner tones. I tend to play heavier rock songs which I think the Kemper (and Headrush) do well. I’m not going to argue that modelers sound exactly like tubes, but I do think they’ve come a long way, and I’m happy with the tones and convenience and what they offer me.

 

[11top]

Here’s the thing: You only need one amp to sound awesome.

And in some cases, a bunch of pedals? I think it depends upon your genre and what you’re trying to accomplish. I don’t think Tom Morello or the Edge can get by with a single amp unless they have a bunch of other effects to color it. But still, it could be one amp, I guess.

 

[Mozzi]

But they can tell if it sounds exciting, and they can tell if the performance is inspired. It’s irrelevant to your audience how you achieved that, but they do want to hear it.

So how do you put your best foot forward in a mix when recording? With what you can “get away with,” or with the best way to do it?

I can tell you with 100% certainty that the audience doesn’t care how many different amp tones you have in your digibox. They care if you sound awesome.

Here’s the thing: You only need one amp to sound awesome.

All I'll say on it is that there are numerous big touring bands and artists that have switched to using digital modelling and the audiences have been excited, coming away saying things like 'this band as never sounded so good', coming away feeling elated to see and HEAR the band/artists perform. An example would be Metallica for example who are now using Axe-FX on tour and have been for years, playing to sold out stadiums all over the world. Not one person at that I have managed to find has come away thinking that Metallica didn't sound awesome, that the performance was 'lacking' something

Metallica aren't the only ones who are using modelling for their live performances where the audience has not been able to detect a digital modeller, haven't ruined their evening or left them disappointed - at least not with the sound. The list of artists using Axe-FX is astounding, using it both in the studio and on tour. Its an essential part of many artists rig.

It may not excite you as an artist which may not then excite your audience but many top artists are using Digital modellers and their audiences are more than 'happy' with the sound these artists are producing, are leaving excited and thrilled...

 

[Huggy Love]