S2 and SE “S” & TCI Pickups and Split Coil Tone

[Jaw3000]

I’m evaluating purchasing an S2 model guitar over an SE – specifically something as close to a Paul’s Guitar as I can get, which would likely be the S2 Custom 24-08, although I would prefer a stoptail. It would be nice if PRS made an S2 Paul’s guitar.

One of the things I really like about the Paul’s guitar is the excellent split coil sounds. They sound quite good. I’m sure something similar has been asked before, but I’m quite confused about the pickups. Strangely, both the SE Custom 24-08 and SE Paul's Guitar use "TCI S" pickups (not sure if they are the exact same?), the SE/S2 Custom 24s use 85/15 S - and none of the standard S2 models use "TCI" tuned pickups (yet the Core and SE does, on some models). The SE Paul’s and SE Custom 24-08 guitars do not mention which pickup they use, just saying “TCI S." Another thread mentions it’s marked as “Paul” on the pickup, but does anyone know if the SE Paul’s just uses a TCI-tuned 85/15 S, or something different? And how different does the 85/15 S sound on coil split than the Paul’s SE’s “TCI S?” Are the pickups the exact same on the SE Paul's and SE Custom 24-08? Sometimes the Custom 24 descriptions mention coil tap, other times it mentions “coil split” like the Paul’s Guitar does. Even more confusing, I've read references to a P90 tone for the Paul's guitar pickups, but I have not seen this mentioned for the 24-08?

Then to add confusion, there is the S2 Anniversary model, with the US-made 85/15 TCI pickups. How similar to the Paul’s tone are these in split coil mode?

The S2 is a somewhat perplexing line. I would have thought it represented a nice upgrade from the SE line for double the price, but it seems the S2 models use mostly the exact same foreign-made pickups, plastic nut, and hardware as the SE line, with the main differences being US-made, perhaps better QC, a slightly nicer finish and bezel carve and perhaps locking tuners. I’m not sure if better wood is used on the S2. That being said, on paper, the S2 doesn’t really look like that much of an upgrade and slightly hard to justify over an SE. Thanks for any thoughts.

 

[SinSir]

TCI is both a process and pickup. The TCI in the se are the pickup, assumed also have the process. Those are the only pickups in the se and s2 line that have the TCI process and name besides the 10th anniversary which has core pickups. All current core models have the TCI process.

The s2 has higher quality woods, frets, nut, tuners, QC, and US built on its own line in Maryland with a nitro finish. Up until recently the se necks were built using a multi-ply. They now have a few models that use a scarf joint like the s2 and bolt on series. There is a clear feel, look, and even tone difference between the se and s2. That doesn't mean the se is bad, but all the PRS lines represent a difference that correlates with the price bracket.

Many PRS use a resistor for coil splits or some other technique to improve single coil emulation.

 

[spawnofthesith]

The S2 is a somewhat perplexing line. I would have thought it represented a nice upgrade from the SE line for double the price, but it seems the S2 models use mostly the exact same foreign-made pickups, plastic nut, and hardware as the SE line, with the main differences being US-made, perhaps better QC, a slightly nicer finish and bezel carve and perhaps locking tuners. I’m not sure if better wood is used on the S2. That being said, on paper, the S2 doesn’t really look like that much of an upgrade and slightly hard to justify over an SE. Thanks for any thoughts.

I can't speak on the TI stuff, but I've tried many many SEs over the years, and have never really been moved by any of them. I was outright turned off by an SE 594 I tried a few months back.

On the flipside, I got an S2 vela back in the spring, and quickly fell in love with PRS and since then have gotten a Core, a bolt on model, and most recently an S2 594 and I'm very much into all of them.

This isn't to say that I think SEs are bad, in fact I think they're probably the best imports you can get right now (and with the current sale absolutely the best bang for the buck). But I do feel that they feel more like a cort guitar with PRS looks than the feel of a Maryland produced PRS. YMMV of course!

I don't have a problem with the "S" version of the pickups at all, I personally think they sound great. I think the 58/15 LT "s" pickups in my 594 sound better than any stock Gibson pickups (and I'm a big gibson fan)

 

[bodia]

The S2 is a somewhat perplexing line. I would have thought it represented a nice upgrade from the SE line for double the price, but it seems the S2 models use mostly the exact same foreign-made pickups, plastic nut, and hardware as the SE line, with the main differences being US-made, perhaps better QC, a slightly nicer finish and bezel carve and perhaps locking tuners. I’m not sure if better wood is used on the S2. That being said, on paper, the S2 doesn’t really look like that much of an upgrade and slightly hard to justify over an SE. Thanks for any thoughts.

The nut is the proprietary PRS nut infused with brass. It's the same nut that they used on all of the Core models since the beginning of time. Exception being those that have recently transitioned to bone. The SE line did used to have a cheap white plastic nut. That changed recently. Maybe with the move to Indonesia? Could have been the last couple of years.

 

[Veetwin]

I believe the SE Pauls splits in a different way to the 24 - 08. There is reference to it if you research it. The TCI s pickups are 85/15 S tuned to TCI. That is my take on it. There is a youtube of Paul explaining the TCI pickups.

 

[SinSir]

I believe the SE Pauls splits in a different way to the 24 - 08. There is reference to it if you research it. The TCI s pickups are 85/15 S tuned to TCI. That is my take on it. There is a youtube of Paul explaining the TCI pickups.

The ohm readings support the TCI named pickups are different from 8515S. TCI is confusing I know. Heck, maybe I should double check that to the 24-08. I'm sharing information in regards to the TCI in the Paul's guitar. Lol

Edit- The TCI pickups in Paul's guitar and se 24-08 do have differnet readings, even though both named TCI on their website. Way to go Marketing department!

 

[Veetwin]

 

[Veetwin]

 

[LandShark1]

Would you say a Paul’s Guitar and its tone are more similar to a 594 (and the 58/15) or Custom 24 (and the 85/15)? I have only played an SE Paul’s Guitar and liked the tone and its versatility quite a bit. I’m not into modern shredding or lots of gain, so I sometimes wonder if the Cu24 is too “modern” for me, but I’m not sure how it compares in tone to a Paul’s. Conversely, I also wonder if the 594 is too vintage.

Paul’s has a 25” fret length, 22 frets, stop bridge. 594 is 24.5”, 22 frets, stop bridge. Cu24 is 25”, 24 frets, tremolo. I would prefer a stoptail. Not sure how much a difference the 0.5” fret length difference makes to tone and playability in practice.

 

[Glide-bpm]

I thought there was an actual S Paul's pickup with TCI...

 

[tyfu20]

Would you say a Paul’s Guitar and its tone are more similar to a 594 (and the 58/15) or Custom 24 (and the 85/15)? I have only played an SE Paul’s Guitar and liked the tone and its versatility quite a bit. I’m not into modern shredding or lots of gain, so I sometimes wonder if the Cu24 is too “modern” for me, but I’m not sure how it compares in tone to a Paul’s. Conversely, I also wonder if the 594 is too vintage.

Paul’s has a 25” fret length, 22 frets, stop bridge. 594 is 24.5”, 22 frets, stop bridge. Cu24 is 25”, 24 frets, tremolo. I would prefer a stoptail. Not sure how much a difference the 0.5” fret length difference makes to tone and playability in practice.

I have the S2 594 10th Anniversary with the core pickups and electronics as well an early SE Paul's. To me the sounds of the Paul's is more mid range/P90 like and sits in between the sounds of the 594 and CE/Custom 24's that I've owned. If you prefer a stoptail, I believe you would enjoy the Paul's, lightweight and incredibly versatile.

 

[Jaw3000]

I have the S2 594 10th Anniversary with the core pickups and electronics as well an early SE Paul's. To me the sounds of the Paul's is more mid range/P90 like and sits in between the sounds of the 594 and CE/Custom 24's that I've owned. If you prefer a stoptail, I believe you would enjoy the Paul's, lightweight and incredibly versatile.

That's what I was thinking as well. It's a shame PRS doesn't make an S2 Paul's or something similar.

I do wonder what pickups the Paul uses though. It would be nice if this was better documented. It only says "TCI," which it seems is more of a process. I know P90 has been thrown around in reference to the tone, but I don't think it is actually a P90 pickup as it's a Humbucker. I assume they took another pickup - say 85/15 or 58/15 - and then tuned it via TCI to have a brighter, sharper, yet vintage tone, more like a P90. Do you think it sounds more like an 85/15 or 58/15?

I'm considering the S2 594 Anniversary. How do you find the tone? I've read confusing things about the 58/15 LTs. Some say it's quite dark and muddy, yet others talk about the clarity and surprisingly good mids and highs. I tend to like the clarity and range of the 85/15's, but I often find it quite harsh and clinical. I often play clean, and it can be somewhat unpleasant. Yet, sometimes the 594 does sound dark and muddy in videos I've watched.

 

[SinSir]

I do wonder what pickups the Paul uses though. It would be nice if this was better documented. It only says "TCI," which it seems is more of a process.

The se Pauls is named TCI. That's the pickups name.

Not sure what's up with calling the 24-08 TCI too. It does in fact have much different readings than the se Pauls.

 

[Gurdybloke]

I've just acquired an S2 35th Anniversary CU24. I missed out first time round. It's an ex-demo and they're not that easy to find over here in the UK so was pleased to get it (as an ex-demo it's got a few dings but plays beautifully). They're the 'S' pickups though I can't recall or remember whether or not these are the TCI ones (the legacy description on the website doesn't say much), and I've seen various descriptions of what's in these depending on the retailer.

I think I need to check the resistance against some of my other guitars - hopefully this will help to work out what they are, also g with the helpful comments here!

 

[GCal]

Then to add confusion, there is the S2 Anniversary model, with the US-made 85/15 TCI pickups. How similar to the Paul’s tone are these in split coil mode?

I'm late to the party here, and I'm not sure if you've made your choice yet. I bought the S2 McCarty 594 10th Anniversary Limited Edition last March. I played it for a month, and sent it back to Sweetwater in exchange for a Core Paul's.

My impression of the 58/15 LT was that while they sounded clean, they also sounded a bit muted for my taste. The split/tap tone difference seemed very subtle to me.

The tone of the pickups of the Paul's are clear and full. A bit brighter than the 58/15 LT but definitely not harsh. Although they aren't Fender Strat single coil level tone when split, they do a very good job of sounding like an actual single coil pup.

 

[Jaw3000]

I'm late to the party here, and I'm not sure if you've made your choice yet. I bought the S2 McCarty 594 10th Anniversary Limited Edition last March. I played it for a month, and sent it back to Sweetwater in exchange for a Core Paul's.

My impression of the 58/15 LT was that while they sounded clean, they also sounded a bit muted for my taste. The split/tap tone difference seemed very subtle to me.

The tone of the pickups of the Paul's are clear and full. A bit brighter than the 58/15 LT but definitely not harsh. Although they aren't Fender Strat single coil level tone when split, they do a very good job of sounding like an actual single coil pup.

Thanks for the response. I also bought at returned the S2 McCarty 594 Anniversary with the 58/15 LT's, and my impression was much the same as yours. After trying the "S" pickups on the SE line, I liked the articulation of the 58/15 LTs, but thought they were somewhat lifeless and dark. I'm not a huge fan of the brightness of the Fender strat tone, however I would have appreciated more brightness and responsiveness to make the 58/15 LTs a bit clearer and more enjoyable. I have not tried the Core Paul's to be able to comment on its pickups, but it sounds like it may offer this. I agree the splits on the 58/15 LTs are very subtle, and almost useless as a split. I thought the "TCI S" on the SE Paul's Guitar had more life to it without being muddy or harsh, although it lacked the clarity and articulation of the core pickup. I still think it is probably hands down better than the 58/15 S pickups in the non-anniversary S2s. Its splits were quite good though. If I were going for an SE model, I'd recommend the Paul's SE just for the pickups alone. It's a bit of a shame they don't offer any S2 models with them.

 

[GCal]

If I were going for an SE model, I'd recommend the Paul's SE just for the pickups alone. It's a bit of a shame they don't offer any S2 models with them.

Agree with you on this. I was seriously on the fence putting out the money for a Core, but since I'd already shelled out the $2500 for the McCarty I was already half way to the Core. Having said that though, taking into consideration the S2 models tend to have the "S" line of pickups in them I'd not hesitate to go for an SE Paul's, add locking tuners, plek and have the frets crowned/polished and call it a day.

I'm curious to know what you've landed on?

 

[sumitagarwal]

I'm also really curious about this, and keeping an eye on the 2024 model changes.

My understanding is that the SE 24-08 does now indeed have the same TCI "S" pickups as the SE Paul's, just as the Core 24-08 now has the same TCI pickups as the Core Paul's (albeit the 24-08's have the neck pickup closer to the bridge than the Paul's! How much of a difference is this? Discuss!).

And yet the S2 24-08 plows ahead with it's 85/15 "S", putting it confusingly and annoyingly out of step with both the Core and SE versions. And only the S2 line lacks a Paul's model. Coincidence?! Discuss!

 

[SinSir]

My understanding is that the SE 24-08 does now indeed have the same TCI "S" pickups as the SE Paul's,

Although they are both called TCI they are not the same. The ohm readings are quite different. The 24-08 output is closer to the 8515S and much less than the Paul's.

just as the Core 24-08 now has the same TCI pickups as the Core Paul's (albeit the 24-08's have the neck pickup closer to the bridge than the Paul's! How much of a difference is this? Discuss!).

Yes they both have the Paul's pickups, but these pickups are nothing like the se pickups. In the core they are differnet construction down to the shape and not treated as just a name like in the se.

And yet the S2 24-08 plows ahead with it's 85/15 "S", putting it confusingly and annoyingly out of step with both the Core and SE versions. And only the S2 line lacks a Paul's model. Coincidence?! Discuss!

The s2 also has the 10th with core pickups and my guess is that may be the direction we see the 2408 go in the future. Core Cu24 pickups instead of the Paul's pickups. But maybe the Paul's pickups. Looking across the lines we'll see change of some sort.

The 2408 got Paul's pickups as another difference between the Cu24. It follows some logic for the s2 2408 to get core pickups to differentiate from the s2 Cu24. More ways to justify moving up lines and across models.

 

[Broseph]

This to me is the easiest way to hear the difference. The neck pickup comes off more p90. I’m pretty sure the SE and S2 use the same pickups for the 24-08s