PRS CE Models 00's 10's 20's Comparisons?

2 hesitations...
1. I really like the way the trem bridge sits on PRSi even if I never use them
2. Is there enough if a tone difference between a 'hog CE and my Standard 22?
I'd pass because of the stoptail. Even though I don't use my trem all that much. It's so damn comfy, dig the tone, and damn it I want options!

I debate back and forth on a hog CE and standard myself. One of the two will be added this year. There's enough of a difference to justify both, but I'm far from the point that I need to add guitars to cover ground. Smaller differences don't justify purchases for me anymore.
 
Well... the only justification I have now is loving guitars and wanting another variation of PRS. I lean towards the trem model as well, especially as it's a beautiful trans cherry red, kinda what I always think of as an original-style PRS. I also missed out on an 88 Special very recently in CR, that's gonna haunt me for a long while.
 
2 hesitations...
1. I really like the way the trem bridge sits on PRSi even if I never use them
2. Is there enough if a tone difference between a 'hog CE and my Standard 22?

There’s plenty of difference tone-wise and feel-wise. There’s a ton of CE-22’S with trems out there, a stoptail is a rare find.
 
There's less because a trem is better :)
There’s plenty of difference tone-wise and feel-wise. There’s a ton of CE-22’S with trems out there, a stoptail is a rare find.
Guess I'll just have to pony up and them both. LOL

Waiting for answers to a question or two but leaning trem... better shape, more attractive, has OHSC and candy. The stoptail is a bit beat, replacent PIII tuners (extra holes) and ships in a generic gig bag, only a tiny bit cheaper.
 
I'm not one of the "Dungeons and Dragons" PRS users...in other words, I'm not one of the particularly smart people on the planet.

So, I say with no defense prepared, the current version of the CEs feel like a shrinkflation version of the old CE.
The new ones are not the same quality, more like S2s or SEs. I like my one S2, but it's not in the same class as the older 'cores' I have.
 
I think it’s nonsense comparing the modern CEs to stuff from the 90’s. So much has changed. Nobody compares todays cores to the 90s like the CE is argued constantly about. The trem has changed. Tuners changed. Electronics. Pickups. Finishes. How can somebody compare a core from today to the 90’s? They would never sound the same. That’s like comparing a 50’s strat to a 70’s. It’s a whole different beast now. I’m pretty sure Paul is on record saying the guitars nowadays are superior to what they were cranking out decades ago. Everybody has their preferences. The new ones are phenomenal, and a good value brand new compared to cores. The used market is just as nice, as one can find some modern CEs at sub $1.4K; which is a bargain for a guitar with core level electronics (just last year they wanted $500 for the pickups alone!)

I think a lot of this is the misperception that the new CEs have sE level electronics. Somehow this has been repeated over and over since they got re-released. They only share the trem system. The rest is s2 tuners (which work great) and core parts. The maple finishes are gorgeous, clearly a step above S2, and for the most part, I’d say prettier than original CEs on average.

Me personally: I prefer a 3 way toggle. So the modern CE makes me happy. I did install a MannMade bridge. I feel a huge step up from the SE line. Well worth it. I think too many people are talking themselves out of trying one!
I do think the comparison you're making isn't really the same though. Comparing a modern core vs an old core is basically seeing the evolution of PRS (in a good way). Build quality is probably the same, if not a little better, with gradual improvements to electronics and hardware. But overall, they're the same guitar with the same construction and body. It's just been slightly tweaked over the years.

However, comparing a modern CE vs an old CE is seeing the regression of a model. Not saying the new CE is a bad guitar (I've played one and it's an excellent guitar). But the biggest differences are the actual construction of the guitar and not the small electronics/hardware changes like the core line experienced.

It no longer has the deep violin carve or routing for the control knobs like a core does. The maple cap is thinner. It no longer has a quarter sawn neck. The cavity covers on the back no longer sit flush with the body. The inlays are plastic. The trem is also shared with the import line.

Now here's the funny thing. Do I think the new CE line is a bad deal? Nope.... It has better construction and quality than many equivalents at the same price. However, the old CE line was the bargain of the century, and that was 100% PRS's fault.

They've stated multiple times before that they actually lost money on the old CE line because they priced it much lower than the core line, but on average it only saved about 45 minutes to fully build a CE compared to a Custom 24 (and I'm guessing it's only to do with it having dot inlays versus the bird inlays on the cores, and the fact that a set neck has to sit and dry compared to getting bolted).

The modern CE24 is what Paul envisioned all along. A cheaper, bolt on neck alternative to their core line. Once technology improved (CNC's, etc.), they brought the CE back because they could finally make the guitar that they were trying to make from back in the day.

So as a community, we can't really fault PRS for the new CE being what it is. If we wanted the new CE to be constructed just like the old ones well guess what, PRS would have been smarter this time around and charged us core level prices. Then what are we going to do? Complain that they drastically increased the price to what they should have been charging all along? The old CE's were a gift to the community, but at the same time was poor business practice from an economic standpoint.
 
I do think the comparison you're making isn't really the same though. Comparing a modern core vs an old core is basically seeing the evolution of PRS (in a good way). Build quality is probably the same, if not a little better, with gradual improvements to electronics and hardware. But overall, they're the same guitar with the same construction and body. It's just been slightly tweaked over the years.

However, comparing a modern CE vs an old CE is seeing the regression of a model. Not saying the new CE is a bad guitar (I've played one and it's an excellent guitar). But the biggest differences are the actual construction of the guitar and not the small electronics/hardware changes like the core line experienced.

It no longer has the deep violin carve or routing for the control knobs like a core does. The maple cap is thinner. It no longer has a quarter sawn neck. The cavity covers on the back no longer sit flush with the body. The inlays are plastic. The trem is also shared with the import line.

Now here's the funny thing. Do I think the new CE line is a bad deal? Nope.... It has better construction and quality than many equivalents at the same price. However, the old CE line was the bargain of the century, and that was 100% PRS's fault.

They've stated multiple times before that they actually lost money on the old CE line because they priced it much lower than the core line, but on average it only saved about 45 minutes to fully build a CE compared to a Custom 24 (and I'm guessing it's only to do with it having dot inlays versus the bird inlays on the cores, and the fact that a set neck has to sit and dry compared to getting bolted).

The modern CE24 is what Paul envisioned all along. A cheaper, bolt on neck alternative to their core line. Once technology improved (CNC's, etc.), they brought the CE back because they could finally make the guitar that they were trying to make from back in the day.

So as a community, we can't really fault PRS for the new CE being what it is. If we wanted the new CE to be constructed just like the old ones well guess what, PRS would have been smarter this time around and charged us core level prices. Then what are we going to do? Complain that they drastically increased the price to what they should have been charging all along? The old CE's were a gift to the community, but at the same time was poor business practice from an economic standpoint.

PRS made over 33,000 of them over a 20 year period. They weren’t selling them at a loss.
 
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PRS made over 33,000 of them over a 20 year period. They weren’t selling them at a loss.
It wasn all labour. The woods were also a little lower grade (tops etc), which factors in big time.

That being said: I would love to get an old style CE22 ;-)
 
PRS made over 33,000 of them over a 20 year period. They weren’t selling them at a loss.
If they weren't selling them at a loss then they at least weren't making very much money on them.

https://prsguitars.com/blog/post/5_fun_facts_about_the_ce_24

Directly from their website:

4. The CE was supposed to be faster to build, allowing for a lower priced model. It didn’t go according to plan.

Jack: The original intention with the CE was to create another step in our product offerings. One goal was obviously to make a guitar that maple neck players would be interested in. We thought the CE would be much faster to make and allow us to offer it at a lower price. The thing is, they took a ton of time to make and by the time the guitar landed in a player’s hands, they were getting a tremendous value.

Rob: The CE saved us maybe 45 minutes in production (versus a PRS Custom 24), but we had it priced like it was saving us 5 hours of production. It ended up being a great deal for buyers.
 
If they weren't selling them at a loss then they at least weren't making very much money on them.

https://prsguitars.com/blog/post/5_fun_facts_about_the_ce_24

Directly from their website:

4. The CE was supposed to be faster to build, allowing for a lower priced model. It didn’t go according to plan.

Jack: The original intention with the CE was to create another step in our product offerings. One goal was obviously to make a guitar that maple neck players would be interested in. We thought the CE would be much faster to make and allow us to offer it at a lower price. The thing is, they took a ton of time to make and by the time the guitar landed in a player’s hands, they were getting a tremendous value.

Rob: The CE saved us maybe 45 minutes in production (versus a PRS Custom 24), but we had it priced like it was saving us 5 hours of production. It ended up being a great deal for buyers.

Never confuse PRS marketing with truth. When something doesn’t sell, doesn’t make money, or causes more problems than it solves, it disappears from the catalog.
 
Never confuse PRS marketing with truth. When something doesn’t sell, doesn’t make money, or causes more problems than it solves, it disappears from the catalog.
Isn't that basically what happened? The first gen didn't make profit or money, so it disappeared from the catalog.

If anything, this article probably shouldn't have been released at risk of cannibalizing sales out of the new CE. They're basically saying "those old used ones you see on reverb? They were hard to make since they were like a core model. But these new ones aren't too bad and actually make sense for us to sell at this price point"
 
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Main difference now is it the core trem on old vs. SE/S2 trem on new. Meh. Main difference there is steel block on SE/S2 trem vs. brass on core (chocolate vs. vanilla, no right/wrong there) and cheaper saddles on Se/S2, but perfectly functional. If the saddles were a big issue I'd have replaced them; I have not. If I did, it would be highwoods, not brass core saddles. I have CEs from both eras and they are both just fine. People get bent out of shape about era of CE but honestly, having owned ones from the eras in question, it's a non-issue. Really comes down to the individual instrument. I prefer the satin finished necks on the newer ones honestly.
 
Isn't that basically what happened? The first gen didn't make profit or money, so it disappeared from the catalog.

My point was that if it wasn’t making them a good profit, they wouldn’t have made 33,000 of them over a twenty year period. When a model doesn’t sell it disappears quickly—it doesn’t take two decades for them to figure it out. You’ll notice nothing in what you quoted actually says they sold CEs at a loss. It’s marketing copy that tries to tell a consumer what a great deal they’re getting. You drew the wrong conclusions from it.
 
My point was that if it wasn’t making them a good profit, they wouldn’t have made 33,000 of them over a twenty year period. When a model doesn’t sell it disappears quickly—it doesn’t take two decades for them to figure it out. You’ll notice nothing in what you quoted actually says they sold CEs at a loss. It’s marketing copy that tries to tell a consumer what a great deal they’re getting. You drew the wrong conclusions from it.
I'm not necessarily saying they sold them at a loss, but they weren't making as much profit from them as they should have.

They stated that they priced it like they were saving 5 hours of production when they really were only saving 45 minutes.

In terms of the marketing aspect, they only released that information AFTER the first Gen was discontinued. Why would they tell the public that the old models were a great deal? What benefit does it serve them to promote an old discontinued model? They make no profit from guitars being sold on the used market.

If anything, they need to promote the new model on how it's better compared to the old product. Not the complete opposite.
 
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The reasons above are why I tried to get PRS to make me a Private Stock CE24 earlier this year. I wanted one equivalent to the older ones, with out the issues of buying a 30 year old guitar. Unfortunately, despite my and John Mann's best efforts, PRS politely declined to make any PS CEs...
Well heck.....buy a used CE that you like and send it to the factory for refret and complete setup.

You could buy pickups you want to use and send with guitar AND have then install the one piece trem.

It would be like a new used CE.
 
I own four CEs and they are fantastic guitars.

I have no interest in a new CE and I'm sure they are very fine guitars, just not for me.
I agree. I'd say if a 2016+ model comes up on the used market for a really good price, I'd probably grab it as a good gigging guitar.

But I also own two first Gen CE's (1993 and 1995) and they're absolutely incredible. I'd probably even sell my Custom 24 and McCarty before those.
 
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