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Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by ]-[@n$0Ma☩!©, Jul 1, 2013.
Anytime you're in town....you have an open invite.
In this case - yep. At least plugging the Axe FX into the front end of an amp. There isn't a single modeler made that sounds good like that - even the ones that have an output mode for that sound horrible like that (most of the Line 6 and Boss units have such a mode). It's like running the piezo output of a P22 into a cranked Marshall and saying that the acoustic sounds aren't very good. While it works and can produce a unique sound, it's not the intended configuration.
Hans wasn't digging it so some of us that have used it to our satisfaction chimed in with better ways to run it. Don't read more into it than that.
I think the Axe-FX is great. I think my traditional amps are great - I've got a Two Rock, Friedman, Twin, Blues Jr., Legacy III, etc. I can make music with any of this gear - I find it all inspiring. In my Stones tribute band I use the Two Rock. In my other band I've been using the Friedman but I may switch back to the Axe II. These are all awesome choices.
Just spent another hour playing with the Axe FX... in headphones.
I find just the opposite with the Axe-II. The right models are really sensitive to touch and pickups if you've got things set up well. And with a recent firmware version (10.0 or greater) it's really not necessary to tweak the deep parameters to get it to sound good. The things to make sure of are:
- set input levels so that the red input LED lights occasionally
- make sure the "out clip" LEDs never light
- play at a healthy volume
- keep the amp block master high
- keep the amp block gain control low enough that the amp isn't just being a preamp gain buzz-fest
That Fender amp is going to put its sonic stamp on everything you play through it. The best thing to do is make sure you turn cabinet modeling off ('cause you're playing through an actual guitar speaker) and experiment with whether power amp modeling on or off sounds better to you.
My favorite amp models for nuance include the Plexi Treble, Wrecker, and Two Stone. Those actually do respond really nicely to the volume knob on our favorite guitars. Another note: I was playing "Under the Bridge" last night on a Fralin-equipped strat through the Axe's Plexi Normal preset. Perfection! Then I plugged in my PRS Studio, and those pickups just sounded awful with that amp model: hot, flabby, and farty compared to the traditional strat single coils. The Studio is a great guitar, it just wasn't a good match for those settings on that model. I do find that single coils sound way better than 'buckers on many Fender and Vox-based amp models.
Thanks for the input Dave.
And... your avatar rocks.
Even though it's a bit out of fashion? You've probably figured out that matters to me not at all!
But what happened with Dane's....?
I was unfortunate enough to have owned the ART SGE processor when it came out. It was so bad I had written a letter to ART asking them to buy it back, they declined but exchanged it for the ART MACH. I swore off ART products for a long time but I'm sure they have improved since then. FWIW, the SGE was the easiest to figure out as far as programming goes, excellent manual written by a human with common sense. The quickest way to piss yourself off is to try and figure out a tc electronics G-major!
I think that BE clip sounds really good man.
I've always used my Ultra with a guitar power amp and 4x12 which defeats the purpose really. Sounded good, but I wasn't using as intended. I pulled the Axe outta my rig because I was using a handful of presets and figured it would serve me better at home. Then a PRS popped up that I NEED to buy so I've got it for sale. I guess I won't be doing any direct recording with it. I'll probably buy another at some point.
Only with the sheep.
My advice was based on thinking the op was trying to decide if modeling was for him not being aware it was to demo some new pickups.I'm sure we came off as lecturing but it was well intended advice albeit for the wrong reasons in the clearer light
OK, I did an extreme (for my usual settings) patch in my Eleven Rack, based on an MK II Boogie with waaayy more gain than I would use in a normal recording or playing situation.
Guitar is my 96 Cu24. Starts with the pickup position next to the bridge humbucker and volume around 3. at about 0:38" I switch to the bridge humbucker (HFS), not touching the volume and at some point I am going full volume on the bridge humbucker.
Don't mind the playing I am just trying to show that modelers can respond well to extreme changes in guitar volume and pickup changes....
Hope the link works... https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwSsOMCPzLaEY2liQm9xSDhacDQ/edit?usp=sharing
"Extreme changes", yes. But the goods are in the subtle changes. I had to turn the guitar's volume down to 2 before the tone changed on my favorite "metal" preset. What about all those possibilities between 2 and 10?
Look, I'm not bashing Axe FX 2 users. I'm not even bashing the Axe FX 2. But given the choice between the real deal and the Axe FX, it's no contest. And since it looks like I would have to invest in an FRFR rig (whatever the hell that it) in addition to the cost of an Axe FX 2 ($2500ish) and then the controller pedal (another $999), I may as well buy the real thing.
But that's just my take. If it works for you, get on wit-yo-bad-self.
FRFR = Full Range Flat Response. Ideally 20 Hz - 20 kHz +/-3 db.
Simplified, something that represents exactly what the Axe does without adding any EQ or distortion of its own.
Thanks for the info. Can you elaborate on the amps/cab combo's (by name) Axe FX users call an FRFR?
FRFR is just the speaker set up you would use in conjunction with something like an AxeFX - basically they are powered monitors with a flat EQ so you get a true projection of what the modeler is outputting where as a power amp and gutiar cabinet would obviously color the tone because of things like tubes, speaker types and cabinet wood type.
Here is a photo of Adrian Belew using two powered monitors in an FRFR set up.
Here is someone using a Kemper with an "FrFr" set up
Or just your home hi-fi stereo system. The speakers listed are all powered with on-board amps. All you need is the Axe and speaker. Of course, you could go modular and get passive speakers and a solid state or tube amp to drive them, but all-in-one is a much simpler approach.
Since I have been following the Axe-FX, the most popular powered monitors/cabs for an FRFR rig have sort of followed this progression:
Atomic Reactor FR->Verve FBT 12ma->QSC K12->RCF NX 12-sma->Atomic CLR
There are many others of course, but those seem to be the most discussed. Some people like the 10" speaker cabs a lot for the weight, but I have always preferred 12" speakers myself. I am currently waiting to replace my Verves with Atomic CLR's.
Check out "Alto" powered monitors - Guitar Center sells them and they are ridiculously good for the price. They come in 10, 12 and even 15!