Special semi-hollow 22 pickup orentation

[ssmug]

I recently picked up a SSH, and see that PRS orients the pickups so that both HB have the screw pole pieces facing the bridge. Traditionally, the neck PU has the screws facing the neck (as on my HB I and CE-22, and the majority of guitars, it seems).

From what I've read, when the PU is split, it's the slug portion that stays active -- is that correct? In that sense, when it's in full HB mode, it seems like it wouldn't matter which way the screws are facing, yes?

What was the rationale for PRS to choose this setup?

 

[Greywolf]

Brighter tone, it all started with Wes Montgomery

 

[John F]

Disclaimer: I’m not a pickup expert, but I have researched pickup design and wiring of the SE SAS because of rewiring the guitar, changing pickups, and installing a Freeway 6 position switch. Some of the following may not be totally accurate, please correct me as necessary.

The clockwise vs counterclockwise wrap direction and wind starting at the bobbin top/bottom affect thenphase output of the pickup. The magnet placement north/south polarity orientation of screw/non-screw pole pieces to the magnet(s) affects phase of the pickup also. These differences are selected by the builder of the pickup and appear to me to vary across pickup manufacturers, I have not found a standard yet. Rotating a pickup from the way it was installed will reverse the phase of the pickup. Swapping the output wires of a pickup also swap the phase. This will change the guitar tone when pickups are on at the same time from how they sounded before the rotation. If both pickups have matching polarity towards the neck the output phase will be additive. Pickups having opposite polarity/phase will subtract and create a softer tone with a more significant effect on the tone.

The SE SAS with the middle pickup is built with bridge and neck humbuckers having the south coil towards the neck, and the north coil towards the bridge. (Interesting to note; the 85/15S and 85/15 TCI pickups have screw heads on the south of the neck pickup. The screws on the bridge pickup are north.) The single coil middle pickup is south. Switching on both full humbuckers wires them in parallel and it makes the signals add, slightly increasing the output and merging the individual tones. Adding the middle pickup to one or both full humbuckers places it in parallel also and does more addition. Splitting either humbucker uses only the north coil in each humbucker. Turning on the middle pickup with one or both split coils in the humbucker places a north humbucker coil in parallel with the south middle pickup. This causes the output phases to be subtractive which shifts the tone more and quiets the guitar output.

My Gibson Les Paul has a polarity swap on one of the pickups when you pull out one of the volume knobs. This causes signal subtraction because of the phase swap. Adjusting the volumes to achieve minimum signal output greatly shifts the tone giving what I believe is known as the Peter Green tone.

Some telecasters use a 4 position switch where the extra position places the 2 pickups in series instead of parallel and greatly increases volume with a difference in tone from the parallel wired switch position.

 

[JasonE]

The clockwise vs counterclockwise wrap direction and wind starting at the bobbin top/bottom affect thenphase output of the pickup. The magnet placement north/south polarity orientation of screw/non-screw pole pieces to the magnet(s) affects phase of the pickup also. These differences are selected by the builder of the pickup and appear to me to vary across pickup manufacturers, I have not found a standard yet. Rotating a pickup from the way it was installed will reverse the phase of the pickup. Swapping the output wires of a pickup also swap the phase. This will change the guitar tone when pickups are on at the same time from how they sounded before the rotation. If both pickups have matching polarity towards the neck the output phase will be additive. Pickups having opposite polarity/phase will subtract and create a softer tone with a more significant effect on the tone.


Some telecasters use a 4 position switch where the extra position places the 2 pickups in series instead of parallel and greatly increases volume with a difference in tone from the parallel wired switch position.

How you mount a humbucker doesn't matter when it comes to the phase of it. The only way to change the phase of a pickup is to either flip the magnet in it or swap the hot and ground wires when you wire it up. The reason PRS mounts them with the screw coils toward the bridge is for the tone of the split sound. The tone will change due to it being in a different place under the string.

With the Tele, running the pickups in series doubles the windings the signal is going through. That is why it gets louder. I would have to check the wiring on mine to see if they flip the hot and ground on one of the pickups to essentially create a humbucker. I was thinking they do but would have to verify that.

 

[bodia]

The reason PRS mounts them with the screw coils toward the bridge is for the tone of the split sound. The tone will change due to it being in a different place under the string.

Exactly this

 

[John F]

How you mount a humbucker doesn't matter when it comes to the phase of it. The only way to change the phase of a pickup is to either flip the magnet in it or swap the hot and ground wires when you wire it up. The reason PRS mounts them with the screw coils toward the bridge is for the tone of the split sound. The tone will change due to it being in a different place under the string.

Makes sense that the phase wouldn’t chage for rotation of the pickup. I did recognize that the spot of the string being picked up would change in split humbucking depending on pickup rotation. Did surprise me that the active split coils don’t both have screws, I assumed before inspection that they would to be able to balance string output.

I assumed that north coil split in parallel with south single coil would be opposite phase, but the middle pickup winding direction could produce an in phase or out of phase parallel combination even with the poles opposite. I would need to remove the magnet and apply a dc current to the coil to check polarity of the winding. I’m not that interested in disecting a pickup to find out. Measuring pickup output with a storage oscilloscope could prove phases, but my scope is not a storage scope.

 

[JasonE]

Makes sense that the phase wouldn’t chage for rotation of the pickup. I did recognize that the spot of the string being picked up would change in split humbucking depending on pickup rotation. Did surprise me that the active split coils don’t both have screws, I assumed before inspection that they would to be able to balance string output.

I assumed that north coil split in parallel with south single coil would be opposite phase, but the middle pickup winding direction could produce an in phase or out of phase parallel combination even with the poles opposite. I would need to remove the magnet and apply a dc current to the coil to check polarity of the winding. I’m not that interested in disecting a pickup to find out. Measuring pickup output with a storage oscilloscope could prove phases, but my scope is not a storage scope.

PRS has been making their pickups out of phase with each other for a while now. If you buy a new set of 57/08 pickups from the accessories store, they are magnetically out of phase. The earliest set I have like that are from 2015, I think. I have another set that I bought in 2016 or 2017 that are that way as well. You have to flip the wires on one of the pickups when you wire them up. It is the bass/neck pickup that they flipped.