Setting Action on a C24

[ayoBuuk]

Hey guys,

Happy to say I've finally got my hands on my dream guitar in a Custom 24 and even though I've had it for a couple months now sometimes it still doesn't feel real haha. Anyway I have a couple questions regarding getting the action relatively low.

Once I got the guitar I dropped the action down from what the previous owner had it set to. PRS's official setup instructions state that you can get as low as .9/16" on the high E and .95/16" on the low E measuring from fret 12. I ended up taking all of mine down to an even 1/16" and have been presented with a couple of issues as a result.

Firstly, to get my high E down to this height, I've got the saddle bottomed out against the trem plate; it can't go any lower. I know that the first thought this will raise with people is that the bridge height has been at some point adjusted higher than factory spec, but I measured it as well and it is 1/16" off of the body of the guitar where it should be.

The other issue I've run into is just a bit more fret buzz than is tolerable. I don't really care at all how much they buzz when the guitar isn't plugged in but where I'm at right now, it comes through the amp. It seems the majority of the buzzing comes from the frets in the middle of the neck which would suggest that it's a neck relief issue but I've used a feeler gauge to check it as well and it seems like it's in a pretty good spot. Would an eighth of a turn on the truss rod yield good results? I'm wary of having too much relief in the neck; in a perfect world I could have the thing stick straight to be honest.

I'm close to just taking a day trip to Sweetwater to get the thing Plek'd if god forbid I've got a high fret somewhere causing issues but I'm gonna wager that's not it considering this guitar is still a toddler born in 2021.

 

[You_Narf]

Plek would definitely be worth it. My Santana SE had some pretty bad fret work, took it in and now it plays like a dream.

 

[ayoBuuk]

Plek would definitely be worth it. My Santana SE had some pretty bad fret work, took it in and now it plays like a dream.

I just have a hard time believing a USA instrument would have shoddy fretwork, but crazier things have happened. I should just bust out a straight edge and rule it out

 

[You_Narf]

I just have a hard time believing a USA instrument would have shoddy fretwork, but crazier things have happened. I should just bust out a straight edge and rule it out

Understandable.

Never underestimate what can be the lack of detail in America, as is true with any other country. I worked in a couple American factories (one being a plastic mold injection line, the other a wood piece line) that toted the "Made in America" stamp - unfortunately that means less today. Sadly, there was alot of product that passed QC that shouldn't have - per under supervisor orders and labor conditions (QC inspectors would catch it and ask supervisors) .... and customer/receivers still had to pay top dollar.

The pandemic changed alot of quality control in America. It's been hard for people to bounce back up (not economically but work pride wise). There's alot of workplaces that don't hold workers accountable as they should. Sadly. Factories are one of them. In this era, you either keep people and let things slide, or hold then accountable and watch your number of employees dive. But you need employees to make parts....

 

[JasonE]

I have not experienced fret issues on core level PRS guitars. I have done setups on a bunch of them and have yet to see a fret issue. I have seen fret issues on the SE line.

I like the setup just a little lower than what PRS sets them from the factory. I bought a new PRS Studio last fall. I had to lower the trem by 1/4 turn on each screw to get it where I like it. I have seen this vary from guitar to guitar. I had to adjust my SAS like this as well. However, by CU24 and DGT are fine where they were set. The trem is a little higher on those and the action is where I want it. I don't like having the saddle completely flat on the trem plate. I like the screws to have tension on them. I also run my necks almost dead straight. I usually have no more than .005" relief in my necks.

I would think you could get it dialed in without a PLEK.

 

[ayoBuuk]

I have not experienced fret issues on core level PRS guitars. I have done setups on a bunch of them and have yet to see a fret issue. I have seen fret issues on the SE line.

I like the setup just a little lower than what PRS sets them from the factory. I bought a new PRS Studio last fall. I had to lower the trem by 1/4 turn on each screw to get it where I like it. I have seen this vary from guitar to guitar. I had to adjust my SAS like this as well. However, by CU24 and DGT are fine where they were set. The trem is a little higher on those and the action is where I want it. I don't like having the saddle completely flat on the trem plate. I like the screws to have tension on them. I also run my necks almost dead straight. I usually have no more than .005" relief in my necks.

I would think you could get it dialed in without a PLEK.

I agree. I'm still a bit confused about how my high E saddle height being so low considering I busted out the action guage and noticed I'm even a little higher than 1/16".

I think I'm just going to bite the bullet and have someone look at it; there's a very highly regarded tech working out of a shop locally and I'm sure he can get it sitting pretty. Just worried his lead time is gonna keep me out of practice for a little while which stinks. Oh well

 

[JasonE]

I agree. I'm still a bit confused about how my high E saddle height being so low considering I busted out the action guage and noticed I'm even a little higher than 1/16".

I think I'm just going to bite the bullet and have someone look at it; there's a very highly regarded tech working out of a shop locally and I'm sure he can get it sitting pretty. Just worried his lead time is gonna keep me out of practice for a little while which stinks. Oh well

If I were close to you I would offer to take a look at it. I find that many people that do setups in shops really don't seem to understand the PRS trem. I have fixed some that someone else messed up. I have seen some interesting things with these. One friend of mine had one that was pretty messed up. I told him how to fix it. I happened to go to a gig of his shortly after I told him how to fix it. He said he though he had it pretty well adjusted after doing what I told him to do. Before he even started the first song he put the trem arm in and pushed on it and the whole bridge came out of the pivot screw grooves and went straight to the body of the guitar. He just looked at me and said "uncle." He put it in the case and I took it home with me. I fixed it the next day and took it back to him at another gig that night. He played it worked the heck out of the trem that night and it worked great and stayed in tune all night. He said he didn't know what the heck I did to it but it completely fixed any issues he was having.

 

[ayoBuuk]

If I were close to you I would offer to take a look at it. I find that many people that do setups in shops really don't seem to understand the PRS trem. I have fixed some that someone else messed up. I have seen some interesting things with these. One friend of mine had one that was pretty messed up. I told him how to fix it. I happened to go to a gig of his shortly after I told him how to fix it. He said he though he had it pretty well adjusted after doing what I told him to do. Before he even started the first song he put the trem arm in and pushed on it and the whole bridge came out of the pivot screw grooves and went straight to the body of the guitar. He just looked at me and said "uncle." He put it in the case and I took it home with me. I fixed it the next day and took it back to him at another gig that night. He played it worked the heck out of the trem that night and it worked great and stayed in tune all night. He said he didn't know what the heck I did to it but it completely fixed any issues he was having.

What makes it difficult to work with compared to other 6-point style trems?

 

[JasonE]

What makes it difficult to work with compared to other 6-point style trems?

You really have to pay attention to the slots in the screws. You can't measure them at the heads and count on that being a correct height. There is a knife edge in each of the 6 holes. You have to know how to adjust it or you can mess those edges up then the trem will not work in the slots of the pivot screws like it is designed to. Another thing that people seem to mess up on these is getting them set level. That affects how the string makes contact with the saddles and can affect intonation.

 

[You_Narf]

What makes it difficult to work with compared to other 6-point style trems?

They are proprietary hardware so it's a bit harder than the standard Gotoh/Fender trems. So just a but different than your universal trem.

However, if there's a local store that is a dealer with certified Fender techs, they can pretty much do PRS setup blindfolded. Reason I say that is because Fender is now shipping models with more complex bridges than PRS' trems (examples of new Fender guitars shipping with Babicz or VegaTrem... If my local tech has never heard of those or worked on them, then I might be reluctant to take a guitar with a trem to them at all - as what I see as complex may seem alien to then and they'd likely learn how to set that up through YouTube - at that point I'd rather set it up myself lol)

 

[ayoBuuk]

You really have to pay attention to the slots in the screws. You can't measure them at the heads and count on that being a correct height. There is a knife edge in each of the 6 holes. You have to know how to adjust it or you can mess those edges up then the trem will not work in the slots of the pivot screws like it is designed to. Another thing that people seem to mess up on these is getting them set level. That affects how the string makes contact with the saddles and can affect intonation.

Considering I'm no tech I certainly can't competely rule out that the bridge setup may be a part of the issue, however I'm fairly confident it's where it needs to be. It stays in tune with use (although I'm not going Dimebag on it or course) and is at factory spec height. I'll take a closer look though.

 

[ayoBuuk]

They are proprietary hardware so it's a bit harder than the standard Gotoh/Fender trems. So just a but different than your universal trem.

However, if there's a local store that is a dealer with certified Fender techs, they can pretty much do PRS setup blindfolded. Reason I say that is because Fender is now shipping models with more complex bridges than PRS' trems (examples of new Fender guitars shipping with Babicz or VegaTrem... If my local tech has never heard of those or worked on them, then I might be reluctant to take a guitar with a trem to them at all - as what I see as complex may seem alien to then and they'd likely learn how to set that up through YouTube - at that point I'd rather set it up myself lol)

All I know is that with my luck if I so much as even look at the trem funny I feel like it'll explode haha So if more than just saddle/claw adjustments are needed there I'll find someone else I can trust

 

[JasonE]

Considering I'm no tech I certainly can't competely rule out that the bridge setup may be a part of the issue, however I'm fairly confident it's where it needs to be. It stays in tune with use (although I'm not going Dimebag on it or course) and is at factory spec height. I'll take a closer look though.

With the stock PRS core nut, I can dive bomb my trems and they come back in tune. I can tell you that at least two of mine are set lower than the factory spec to get the action I like. I have two or three others that have the action I like where the bridge shipped from PRS. It seems to vary a little from guitar to guitar.

They are proprietary hardware so it's a bit harder than the standard Gotoh/Fender trems. So just a but different than your universal trem.

However, if there's a local store that is a dealer with certified Fender techs, they can pretty much do PRS setup blindfolded. Reason I say that is because Fender is now shipping models with more complex bridges than PRS' trems (examples of new Fender guitars shipping with Babicz or VegaTrem... If my local tech has never heard of those or worked on them, then I might be reluctant to take a guitar with a trem to them at all - as what I see as complex may seem alien to then and they'd likely learn how to set that up through YouTube - at that point I'd rather set it up myself lol)

I wouldn't call those trems more complex. They are just different and knowing how to work on those doesn't mean they will easily be able to set up a PRS bridge. I have set up many different types of bridges over the years. You just have to understand the mechanics of the bridge to set it up. Another one that I got good at is setting up a Floyd. I do them without any special tools and I guarantee they will work well and stay in tune. They are darn near bulletproof when set up correctly.

 

[You_Narf]

With the stock PRS core nut, I can dive bomb my trems and they come back in tune. I can tell you that at least two of mine are set lower than the factory spec to get the action I like. I have two or three others that have the action I like where the bridge shipped from PRS. It seems to vary a little from guitar to guitar.


I wouldn't call those trems more complex. They are just different and knowing how to work on those doesn't mean they will easily be able to set up a PRS bridge. I have set up many different types of bridges over the years. You just have to understand the mechanics of the bridge to set it up. Another one that I got good at is setting up a Floyd. I do them without any special tools and I guarantee they will work well and stay in tune. They are darn near bulletproof when set up correctly.

Not sure I can agree with that and not sure if you've seen my posts but I have a good collection of customized guitars and by customized (I owned at least 25 electric and all of them are highly modified), I mean highly modified from wiring under the hood to custom made pickgaurds and set-ups. Although I wasn't aware that set-ups can lock in like that, I thought a good temp and humidity/seasonal change could easily get a guitar to differentiate from the set-up, as well as a truss rod slightly varying in movement through transit whether shipping or gigging. Wood and metal are just that, wood and metal, and even when temp and humidity don't change that doesn't mean that other things can't intervene. Variables can vary in each case and differ radically per guitar. One guitar may be easier to work with, another might be a spawn from hell and take much more work. We can say "I've never seen or heard of" all day but strange, unexplained things just happen.

I personally wouldn't say that a Babicz or a Vegatrem aren't more complex bridges/trems than a PRS or a Fender trem. Alot more research and engineering has gone into them and the more moving parts you have, the greater skill it takes to set it up correctly, however, that just means more control over tiny intonation levels and action or staying in tune and changing the feel, not that the set up will be more stable. Most people who have never heard of Babicz or VegaTrem are usually scared to set a guitar up without a reference was my point. PRS and Fender are commonly worked on these days so I was just recommending that he finds someone who is familiar with trems and bridges so they can identify the issue immediately, assuming that's the issue. OP seems sure and seems like they're not new to set up work. I do agree that once you know a bridge you know it but it's more than just installing for a Babicz or a Vegatrem. Hence why the Vegatrem comes with 4 sets of Springs, each set being for a different guage or strings.

Also, it was never a jab at PRS bridges, I think they're great. For what they do... Haven't had an issue with my recently acquired Santana SE or Silver Sky SE. However, are not exactly my favorite bridges/trems.

 

[show_a_little_faith]

It seems the majority of the buzzing comes from the frets in the middle of the neck which would suggest that it's a neck relief issue but I've used a feeler gauge to check it as well and it seems like it's in a pretty good spot. Would an eighth of a turn on the truss rod yield good results? I'm wary of having too much relief in the neck; in a perfect world I could have the thing stick straight to be honest.

I'm close to just taking a day trip to Sweetwater to get the thing Plek'd if god forbid I've got a high fret somewhere causing issues but I'm gonna wager that's not it considering this guitar is still a toddler born in 2021.

It might, and it's definitely worth trying before you bring it somewhere and pay someone. If if doesn't solve the buzzing, or you hate how it feels, turn it back!

 

[JasonE]

OP, do you know how much relief the neck has in it right now?

 

[SinSir]

I say neck relief and no to plek.