Private Stock 513 - thoughts?

[Wolfram]

Happy Friday!

So I've been toying with the idea of ordering a Private Stock guitar for a while now. I suspect once I contact a dealer about this things will spiral rapidly... so I wonder if I can ask for thoughts from the amazing wealth of experience here on the forum. I'm also interested in experiences of working with the Private Stock programme, how 'custom' it actually is?

So, my intended spec:
Model 513
Tremonti-style tremolo up-rout
25" scale (down from the standard 25.25")
Bound black ebony fingerboard

Electronics, either:
(ideally) standard 5 way selector but replace 3 way with a row of 4x mini switches (1. Neck single/hum selector, 2. Bridge single/hum selector, 3. Standard/Overwound hum selector for both neck/bridge, 4. Switch in neck pickup wherever 5-way selector is set)
(or) Standard 5 way and 3 way selector, with mini switch to bring in neck pickup wherever 5-way selector is set
I would also want the pickups potted as both of my 513s are somewhat microphonic at high gain.

The biggest thing I'm undecided on is the neck wood. I love rosewood necks (I have a 513 with solid Brazilian neck/fingerboard) but as I'm based in the UK that is not on the menu, and I've not played an Indian rosewood neck so don't know how it compares. I've not tried the rosewood neck/ebony board combo but really like what I've read about it here on the forum. I also just happened across 11top's gorgeous-looking Macassar ebony neck:

I have a soft-spot for ebony (I own several acoustic guitars with macassar ebony back/sides and absolutely love the tone of the wood in this application) but have no idea how it would sounds/feel as a neck - presumably heavy - any experiences? I'm also undecided on neck carve - probably pattern thin or the original 513 carve - but I'm not overthinking it, I'm not that sensitive to different neck profiles and have 513 (I think), wide fat, pattern regular and pattern thin which all feel good to me.

As you can probably tell I'm going for a versatile guitar here. I own four PRSi - wood library Cu24 with maple neck and ziricote fingerboard, Brushstroke 24 and two 513s (a 25th anniversary with mahogany neck and one that was custom built in 2006 for a PRS artist with solid Brazilian neck) and love them all! This Private Stock would zero in on the features I really like on each of them. I like a guitar with excellent sustain, snappy attack, not too bright but enough going on to get strong pinch harmonics etc. and ideally with a tone that develops or 'blooms' as it sustains.

Cosmetically, it'll be charcoal cherry burst or burnt maple leaf, quilt maple top, standard birds, smoked black/gold hardware and macassar ebony headstock facing (and would probably request ebony fingerboard binding to match).

So... I'd be grateful for your thoughts on my specs, any input on neck wood choice to achieve the tonal goals, and any ideas if they will be able to accommodate my electronics ideas? Really appreciate it.

Cheers,
David

 

[jxe]

stephen?

 

[veinbuster]

The program is less custom now than it has been historically. I can’t guess how long that will last...probably until the delivery time gets back below a year.

When I was getting Private Stock, your build would have been ok, but now I suspect not. Best check with a dealer for current limitations.

I quite like my Indian Rosewood and cocobolo necks. The Indian has the same feel as Brazilian, being minimally finished. Both are in similar tonal space to Brazilian. Ebony makes a nice fingerboard. I’m also a big fan of African Blackwood - consider it it you want a really dark board. Tonally not far from ebony.

 

[Alnus Rubra]

Which dealer in the UK were you thinking of working with?

Sounds like a great guitar in theory.

 

[Matte82]

I like a lot of your ideas. My thoughts on the switching are this. I sold my 513 because I didn’t like dealing with two blade switches. So I like what you’re doing there. But I personally would see if you could make the toggles for the humbuckers to separately do single/normal/hot for each pickup. Instead of a toggle just for normal/hot. Kind of like the 509 but one more position for the switches. Unless you really want to seperate the normal/hot to a seperate switch. Also for the neck switch. I have a hsh style guitar (I kind of modeled after a 513) and I set it up where I have a switch that only works in the middle position. And it lets me select between the middle pickup or the neck+bridge humbucker. I can’t do all 3 pickups at once. But never cared for that sound anyway.

But totally your guitar. And you know what you want out of it. I’m just throwing out ideas.

 

[Wolfram]

I like a lot of your ideas. My thoughts on the switching are this. I sold my 513 because I didn’t like dealing with two blade switches. So I like what you’re doing there. But I personally would see if you could make the toggles for the humbuckers to separately do single/normal/hot for each pickup. Instead of a toggle just for normal/hot. Kind of like the 509 but one more position for the switches. Unless you really want to seperate the normal/hot to a seperate switch. Also for the neck switch. I have a hsh style guitar (I kind of modeled after a 513) and I set it up where I have a switch that only works in the middle position. And it lets me select between the middle pickup or the neck+bridge humbucker. I can’t do all 3 pickups at once. But never cared for that sound anyway.

But totally your guitar. And you know what you want out of it. I’m just throwing out ideas.

I really like that implementation for switching between middle pickup and neck plus bridge humbucker - I don't need all three pickups at once.

My reasoning behind the separate switch for normal/hot was really just to keep everything visible and easy. I would envision changing from single to humbucker mid-song, but probably not between normal/hot - at least, that's what I've found with how I play the 513s at the moment. So that would keep functions logically spread through switches - some used for performance, some to 'set up' the guitar for a particular style. The middle/two hums switch would fall into the latter category.

 

[Wolfram]

Which dealer in the UK were you thinking of working with?

Sounds like a great guitar in theory.

I'm not sure. I've had good experience with GuitarGuitar, but only with buying guitars/amps off the shelf. Do you have any particular recommendations?

 

[Alnus Rubra]

I'm not sure. I've had good experience with GuitarGuitar, but only with buying guitars/amps off the shelf. Do you have any particular recommendations?

None personally.

Lee at Andertons and his team seem to have a good relationship with Paul and the factory. This is based on what they have shared online.

Maybe @Alan Manning will chip in, I know he has a PS that he commissioned in the last three years or so.

 

[RickP]

513s rock, and a PS version would be even nicer. Personally, all I could add would be wood and inlay items to the original spec for me as the neck, scale, pickup switching is all perfect. I still have a pair of Braz ‘07s, and they are among the best guitars I’ve ever owned.

Keep us up on your project! I’ll be curious to hear what is possible these days.

 

[Matte82]

I really like that implementation for switching between middle pickup and neck plus bridge humbucker - I don't need all three pickups at once.

My reasoning behind the separate switch for normal/hot was really just to keep everything visible and easy. I would envision changing from single to humbucker mid-song, but probably not between normal/hot - at least, that's what I've found with how I play the 513s at the moment. So that would keep functions logically spread through switches - some used for performance, some to 'set up' the guitar for a particular style. The middle/two hums switch would fall into the latter category.

And I can totally understand that. Everyone likes things differently. On the guitar I was talking about I have a 5 way blade and three toggle switches. The outer two switches are series/split/parallel for the humbuckers. And the middle toggle is the middle/neck+bridge switch. If I change anything, I’ll get rid of the split part of my switches. Series and parallel works pretty well. But the split sounds just doesn’t cut it for me. Nowhere near as good as my 594 splits.

 

[Anachronism]

I love 513s. My first core was a 513, I've tried a swamp ash, and my 2004 Rosewood is my number 1. A few thoughts
1. I think having a switch to allow you to add in the neck is worth it. I took my current 513 to the factory to add a push/pull to do that, and it's a nice addition (mostly for neck and bridge at once; having all three pickups isn't something I go to often).
2. An Indian Rosewood neck will feel pretty close to a Brazilian neck, in my view.
3. I suspect ebony would feel amazing as a neck.

 

[László]

I have no info about what's going on now, except I'd like to say what you're planning sounds pretty cool!

 

[P90s]

I recently asked whether the original 513 neck shape is available via a Private Stock order. If you have one of the Brazilian 513, I'm guessing that you have that original neck carve (narrow and deep).
I was told that PRS no longer provides this, so your neck carve options would be limited to the current choices. Since you're not hyper-concerned about neck carve, that won't be a big deal.

 

[11top]

also just happened across 11top's gorgeous-looking Macassar ebony neck:

3. I suspect ebony would feel amazing as a neck.

Ebony is the least porous, smoothest neck I own, more so than the dalbergias. IMO, it’s the most comfortable neck material.

This particular piece was in Michael Reid’s (PRS wood buyer) booth at The Experience. I asked him if I could use it for a PS build and he graciously agreed. Nice example of Macassar.

 

[Wolfram]

Ebony is the least porous, smoothest neck I own, more so than the dalbergias. IMO, it’s most comfortable neck material.

This particular piece was in Michael Reid’s (PRS wood buyer) booth at The Experience. I asked him if I could use it for a PS build and he graciously agreed. Nice example of Macassar.

It does look absolutely sublime...

Do you find that guitar at all neck heavy, or does it balance ok? Ebony is about 1/3 denser than rosewood, which is itself considerably denser than mahogany or maple so I'd be a little worried about the balance and maybe even the overall weight of the guitar.

And do you have any impressions of the tonal impact of the ebony neck, vs rosewood or maple?

 

[11top]

It does look absolutely sublime...

Do you find that guitar at all neck heavy, or does it balance ok? Ebony is about 1/3 denser than rosewood, which is itself considerably denser than mahogany or maple so I'd be a little worried about the balance and maybe even the overall weight of the guitar.

And do you have any impressions of the tonal impact of the ebony neck, vs rosewood or maple?

Surprisingly, this neck is well-balanced and not neck heavy. I also worried that it might be too bright, but I mostly play classic rock with some distortion and it sounds awesome with 59/09s.

I was worried about the same issues pre-build, but now I wouldn’t change my wood choices in this guitar.

 

[Wolfram]

I love 513s. My first core was a 513, I've tried a swamp ash, and my 2004 Rosewood is my number 1. A few thoughts
1. I think having a switch to allow you to add in the neck is worth it. I took my current 513 to the factory to add a push/pull to do that, and it's a nice addition (mostly for neck and bridge at once; having all three pickups isn't something I go to often).
2. An Indian Rosewood neck will feel pretty close to a Brazilian neck, in my view.
3. I suspect ebony would feel amazing as a neck.

Great to hear that it's possible and practical to do this on the 513 - I know its switching is a bit crazy!

I recently asked whether the original 513 neck shape is available via a Private Stock order. If you have one of the Brazilian 513, I'm guessing that you have that original neck carve (narrow and deep).
I was told that PRS no longer provides this, so your neck carve options would be limited to the current choices. Since you're not hyper-concerned about neck carve, that won't be a big deal.

Thanks for the info! It won't be a big deal and I'm actually leaning towards pattern thin for something a little different, as I will be keeping my Brazilian 513

The program is less custom now than it has been historically. I can’t guess how long that will last...probably until the delivery time gets back below a year.

When I was getting Private Stock, your build would have been ok, but now I suspect not. Best check with a dealer for current limitations.

This sounds a bit ominous... I hope it doesn't become restricted to just selecting a standard model and choosing some fancy-looking woods and inlays, neither of which I'm really bothered about. I guess it will all become clear when I take the plunge and contact the dealer.

 

[Alan Manning]

this is my experience. I ordered through Andertons although i presume this will be pretty much the same.
Contacted the dealer and they have an employer who works on this project. He'll sort you out and run you through the Ps form.
Once appointments have been made he will work with Jezz who is the rep for the UK and a real nice fella.
You'll put a down payment down and they will take care of you and then you have the wait so take a deep breath and hang on bravely!!!
Good Luck.

 

[Maertl513]

Happy Friday!

So I've been toying with the idea of ordering a Private Stock guitar for a while now. I suspect once I contact a dealer about this things will spiral rapidly... so I wonder if I can ask for thoughts from the amazing wealth of experience here on the forum. I'm also interested in experiences of working with the Private Stock programme, how 'custom' it actually is?

So, my intended spec:
Model 513
Tremonti-style tremolo up-rout
25" scale (down from the standard 25.25")
Bound black ebony fingerboard

Electronics, either:
(ideally) standard 5 way selector but replace 3 way with a row of 4x mini switches (1. Neck single/hum selector, 2. Bridge single/hum selector, 3. Standard/Overwound hum selector for both neck/bridge, 4. Switch in neck pickup wherever 5-way selector is set)
(or) Standard 5 way and 3 way selector, with mini switch to bring in neck pickup wherever 5-way selector is set
I would also want the pickups potted as both of my 513s are somewhat microphonic at high gain.

The biggest thing I'm undecided on is the neck wood. I love rosewood necks (I have a 513 with solid Brazilian neck/fingerboard) but as I'm based in the UK that is not on the menu, and I've not played an Indian rosewood neck so don't know how it compares. I've not tried the rosewood neck/ebony board combo but really like what I've read about it here on the forum. I also just happened across 11top's gorgeous-looking Macassar ebony neck:

I have a soft-spot for ebony (I own several acoustic guitars with macassar ebony back/sides and absolutely love the tone of the wood in this application) but have no idea how it would sounds/feel as a neck - presumably heavy - any experiences? I'm also undecided on neck carve - probably pattern thin or the original 513 carve - but I'm not overthinking it, I'm not that sensitive to different neck profiles and have 513 (I think), wide fat, pattern regular and pattern thin which all feel good to me.

As you can probably tell I'm going for a versatile guitar here. I own four PRSi - wood library Cu24 with maple neck and ziricote fingerboard, Brushstroke 24 and two 513s (a 25th anniversary with mahogany neck and one that was custom built in 2006 for a PRS artist with solid Brazilian neck) and love them all! This Private Stock would zero in on the features I really like on each of them. I like a guitar with excellent sustain, snappy attack, not too bright but enough going on to get strong pinch harmonics etc. and ideally with a tone that develops or 'blooms' as it sustains.

Cosmetically, it'll be charcoal cherry burst or burnt maple leaf, quilt maple top, standard birds, smoked black/gold hardware and macassar ebony headstock facing (and would probably request ebony fingerboard binding to match).

So... I'd be grateful for your thoughts on my specs, any input on neck wood choice to achieve the tonal goals, and any ideas if they will be able to accommodate my electronics ideas? Really appreciate it.

Cheers,
David

First of all: Interesting, that you defined the 513 as a basis for a Private Stock model.
According to your desired switching purposes it won't be a 513, but a HSH layouted PRS with a bunch of tonal options.
I like the simplicity of the ordinary two blade switch layout. You always know, where you are: Singlecoil, Clear Humbucking, Heavy Humbucking. All those micro switches will require more awareness.

Yes, the uprouting capability of the Tremonti is a worthwhile improvement.
To change the scale wouldn't be my choice. You will slightly reduce the general string tension.

But the electrical side is too sophisticated, than it would be stage approved. Let me share my experiences with a custom made guitar.
In 2013 a luthier built me a guitar with two humbuckers and a piezo bridge. The humbucker could be splitted, every humbucker has got - instead of a tone poti - a 6-way resonance frequencie rotary selector switch. There are two 3-way toggles: one for the humbuckers (bass, bass + treble, treble), one for selection among passive pickups only, passive pickups + piezo, piezo). In stochastic manner 217 sounds are possible. Do we hear actually the differences. I believe not.
I learned my lessons. The second custom made guitar came with a bass and treble pickup, 3-way-toggle, master volume, master tone, master low cut. (Honestly I asked for the opportunity to split each the pickups by a micro switch. But I don't use it.).
What I recommend is: Keep the 513 switching layout, but add a low/bass cut poti. This is something to color the tone effective, open full bloomy frequencies, rolled down Prusian modesty with mids and highs.

Regarding the neck: Haptically there is no difference between BRW and IRW.

 

[Bookface]

As others have said, it's less custom than it could be right now. I had 3 PS builds declined last year until I just gave up and ordered a custom shop strat instead. However, you never know until you ask. I went through GuitarGuitar in Newcastle and even spoke directly to Jez at PRS Europe to try and get something ordered but no dice.