Amp Transparency. It Was Once A Thing. Is It Still?

[László]

Around 2003, it seemed every damn thread on TGP was about how transparent certain amps were. "You can really hear the guitar." "The amp is so touch-sensitive." Et cetera.

I still think that way. It's one of the reasons I love my HXDA and DG30. They're transparent unless heavily overdriven. The tone of the instrument comes through. As one of my fantastic session players said of my HXDA, "Yes, you can hear the distortion, but you can also hear the guitar, plain as day!"

I love my Mesa Lone Star and Fillmore, but not as much as my PRS amps. They're simply not as transparent. Whether that's because they're circuit board amps, and the PRS amps mostly aren't. I can't say.

On the other hand, they sound very good, even though they tend to obscure some of what the guitar does - even clean. Granted, I know where I stand. I'm always going to prefer transparent amps (usually that means hand-wired but not always) to amps that filter the tone from the guitar more. So I don't need convincing.

As always, horses for courses. Sometimes you want it to be all about the amp, sometimes not. For me, usually not, but there are times I do want it to be about the amp. What are your thoughts about this?

I simply figured I'd start an interesting discussion that isn't amp-specific. Throw down, people. Let's have a chat.

 

[Simon Says]

I have no idea what a transparent-sounding amp (or transparent overdrive) is. I never understood that term. The way I set my amp, or any amp I did in the past, is; if I can't tell the attack separation on the strings if I strum one string after another, it means I have too much distortion. It was always a strings separation I was after. I don't mind lots of overdrive otherwise.

 

[sergiodeblanc]

Coming directly after my MkV I was taken aback by how much my old DG30 let the personalities of different guitars come through it, even with the same distortion pedal (in my case a Bogner Red) I could clearly hear their voices.

But… I kept the gain pretty low on it and the reverb is super subtle. It ultimately didn’t do all of what I want an amp to do, but if I wanted to afford a single tone item I would grab another.

 

[RickP]

I might have had it wrong all along, which wouldn’t be the first time, but I always thought of it as being able to hear the separation of individual notes, even through the distortion. The first time I remember clearly hearing it was when I got my first Boogie, a Mk III Simul Class. Not unrelated is the point that it is also the first time I had an amp with an EV12L in it. Everything had more definition. This was my introduction to “the speakers really do matter.”

A well made amplifier running through the right speakers can really shine in showing the character of your playing, and by that same effect, your guitar. Still, old cheap speakers in a blackface Super Reverb have a sound all their own… an amp sound that is, I guess, less transparent. Still cool, though.

I like either, but do notice that I play different on them based on that sound reproduction. I’m alright with that. It’s like wearing slacks and a sport coat or jeans and a t-shirt… you feel like there are things that are normal with each, and you both choose accordingly and behave according to the choice; if that makes sense at all. Alternately, sometimes rock climbing in a suit might get you the shock value you need.

But to Les’ query, yes, transparency is still a thing in my world and it’s the type amp I gravitate toward.

 

[dmatthews]

Doug Sewell is a wizard. It's why Paul hired him.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Coming directly after my MkV I was taken aback by how much my old DG30 let the personalities of different guitars come through it, even with the same distortion pedal (in case a Bogner Red) I could clearly hear their voices

THIS is what transparency is. The ability to clearly hear everything in the signal change and every little change you make. The ability to clearly hear the difference in two guitars that might be the same model but have slightly different pickups. Thinks like that. It’s a clarity, or… transparency, that allows everything else in front of it to be clear.

In general, the simpler the circuit, the more transparent. Many individual parts can also contribute to this, such as one cap vs another. And, again in very general terms, cleaner can be more transparent. While amps can have gain and still be transparent, but the more gain you add, the gain can obscure some of the clarity.

I might have had it wrong all along, which wouldn’t be the first time, but I always thought of it as being able to hear the separation of individual notes, even through the distortion.

This can be part of transparency, but is not the general definition of what transparency is. There are also some old classic amps, that can be very transparent, but can can get fuzzy when pushed, and this can cause a loss of transparency.

The rest of this, is general observations from the amps I’ve owned, played, built or modded, and much of it applies to pedals as well. I believe that as a general rule, all other things being equal (meaning parts quality, etc.) the simpler the circuit, the more transparent the amp is or can be. The more circuitry you add, whether it’s gain stages, tone stacks, etc., the more transparency you lose.

Things like switching through the pickup positions, rolling a tone control just a little, changing guitar cables (can opened. LOL) and all those things like that are just much more clearly audible, with a transparent amp.

I feel this is still one of the weak points of digital. I definitely hear a homogenization of these little things when using a modeler. And, even as much gain as it has, I think those little things are much more clearly audible through my Archon gain channel, than they were with the Mark V. Now, one look in the Mark V could make you “hear what you see” because the thing has ever thing you ever hear about that causes lack of transparency. It’s ALL in there! A metric crap ton of caps and resistors, relays, switches and…. RIBBON CABLES! All of it. Still, as much as I liked that amp (thought for years it was my dream amp) I A/B’d them for months before selling the Mark V.

 

[Runcible Gates]

Interesting topic Les. My (purely personal) take on this might be summarized as: "be careful what you wish for........"


I have nicely balanced pairs of both Two Rocks and Boogies: Custom Reverb Sig and LTD, and MkIIA and MkIIC+. My CRS has a clearer voice than the LTD, and the MkIIA has a similar relationship to the MkIIC+ in terms of "hearing all the way through".

I wouldn't say I prefer either end of these particular polarities, except in specific circumstances - in fact, I spend as much time using the two amps that define the mid-points between these pairs as I do at their extremes. That's to say, with my Two Rock Akoya and MkIIB Coliseum.

So no absolutes here in terms of ultimate preference..... it's all down to the musical setting.


One thing's sure, however - when I want to hear as little "fur" as possible at rational volumes, and using any of these amps, then the Custom Reverb Sig paired with a low-wind single-coil pickup seems to get nearest to that ideal.

And yet...... and yet........ I'm aware, even at that point, of some amp "editorializing": all I have to do is plug in my Hiwatt DR103, with no pedals in the chain, and I have to work a lot harder to get "music" out of the combination of amp and guitar.



So maybe there are "absolutes" that really do get all the way down to the bone, the "truth" of what's coming off the hands/guitar. Do I generally want such alarming clarity?

Speaking as a decent journeyman player - one who can use a little extra "padding" - the answer's mostly no

 

[Greywolf]

I'd agree with Les on the DG30 , and my Mesa Rosette (300 w 2 x 8 class D acoustic amp) both very lush and transparent inherently .
While it can be nice when an amp adds "character" , having a pure broad dynamic range amp gives you loads of options due to the headroom.

 

[Lewguitar]

I would say my Strats and Silver Skies have a much more glassy and transparent tone than my guitars with humbuckers.

But I'm unclear what transparent would mean with amps.

Maybe better note separation? A lack of muddiness? A sense of breath or spaceousness?

 

[dmatthews]

Transparency?
Nah... I can't see that...

 

[JasonE]

I am not sure I know what a transparent amp is. I just know that I either like or don't like how an amp sounds when I plug in and play clean or slightly broken. I tend to like Fender circuits. I don't know if those are transparent or not. I have played a hand wired modified Vibrolux circuit (Marsh Amps, The Springfield, with overlord mod) for 7+ years now. I just like the sound of 10" speakers. It took me a while to figure that out.

Another amp I have that I really like is a Friedman Twin Sister. I had never owned a Marshall circuit amp before this one. I like it a lot.

I have a couple other Fender amps and a couple of Peavey amps that I have used. The crunch channel on my Peavey JSX 2x12 combo is a great sound that I have used many times while gigging. I don't miss carrying the amp, it is heavy.

I am really liking the sound of my Kemper these days. I doubt that can pass for a transparent amp, although I have no idea if it would.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

You can have a very transparent amp (or where the term really originated, stereo gear) that does not have flat frequency response. Some of the old tube stereo gear was famous for incredible transparency... yet rolled off on the top and bottom. But what was there, was the (now vastly overused term) the very definition of glorious due to it's transparency.

But, you get into things like the mentioned frequency response differences, or how stiff or loose an amp is, and several other aspects, which CAN have a transparent amp, that doesn't sound as good, doesn't feel as good etc.

Many people will think a very clean, very flat, and very stiff amp is "transparent" but stiff and hard to play. Many times that is because it's not necessarily transparent, but is "sterile." I felt that way about the a lot of the Mesa clean tones. They weren't warm and vibey, they were more stiff and sterile. But that isn't transparency. The highs in particular on much of the Mesa stuff felt sterile, not warm. Crispy, not smooth. So, even on some of them that seemed more transparent, it still wasn't a "good" transparent.

 

[veinbuster]

I don’t know much about this stuff, or really most of the adjectives used to describe guitars and amps.

My take on what has been said so far though, is my setup on my Marks lets the guitar’s character through, and in doing so, let’s me express what I am feeling in the moment. My MDT dominates. It says what it wants to say...loudly and with extreme force.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

My MDT dominates. It says what it wants to say...loudly and with extreme force.

As long as you like what it's sayin' then that's ok, right?

 

[veinbuster]

As long as you like what it's sayin' then that's ok, right?

Exactly.

 

[Runcible Gates]

Keep in mind, there are many other aspects in play here, other than "just" transparency.

I'm not sure I needed the tutorial, but...... whatever.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Post Amended. I blame years of subscription to “The Absolute Sound” for my audiophile wannabe attitude problem.

(Although we all know that it’s really just a personality flaw )

 

[Runcible Gates]

Sure.

I've been doing this since 1976, so I'm not as amenable to being "educated" as some around here maybe. Call me thin-skinned, but you'd get the same response out of most decent players over the age of 55 I'd wager.

 

[RickP]

It’s all opinion, no need to take it one way or another. Like most words, transparency means whatever it means to you, and matters along the same lines!

Most of us have been playing a long time, and just like talking shop. Don‘t let it ruffle your feathers.

 

[JasonE]

Keep in mind, there are many other aspects in play here, other than "just" transparency. Some people think transparent means flat. It doesn't. You can have a very transparent amp (or where the term really originated, stereo gear) that does not have flat frequency response. Some of the old tube stereo gear was famous for incredible transparency... yet rolled off on the top and bottom. But what was there, was the (now vastly overused term) the very definition of glorious due to it's transparency.

But, you get into things like the mentioned frequency response differences, or how stiff or loose an amp is, and several other aspects, which CAN have a transparent amp, that doesn't sound as good, doesn't feel as good etc.

Also note, many people will think a very clean, very flat, and very stiff amp is "transparent" but stiff and hard to play. Many times that is because it's not necessarily transparent, but is "sterile." I felt that way about the a lot of the Mesa clean tones. They weren't warm and vibey, they were more stiff and sterile. But that isn't transparency. The highs in particular on much of the Mesa stuff felt sterile, not warm. Crispy, not smooth. So, even on some of them that seemed more transparent, it still wasn't a "good" transparent.

I have a Mesa Roadster and the 2x12 cabinet that was designed for it. I struggled with the cleans on that for a while. There are so many options on that amp that you can just about endlessly tweak it. I found that I liked the tweed setting on it the best. The first two channels are more clean and lighter/medium breakup based. Channels 3 and 4 are the melt your face channels. Another cool feature on it is that you can set it to use either a tube rectifier or solid state rectifier. That changes how stiff or squishy it feels.