NoisyDante
There’s a fine line between stupid and clever.
BingoI don’t want to be the one who gives it to someone with a weak immune system. I will continue to do whatever I can to prevent that.
BingoI don’t want to be the one who gives it to someone with a weak immune system. I will continue to do whatever I can to prevent that.
Amen Brother! This is exactly how I feel. I may be “old” but I’m healthy and relatively decent shape. If I feel I’ve done my part, then I’ve done what I can do. But if I infected someone else who didn’t survive, because I was some reble without a clue who wouldn’t do anything to protect others, then I don’t know how I could live with myself.I hate all of these statistics, but I suspect the Covid deaths is more accurate than the number contracted.
Regardless, not many things killed half a million people in one country last year. I said a year ago, and will say again: I don’t want to be the one who gives it to someone with a weak immune system. I will continue to do whatever I can to prevent that.
...I don’t want to be the one who gives it to someone with a weak immune system. I will continue to do whatever I can to prevent that.
Agreed. No sane, normal person would. But where does the liability end?
A mother tells her son to go to the store and get some laundry detergent and there is a car accident on the way and the son is killed. Is it the mother's fault? She will feel that it is. If she hadn't sent him to the store he would still be alive. Yet we rightfully tell this mother she can't look at it that way. It wasn't her fault.
At what point do we end liability for Covid? If no one had entered the USA from China from Jan 2020 till now, there would be no deaths from Covid. Who is to blame for the half million dead? China or the first couple guys that got off the planes? And who will be to blame for the next death? Those same couple guys or the neighbor that sneezed in the store last week? If someone unknowingly gives me Covid, they are not to blame. If I unknowingly give Covid to someone else, it is the same. Wear a mask? Sure, if you think it really will help. Stay home if I'm feeling ill? Absolutely. Take what I feel are unreasonable medical risks for what appear to be unreasonably low levels of success? No
According to the CDC there have been over 134 million people given the first dose. 40% of the US population. 26% have been given both shots (79 Million). Before the start of shots given to the general population the infection rate was about 60K a day. Since they started giving the shots the rate of infection is holding steady at about 75K a day. 15 thousand a day more than before the shots. So far (1 month in) the shot does not seem to help. That is not surprising since Moderna said it wouldn't stop infections. So getting the shot is not preventing you from giving Covid to someone with a weakened immune system. While it is commendable to want to protect others, getting the shot isn't doing that. If it does end up hurting your long term health, you took that risk for little gain.
Perhaps... But if I understand your argument correctly, you are saying that because they have gotten their shots, they are now less inclined to follow the restrictions and if they were following the guidelines the infection rate would be dropping as one would expect. That does make sense. But if that were true then the fact that the infection rate is not dropping, even though they have gotten their shots, means they must must still be contagious even though they have been given the shots. You prove my point.If the only thing different in that time frame was the shots, that argument might hold. But a lot of restrictions have been removed or lessened, and there are more people ignoring the restrictions because they've gotten their shots so they're invincible now.
I was under the possibly mistaken impression that European travelers brought the first wave.Agreed. No sane, normal person would. But where does the liability end?
A mother tells her son to go to the store and get some laundry detergent and there is a car accident on the way and the son is killed. Is it the mother's fault? She will feel that it is. If she hadn't sent him to the store he would still be alive. Yet we rightfully tell this mother she can't look at it that way. It wasn't her fault.
At what point do we end liability for Covid? If no one had entered the USA from China from Jan 2020 till now, there would be no deaths from Covid. Who is to blame for the half million dead? China or the first couple guys that got off the planes? And who will be to blame for the next death? Those same couple guys or the neighbor that sneezed in the store last week? If someone unknowingly gives me Covid, they are not to blame. If I unknowingly give Covid to someone else, it is the same. Wear a mask? Sure, if you think it really will help. Stay home if I'm feeling ill? Absolutely. Take what I feel are unreasonable medical risks for what appear to be unreasonably low levels of success? No
According to the CDC there have been over 134 million people given the first dose. 40% of the US population. 26% have been given both shots (79 Million). Before the start of shots given to the general population the infection rate was about 60K a day. Since they started giving the shots the rate of infection is holding steady at about 75K a day. 15 thousand a day more than before the shots. So far (1 month in) the shot does not seem to help. That is not surprising since Moderna said it wouldn't stop infections. So getting the shot is not preventing you from giving Covid to someone with a weakened immune system. While it is commendable to want to protect others, getting the shot isn't doing that. If it does end up hurting your long term health, you took that risk for little gain.
I wondered if we would need to clarify the origin point. I believe the cases on the east coast were indeed coming from Europe but the ones in LA and SanFan were from China. But whether the East coast cases made a prolonged (a few days) stop in Europe or not, they had to have originated from Wuhan. I was just abbreviating.I was under the possibly mistaken impression that European travelers brought the first wave.
Been wrong before though.
Out of curiosity, are you happy that I'm vaxxed? Feel safer around me if I am? Avoid me anyway?
Curious...
I hope your kids stay OK as well mate. Not worried about me in the long term as I'm on the downside of time left anyway.I wondered if we would need to clarify the origin point. I believe the cases on the east coast were indeed coming from Europe but the ones in LA and SanFan were from China. But whether the East coast cases made a prolonged (a few days) stop in Europe or not, they had to have originated from Wuhan. I was just abbreviating.
To your much more salient points. Do I feel safer around you? No. For 2 reasons. 1. I wouldn't feel unsafe around you if you didn't get it. 10% of the population have contracted the virus so far. 90% of those have recovered and are no longer contagious. So 1% of the population could make me sick. If I'm standing next to you I have a 1% chance of being exposed. 2. Pfizer and Moderna have said the shots do not protect against passing on the infection. If you believe them, your taking a risk of side effects does not lessen mine for exposure. Your last unanswered question is the most important. Am I happy you got vaxxed? No, I am saddened. Because I consider you a friend and I don't want to see you hurt by the vaccine (if it causes unintended consequences). Because you have, I hope I am wrong and there is nothing unknown with it. The same with my children who are in the health care industry and have gotten it. But time will tell.
Not to pile on Clash (which he doesn't seem to mind) but the ignorant comments about masks are also getting old. "If you can smell perfume, it means the mask doesn't help prevent the virus" is almost willfully ignorant. If you and I stand face to face with masks on, and you cough and sneeze repeatedly and I stand right in front of you breathing it, there is no question I could get it from you while we're both wearing masks. THIS DOES NOT MEAN MASKS DON'T WORK!
The initial wave of East Coast (particularly New York / New Jersey) originated from China. Tracers were able to track backwards to 3 individuals on an Air China flight that landed at Kennedy International in late February, early March of 2020. Additional infections were brought into the area from Europe by members of a religious sect that refused to comply with stay at home orders. Several factors allowed the rapid spread of the disease:I wondered if we would need to clarify the origin point. I believe the cases on the east coast were indeed coming from Europe but the ones in LA and SanFan were from China. But whether the East coast cases made a prolonged (a few days) stop in Europe or not, they had to have originated from Wuhan. I was just abbreviating.
To your much more salient points. Do I feel safer around you? No. For 2 reasons. 1. I wouldn't feel unsafe around you if you didn't get it. 10% of the population have contracted the virus so far. 90% of those have recovered and are no longer contagious. So 1% of the population could make me sick. If I'm standing next to you I have a 1% chance of being exposed. 2. Pfizer and Moderna have said the shots do not protect against passing on the infection. If you believe them, your taking a risk of side effects does not lessen mine for exposure. Your last unanswered question is the most important. Am I happy you got vaxxed? No, I am saddened. Because I consider you a friend and I don't want to see you hurt by the vaccine (if it causes unintended consequences). Because you have, I hope I am wrong and there is nothing unknown with it. The same with my children who are in the health care industry and have gotten it. But time will tell.
the "if you can smell perfume" comment was made by me.
Perhaps... But if I understand your argument correctly, you are saying that because they have gotten their shots, they are now less inclined to follow the restrictions and if they were following the guidelines the infection rate would be dropping as one would expect. That does make sense. But if that were true then the fact that the infection rate is not dropping, even though they have gotten their shots, means they must must still be contagious even though they have been given the shots. You prove my point.
Interesting point. Let's watch what happens.It's pretty clear in the Chicagoland area that case increases are linked to in person learning having started back up. There are hundreds of kids in the area that are currently in quarantine. No one under 16 can get a shot, yet. And 16+ just opened up Monday.
Want to hear true genius at work? Here goes. I had this idea a year ago when this thing had just kicked in full steam.
I told my wife 2 things that needed to happen. 1) we needed an air filtration system that would remove the virus from the air. At the time, ultraviolet light was supposed to be very effective. I told her that any place people congregate, would need to had ultraviolet filtration systems added to their HVAC systems.
Second one is probably tougher than that for existing structures, but should become a standard in new ones. All incoming air to a space should be brought in from the ground level, and all "return" air should be pulled out of the room at the ceiling. And, the fans would need to run fulltime, at least until this virus is gone.
This would actively pull the infected air up and out of the breathing range/height our heads are, and would remove the virus from the air. Two steps, change the world. I'm going to need a million dollars to patent this and get a startup going. Anyone want to lend me some coin?
Thanks Pete. Haven’t thought much about myself over the past year because there are so many more compromised people. But as a crap lottery winner in a few regards, it seemed a bad idea to thumb my nose at obscure statistics. “What are the chances of...blah blah blah?” Guess what? I’ve weighed those odds a couple of times in my life and not come up on the winning side. On the flip side of that coin, despite the insurmountable odds, I’ve survived them both. It would be a terrible shame to erase those wins with the inconsideration of a neigh-sayer. Now, if they came up and just coughed on me, at least I’d have the gratification of a throat-punch response. I’ve still got the gumption and agility to make that happen.Regardless, not many things killed half a million people in one country last year. I said a year ago, and will say again: I don’t want to be the one who gives it to someone with a weak immune system. I will continue to do whatever I can to prevent that.
Dang it, there goes my Private Stock.I hope you make millions! It is a good idea but it's already done in industry. You will be proliferating it in living spaces. We do this now with clean room air but we actually do it in the reverse direction. The air is brought in from the upper portion of the room and it is pulled out through the floor. This lets gravity help you and it keeps the unwanted particles as low in the room as possible. Dust and lint from shoes and clothes does not have to be pushed out against gravity.
Want to hear true genius at work? Here goes. I had this idea a year ago when this thing had just kicked in full steam.
I told my wife 2 things that needed to happen. 1) we needed an air filtration system that would remove the virus from the air. At the time, ultraviolet light was supposed to be very effective. I told her that any place people congregate, would need to had ultraviolet filtration systems added to their HVAC systems.
Second one is probably tougher than that for existing structures, but should become a standard in new ones. All incoming air to a space should be brought in from the ground level, and all "return" air should be pulled out of the room at the ceiling. And, the fans would need to run fulltime, at least until this virus is gone.
This would actively pull the infected air up and out of the breathing range/height our heads are, and would remove the virus from the air. Two steps, change the world. I'm going to need a million dollars to patent this and get a startup going. Anyone want to lend me some coin?