wiring a music room

kmiko

New Member
Joined
Feb 26, 2018
Messages
33
Hi all.
I'm rewiring a small room that I plan to use for my music space, and I'm wondering if anybody has any advice for proper wiring, to avoid potential issues with noise, humms, and buzzes coming through my amp, due to improper grounding issues, etc. I plan to have an isolated circuit just for my guitar amp and pedals.
Any thoughts, considerations, or advice is appreciated.
Thanks!
 
Hi all.
I'm rewiring a small room that I plan to use for my music space, and I'm wondering if anybody has any advice for proper wiring, to avoid potential issues with noise, humms, and buzzes coming through my amp, due to improper grounding issues, etc. I plan to have an isolated circuit just for my guitar amp and pedals.
Any thoughts, considerations, or advice is appreciated.
Thanks!

It’s similar to wiring a studio, something I’ve done. A lot depends on budget and how much power you need. For lowest hum and noise, an isolation transformer that converts standard AC to balanced power will reduce hum and noise by about 8-12 dB.

There are installed, wall-mounted isolation transformer systems from companies like Equi-Tech, and there are also rack-mounted isolation transformer systems from Equi-Tech and Furman, possibly others. A tech can also modify something like a Sola isolation transformer, but it’s very expensive, and the transformer will need its own soundproof location. I’ve done this, and it was a PITA, but at the time these other units weren’t on the market.

Balanced AC power reduces noise using the same principles as humbuckers and balanced audio lines.

The main advantage, beyond cleaning up the signal fed by the power company, is that the noise cancelling resulting from balanced AC also means a significant reduction in noise generated from power cords into adjacent signal cables.

These systems are FAR different from mere AC “conditioners” and filters. When my first one was installed in my studio 15 or so years ago, my tech measured an 11 dB reduction in noise on the oscilloscope. Yes, actual science and testing confirmed the facts.

As I said, if you do this, get one that makes enough juice for your gear, call the manufacturer, ask questions. Both Furman and Equi-Tech have knowledgeable techs who’re actually helpful.

So that’s the ideal situation. It’s also not a cheap solution.

And you still need to pay attention to good grounding, because balanced AC doesn’t cure ground loops. It just makes things quieter once you’ve got everything else wired properly.

There are cheaper solutions that don’t involve balanced AC, that will also help even if you go balanced AC down the road! And you may not need a dedicated AC line to your room, although that certainly is not a bad idea! Here are a few:

Use a good power supply with your pedals, with isolated outlets, such as the Voodoo Labs stuff. I like the V-L over the Strymon I also had because it has a transformer. I had switching noise issues with my Strymon, and went back to Voodoo. I’m sure there are other good ones, but bottom line is true isolated, regulated outlets on the pedal power supply. If you can avoid using wall-warts, do so. They generate lots of hums and buzzes that your cables and some pedals will pick up, and send along to other gear.

Use good quality, low capacitance, shielded cables, especially near AC power cords. The shielding matters, and you can find plenty of information on the types of shielding, their pros and cons, on the web.

With my own amps, I also use a product from Furman that has a power reservoir that delivers juice faster to the amps, and improves the sound of higher powered amps. It’s less noticeable on lower powered amps. After a ridiculous amount of experimentation, I found that AC cords matter. I think that the most important thing is the wire gauge, however the ones I use are also shielded. Unbalanced lines used in guitar gear will pick up noise radiated from unshielded AC cables. In any case, the heavier AC cables have made a difference on my amps, and I’m so convinced by this surprising and counter-intuitive experience, that I now power every piece of gear in my studio with cords like these, and am getting my best recorded sound in the last 30 years, with the least noise.

Now, if you don’t want to go down a very deep and expensive rabbit hole, and your livelihood doesn’t depend on recording, please, disregard a lot of the above unless you have serious AC power problems!

The most important difference is made simply by paying attention to powering your pedals properly, and grounding. If you have signal going to more than one amp, make sure that one signal line is properly ground- isolated from the other. There are plenty of little problem-solver boxes from companies like Lehle that are sonically transparent, for lots of these grounding issues. If you use effects loops on your amps, this is doubly important!

Finally, most AC “conditioner” products are a waste of money. They can’t solve grounding issues. They don’t isolate the line from AC noise. They don’t regulate the AC power. There are good units that do this (though they don’t solve ground loop issues), from pro companies like Furman, but the useful ones are at the upper end of their product lines, and the cheaper ones are just outlet boxes with lights (not that there’s anything wrong with an outlet box with lights, if that’s what you need!).

Hope this helps!
 
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It’s similar to wiring a studio, something I’ve done. A lot depends on budget and how much power you need. For lowest hum and noise, an isolation transformer that converts standard AC to balanced power will reduce hum and noise by about 8-12 dB.

There are installed, wall-mounted isolation transformer systems from companies like Equi-Tech, and there are also rack-mounted isolation transformer systems from Equi-Tech and Furman, possibly others. A tech can also modify something like a Sola isolation transformer, but it’s very expensive, and the transformer will need its own soundproof location. I’ve done this, and it was a PITA, but at the time these other units weren’t on the market.

Balanced AC power reduces noise using the same principles as humbuckers and balanced audio lines.

The main advantage, beyond cleaning up the signal fed by the power company, is that the noise cancelling resulting from balanced AC also means a significant reduction in noise generated from power cords into adjacent signal cables.

These systems are FAR different from mere AC “conditioners” and filters. When my first one was installed in my studio 15 or so years ago, my tech measured an 11 dB reduction in noise on the oscilloscope. Yes, actual science and testing confirmed the facts.

As I said, if you do this, get one that makes enough juice for your gear, call the manufacturer, ask questions. Both Furman and Equi-Tech have knowledgeable techs who’re actually helpful.

So that’s the ideal situation. It’s also not a cheap solution.

And you still need to pay attention to good grounding, because balanced AC doesn’t cure ground loops. It just makes things quieter once you’ve got everything else wired properly.

There are cheaper solutions that don’t involve balanced AC, that will also help even if you go balanced AC down the road! And you may not need a dedicated AC line to your room, although that certainly is not a bad idea! Here are a few:

Use a good power supply with your pedals, with isolated outlets, such as the Voodoo Labs stuff. I like the V-L over the Strymon I also had because it has a transformer. I had switching noise issues with my Strymon, and went back to Voodoo. I’m sure there are other good ones, but bottom line is true isolated, regulated outlets on the pedal power supply. If you can avoid using wall-warts, do so. They generate lots of hums and buzzes that your cables and some pedals will pick up, and send along to other gear.

Use good quality, low capacitance, shielded cables, especially near AC power cords. The shielding matters, and you can find plenty of information on the types of shielding, their pros and cons, on the web.

With my own amps, I also use a product from Furman that has a power reservoir that delivers juice faster to the amps, and improves the sound of higher powered amps. It’s less noticeable on lower powered amps. After a ridiculous amount of experimentation, I found that AC cords matter. I think that the most important thing is the wire gauge, however the ones I use are also shielded. Unbalanced lines used in guitar gear will pick up noise radiated from unshielded AC cables. In any case, the heavier AC cables have made a difference on my amps, and I’m so convinced by this surprising and counter-intuitive experience, that I now power every piece of gear in my studio with cords like these, and am getting my best recorded sound in the last 30 years, with the least noise.

Now, if you don’t want to go down a very deep and expensive rabbit hole, and your livelihood doesn’t depend on recording, please, disregard a lot of the above unless you have serious AC power problems!

The most important difference is made simply by paying attention to powering your pedals properly, and grounding. If you have signal going to more than one amp, make sure that one signal line is properly ground- isolated from the other. There are plenty of little problem-solver boxes from companies like Lehle that are sonically transparent, for lots of these grounding issues. If you use effects loops on your amps, this is doubly important!

Finally, most AC “conditioner” products are a waste of money. They can’t solve grounding issues. They don’t isolate the line from AC noise. They don’t regulate the AC power. There are good units that do this, from pro companies like Furman, but the useful ones are at the upper end of their product lines, and the cheaper ones are just outlet boxes with lights (not that there’s anything wrong with an outlet box with lights, if that’s what you need!).

Hope this helps!


The voice of experience and reason...thanks for this explanation Les!
 
Hope this helps![/QUOTE]

Wow, thanks for all that!
What do you think of using heavier gauge wire for the plugs to the panel? For example, I was only going to go with a 15 amp circuit for my guitar amp. Some one else suggested using 12/2 wire instead of 14/2. Or would it be better to just go with a 20 amp circuit, instead of the 15?
Thanks again!
 
Wow, thanks for all that!
What do you think of using heavier gauge wire for the plugs to the panel? For example, I was only going to go with a 15 amp circuit for my guitar amp. Some one else suggested using 12/2 wire instead of 14/2. Or would it be better to just go with a 20 amp circuit, instead of the 15?
Thanks again!

My AC is wired with typical Romex. I use a 15 amp circuit, but in my old, larger studio with a TON of analog gear, and a 64 input console, I had 20 amps going, and in that studio had to have a special star-grounding block with a true earth ground. Every circumstance is different.

If all you’re running is a small number of guitar amps, it isn’t necessary to do all that. I wouldn’t.

Edit: Maybe consider it if you’re running 1000 Watt PA Fly Rigs in your room, with a stack of 500 Watt bass amps. ;)
 
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One of the biggest mistakes people make when wiring a new room for anything (den, living room, kitchen, studio, playroom...) is to underestimate the number of outlets needed and the total amperage.

1. Install 20amp circuits. The marginal cost over 15 amp circuits is negligible for the benefit. Use more than one, and alternate them along the wall.

2. Consider using the same “phase” for every circuit in the room. In the typical breaker box, that will be every other breaker vertically.

3. Install twice as many outlets as you think you need. Really.

4. Install quad outlets at each outlet location. Avoid plug-in 6 way extenders, especially ones with built in “filter and surge protection” like the plague.

5. Avoid fluorescent lights or anything with a transformer like tensor lights or turn them off when recording.

6. Spend as much on Les’ power conditioning tips above as you can afford.

My basement studio thread:
https://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/new-basement-studio.1413/
 
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On a different note, if I were seriously into recording and such, I think I'd consider running 1" conduits in the walls, also...from where the control center (desk) sits, and the location of the speaker cabinets (usually across the room, or in an isolated area).
Might seem silly, but if you want to control your cabinets from an amp head on opposite side of the room, it might look cleaner without the speaker cables crossing the floor...although it might add length (noise) to your speaker cables. (Again, just a thought)
 
I like the ideas re: lots of outlets and the conduit. If, however, you’re using a rackmount isolation transformer to power all the audio gear, you’ll need fewer wall outlets. Still, it never, ever hurts to have more outlets than you need, because you then have lots of flexibility in putting non-audio stuff wherever you need to, eliminating the need for extension cords.

As a person who has a room that was already wired, I wish I had more outlets!

If you’re going to be in a smaller room, and won’t be setting up your amp heads next to a desk a la Tim Pierce, it may not make sense to run speaker cable conduit.
 
One of the biggest mistakes people make when wiring a new room for anything (den, living room, kitchen, studio, playroom...) is to underestimate the number of outlets needed and the total amperage.

1. Install 20amp circuits. The marginal cost over 15 amp circuits is negligible for the benefit. Use more than one, and alternate them along the wall.

2. Consider using the same “phase” for every circuit in the room. In the typical breaker box, that will be every other breaker vertically.

3. Install twice as many outlets as you think you need. Really.

4. Install quad outlets at each outlet location. Avoid plug-in 6 way extenders, especially ones with built in “filter and surge protection” like the plague.

5. Avoid fluorescent lights or anything with a transformer like tensor lights or turn them off when recording.

6. Spend as much on Les’ power conditioning tips above as you can afford.

My basement studio thread:
https://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/new-basement-studio.1413/

I don't remember seeing that thread before...great job!
 
One of the biggest mistakes people make when wiring a new room for anything (den, living room, kitchen, studio, playroom...) is to underestimate the number of outlets needed and the total amperage.

1. Install 20amp circuits. The marginal cost over 15 amp circuits is negligible for the benefit. Use more than one, and alternate them along the wall.

2. Consider using the same “phase” for every circuit in the room. In the typical breaker box, that will be every other breaker vertically.

3. Install twice as many outlets as you think you need. Really.

4. Install quad outlets at each outlet location. Avoid plug-in 6 way extenders, especially ones with built in “filter and surge protection” like the plague.

5. Avoid fluorescent lights or anything with a transformer like tensor lights or turn them off when recording.

6. Spend as much on Les’ power conditioning tips above as you can afford.

My basement studio thread:
https://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/new-basement-studio.1413/

I don't remember seeing that thread before...great job!

Neither do I. Concur! Nice job!
 
I can't add to the conversation inside the house; but I sure can outside. I had a miserable amount of noise coming into my house that wasn't noticed until I bought a higher gain amp. I actually did video clips and sent them in to show what was happening on the gain channel, and sent the amp back for repair. I ran power into the room from a separate breaker, re-grounded outlets throughout the house, etc. The power company even came out with special equipment to try and locate the noise after I contacted them. Luckily, the tech did work with churches and auditoriums just for sound reinforcement. When he came to my house and heard what was going on, he knew it wasn't right. They traced things to a step-down transformer a block away that serviced 6 other houses and a traffic signal. They said that the nature of A/C is such that a problem in someone else's house can feed back into the line, and cause noise down the line. They tried to get rid of the noise, but were only mildly successful.
This past August, I was the happy recipient of a new pole behind my house, with its own step-down transformer that services only me and my two neighbors. I took pictures of it being done, I was so happy. No cost, either. They determined the issue was theirs and did it as normal maintenance and upgrades. Clean power from the source is crucial.
Just something to think about if things don't seem as quiet in your new room as they should be.
 
When our house was being built I asked for outlets on every other, or every third stud...not so I could plug a bunch of stuff in, but so I never had to run an extension cord. Outlets are cheap, and I don't have to think about outlets when I lay things out.
 
Since we are talking about Vac, I have a story to share. We all know about single coil pickups and the buzz they pickup. Over time my guitars with single coil
pickups were picking up the buzz more and more. Since I wanted to do some wiring changes, I called in an electrician. I told him about the problem with the buzz. He inspected the panel and found 4 breakers that had bad connections between the panel and breaker. Sparks were flying when the current draw went up. Changed out the breakers and no more buzz. Yes, my panel is 50 years old. Something to think about if the buzz is bad.
 
Since we are talking about Vac, I have a story to share. We all know about single coil pickups and the buzz they pickup. Over time my guitars with single coil
pickups were picking up the buzz more and more. Since I wanted to do some wiring changes, I called in an electrician. I told him about the problem with the buzz. He inspected the panel and found 4 breakers that had bad connections between the panel and breaker. Sparks were flying when the current draw went up. Changed out the breakers and no more buzz. Yes, my panel is 50 years old. Something to think about if the buzz is bad.
THAT sounds scary! Glad you didn’t have a fire!
 
Since we are talking about Vac, I have a story to share. We all know about single coil pickups and the buzz they pickup. Over time my guitars with single coil
pickups were picking up the buzz more and more. Since I wanted to do some wiring changes, I called in an electrician. I told him about the problem with the buzz. He inspected the panel and found 4 breakers that had bad connections between the panel and breaker. Sparks were flying when the current draw went up. Changed out the breakers and no more buzz. Yes, my panel is 50 years old. Something to think about if the buzz is bad.

Additionally, when I was helping my wife light up (what felt like) the entire frickin neighborhood with Christmas lights, I heard a strange sizzling sound coming from my fuse panel. Called an electrician buddy, and he came over, and tightened and reset a few circuit breakers, and tightened down a few ground wires to the grounding bar. He stated sometimes these things work loose (arcing)...was news to me. Was kinda scary hearing those noises, too.
 
I have had excellent results with these: https://www.brickwall.com/products/eight-outlet-audio-surge-protector
I dont used them at home on my amp, but I use it for scientific grade sound measurement equipment (National Instruments) where my data signal is down in the milli-volt range.
Main items I have seen add noise to a circuit are:
flourescent lights
compact flourescent lights (even worse)
wall warts
battery chargers/inverters
regular surge protectors - not even plugged into it, just having one on the same circuit
computer monitors
it is also likeley that an electric motor (desk fan, hair dryer etc.) on the same circuit will introduce electrical noise
 
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