Found my lost Oktava microphones...

[Moondog Wily]

My Focusrite will show up today. Then I can get to work setting things up. I like that clean look in the above photos. No mixer cluttering things up in a small room.

With my lack of recent experience tho, I'm still second guessing myself on whether I should have gotten a mixer with a 4 X 4 USB interface, like this little Allen and Heath?

https://www.allen-heath.com/ahproducts/zed-10fx/

Would that have made the Focusrite unnecessary?

Yes, that would have made the Focusrite unnecessary and given you additional options on how to mix/adjust your stuff going into the computer. In defense of the Scarlett, you have two headphone outputs on that 18i8, whereas the board in your link appears to have only one headphone out. Also, some may argue that the Scarlett may sound better but without comparing them side by side, I could not say.

You will be fine with the Scarlett. The only thing I see as a possibility is you adding a small mix board to get additional mic inputs if necessary. With that Scarlett, you have 4, with the board you listed, you would have 4, with the board I recommended, you would have had 4, but that may not be enough and that is the only time I would see you adding a small board in addition to the Scarlett. My Tascam Model 12 has 6 mic inputs (12 channel board) and that is enough for me and my needs, but I would have been making some tough routing decisions at times if I had 4 mic inputs instead. Give a jingle if you want to talk ;~))

 

[DISTORT6]

Could I ask where they were?

I tore the garage apart several times searching for them and then my girlfriend went out to the garage and came back in five minutes with them. And with a huge picture book about Ireland too. I told her she could keep the book!

So Joe Bob, we’ve been waiting to see what you found when you went looking into your garage…

 

[László]

So Joe Bob, we’ve been waiting to see what you found when you went looking into your garage…

I'm sorry, but according to the Official Rules of Stuff, Rule II, Paragraph Two, once an item moves from 'in the house' to 'out in the garage', that's it.

The item is thereby permanently disqualified from re-entry into the indoor space, though it may be used in the context of a garage band.

However, under certain circumstances and with adequate proof, "I moved and put it in the wrong box," can be grounds for an exemption, though sub-paragraph (c) does state that if an item was placed in a garbage bag, it must stay in the garage or be sold at a garage sale.

In the event of sale, it must also be labeled, "California Warning: This Package Contains Items That Were Left Out In The Garage."

I wish I had better news.

Items stored in basements are eligible for re-entry upstairs, unless the basement flooded to the level the item was stored at.

 

[DISTORT6]

I'm sorry, but according to the Official Rules of Stuff, Rule II, Paragraph Two, once an item moves from 'in the house' to 'out in the garage', that's it.

The item is thereby permanently disqualified from re-entry into the indoor space, though it may be used in the context of a garage band.

However, under certain circumstances and with adequate proof, "I moved and put it in the wrong box," can be grounds for an exemption, though sub-paragraph (c) does state that if an item was placed in a garbage bag, it must stay in the garage or be sold at a garage sale.

In the event of sale, it must also be labeled, "California Warning: This Package Contains Items That Were Left Out In The Garage."

I wish I had better news.

Items stored in basements are eligible for re-entry upstairs, unless the basement flooded to the level the item was stored at.

And to think that I thought Joe Bob’s question was strange…

 

[Lewguitar]

My girlfriend is a little OCD. I can't hide anything. She notices everything!

"Is that an empty guitar box hidden behind the water heater?"

"Yeah. It's been there a while."

"Yeah...sure it has."

Then she just laughs!

 

[Lewguitar]

Yes, that would have made the Focusrite unnecessary and given you additional options on how to mix/adjust your stuff going into the computer. In defense of the Scarlett, you have two headphone outputs on that 18i8, whereas the board in your link appears to have only one headphone out. Also, some may argue that the Scarlett may sound better but without comparing them side by side, I could not say.

You will be fine with the Scarlett. The only thing I see as a possibility is you adding a small mix board to get additional mic inputs if necessary. With that Scarlett, you have 4, with the board you listed, you would have 4, with the board I recommended, you would have had 4, but that may not be enough and that is the only time I would see you adding a small board in addition to the Scarlett. My Tascam Model 12 has 6 mic inputs (12 channel board) and that is enough for me and my needs, but I would have been making some tough routing decisions at times if I had 4 mic inputs instead. Give a jingle if you want to talk ;~))

I do need some help and advice and would love to talk again today. I'll give you a few hours tho.

You, Prina, Les and some others have been very helpful.

The Focusrite did not show up yesterday. Some Tusq guitar nuts I ordered showed up from Sweetwater instead.

It'll be here middle of next week. Thinking the Allen and Heath mixer with 4 x 4 ADT is about the same cost as the Focusrite and the ability to turn knobs (as usual) might serve me better. Or not.

But I can sure return the Focusrite unopened (I'll miss out on the Tootsie Rolls and Bit-A-Honey candy tho!) and get a modern mixer.

Looking at this one from Tascam: https://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro...h1VweMUhiTMjsWc7w94IizIklGgLYXCBoC-nYQAvD_BwE

Seems like little home studio technology, like everything, changes dramatically for the better every few years and what was "cutting edge" just last year is no longer.

For those of us who grew up in the 50's and 60's it's a steep learning curve.

 

[Prina]

At some point you'll need to actually open a box and connect an interface via USB to your computer. At least if you want to record anything.

The reason that I recommended Focusrite, in addition to personal experience with a couple of their units, is that lots of folks recommend them. They're one of the biggest selling brands for a reason. In addition to the quality of the hardware including the preamps one of the big benefits is that their software is also really good, not glitchy, and works well with many systems. You'll find out the value of having software that works and good documentation, especially in a Windows setting, when you get software/drivers that doesn't work and which can be a massive pain even for those of us that are pretty far up on the learning curve. Also, and the reasons that I originally sent you my unit were that you could get some experience getting up on the learning curve easily that I'm familiar with the unit and the software and so am much better able to help you out with problems compared to something that I have no experience with.

But more than anything, just try something out. Check with the vendors to see if there's a penalty for opening a box.

These various audio interfaces/mixers are like your Bernies: each is different but you really can't appreciate them until you start playing them and then you can work on getting the best out of them. And you have folks here that are willing to help.

 

[Moondog Wily]

I do need some help and advice and would love to talk again today. I'll give you a few hours tho.

You, Prina, Les and some others have been very helpful.

The Focusrite did not show up yesterday. Some Tusq guitar nuts I ordered showed up from Sweetwater instead.

It'll be here middle of next week. Thinking the Allen and Heath mixer with 4 x 4 ADT is about the same cost as the Focusrite and the ability to turn knobs (as usual) might serve me better. Or not.

But I can sure return the Focusrite unopened (I'll miss out on the Tootsie Rolls and Bit-A-Honey candy tho!) and get a modern mixer.

Looking at this one from Tascam: https://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro...h1VweMUhiTMjsWc7w94IizIklGgLYXCBoC-nYQAvD_BwE

Seems like little home studio technology, like everything, changes dramatically for the better every few years and what was "cutting edge" just last year is no longer.

For those of us who grew up in the 50's and 60's it's a steep learning curve.

Call any time! That mixer you linked to (Tascam Model 12) is the one I currently use and I really like it! As Prina said, helping you with stuff we already own gives us a leg up on making sure you can get it right, so if you do get that mixer, I know a LOT about it. Been using it for 3 years now I believe and have explored most of it's possibilities!!

 

[László]

And to think that I thought Joe Bob’s question was strange…

I'm all about getting my strange on.

 

[László]

Looking at this one from Tascam: https://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro...h1VweMUhiTMjsWc7w94IizIklGgLYXCBoC-nYQAvD_BwE

I like Tascam gear, always have. But...

Check the length on those faders before buying. I find anything less than a full-size fader isn't accurate/fine enough for serious work (I think that's usually 100mm for full-size).

Small size faders drive me up a wall. Impossible to mix with, everything has to be redone over and over just to get an accurate setting. An unacceptable compromise for anyone used to the accuracy of real gear. You can only estimate your setting.

Small faders are also generally not very smooth in operation.

I'd rather use a track pad and a computer. YMMV. Often I use Logic Remote running on my iPad with its large virtual faders.

I think Tascam makes a similar unit with full-size faders that would make mixing a lot more accurate.

I'd also point out that there's an awful lot of hardware and mic preamps on that thing for a very low price. One wonders what compromises were made to bring it in for that kind of money. With the focusrite you're paying for less stuff, but probably better stuff in terms of the mic preamps and converters.

 

[Lewguitar]

This is the one Moondog Wily uses and I think this is the one that will work best for me too.

Good enough for Pete Thorn.

Good enough for my simple needs.

When the Focusrite arrives should I just return it? To be honest, if I don't need it I'd like to put the money towards something else I DO need.

Call any time! That mixer you linked to (Tascam Model 12) is the one I currently use and I really like it! As Prina said, helping you with stuff we already own gives us a leg up on making sure you can get it right, so if you do get that mixer, I know a LOT about it. Been using it for 3 years now I believe and have explored most of it's possibilities!!

 

[László]

Good enough for Pete Thorn.

Don't kid yourself.

Pete's demos are done with a Mac, running through two $3K (each) linked UA Apollo interfaces, into his DAW, which is either Logic or Pro Tools. His studio monitors are a $7,000 pair of Barefoot Micro-Main monitors. The wood desk his stuff sits on, by Argosy, costs $2200 (great studio desk, by the way).

His outboard gear, including mic preamps, is of comparably high quality, and he has enough of it to do the work professionally.

He works 'in the box' not through a mixer, though he may have one as a side car for guitar effects.

He's not working on the cheap. He's a well paid professional.

He does not do his projects via the Tascam unit, no matter what they pay him to review it (he does get paid - as he should).

But you aren't Pete, who's making a living with studio demos, so definitely get what you think will work for you. As long as you know the pros and cons of a piece of gear, go for it!

I have 32 years of broadcast music and audio post recording experience, and use (and own or have owned) a lot of the gear Pete uses, so I recognize it. I'm merely trying to help.

 

[Prina]

if I don't need it I'd like to put the money towards something else I DO need.

You don't need both, either one will get you there. Lots of overlap in functionality and definitely other, better, uses for funds.

Moondog vouching for the unit would carry a lot of weight with me having heard his results.. In fact I'm considering trying out those Rattlesnake monitor cables that he recommends (open to Laszlo's opinion too, as always )

 

[Moondog Wily]

This is the one Moondog Wily uses and I think this is the one that will work best for me too.

Good enough for Pete Thorn.

Good enough for my simple needs.

When the Focusrite arrives should I just return it? To be honest, if I don't need it I'd like to put the money towards something else I DO need.

I think you will be happy with the Tascam Model 12. It is a mix of old school (sliders, knobs) and new school technology (digital interface, bluetooth capabilities, built in effects, SD card recording built into board). He mentions in the video that these are 60mm sliders rather than the 100mm sliders László mentioned above. I have never had an issue with them, but if you are used to 100mm sliders, I can understand some of the issues some may have with these. Considering what you are trying to do (vocal, back up vocal, guitar and percussion) and the quality level you are expecting (home studio), I personally think you will be fine (and as László said, Thorn is not using this for his projects).

Thorn does mention that he is NOT using it as an interface, but is instead recording directly to the SD Card. I wish he would have covered some of the connection to the DAW, but it is not difficult and I can not imagine the difference in sound quality would be anything you will be picking up on if any even exists. I have used it both ways and have been happy with the results of each, but have never done any direct comparisons.

You can return the Scarlett 18i8 unopened! It will be of no use to you considering the I/O capabilities of this board. Would the 18i8 sound slightly better to some professionals? Perhaps. Will it make a difference in what you are trying to do? I would say no but could not say for sure unless I were to compare them side by side with a nice set of test equipment in addition to my ears.

If you are going to choose to use the on board recorder, you will need to buy and SD card as the Model 12 does not come with one (at least mine did not). If you are not going to record on the board itself, then you do not need an SD card. As mentioned above, I have used it this way and was happy with the results, especially when I would have my rack in a room away from my main computer. The SD card you will need should be Class 10 or greater. Let me know if you need some links to SD cards to consider.

Not sure what USB inputs your Lennovo has, but if it is all USB C (some modern computers are going this route), then you will either need a USB C to USB C cable or a USB A to USB C adapter to fit onto the supplied cable. If you have USB A inputs on your Lennovo, you should be all set and not need any additional cables. The unit will come with a USB A to USB C cable.

This unit will give you a LOT of options for both input and output. For example, without even hooking up to a computer, you will be able to output to two pair of headphones, each with their own volume knobs, main out and aux out to run to speakers or PA (each with their own slider for output level). Hook it up to a computer and you then have all those options PLUS all channels going to the computer, and then you could do what you please with the output from the computer (additional headphones, speakers, etc.). Note that input channels 11 and 12 are from a 1/8" stereo input jack, so utilizing those channels is difficult from 1/4" or XLR cables unless you have the necessary adapters, but you should not need them.

Give a call or write with any questions, happy to help ;~))

Congrats and cheers! Looking forward to hearing your material!!!

 

[Moondog Wily]

One more thing! Prina mentioned a few posts back, it is time to get down to business and actually try to record something with these units!! He and I are going to be crackin' the whip on you regarding this!!!

 

[Lewguitar]

One more thing! Prina mentioned a few posts back, it is time to get down to business and actually try to record something with these units!! He and I are going to be crackin' the whip on you regarding this!!!

Sounds good. I think I made the right choice. I've owned Tascam mixer and gear before.

Made a false start with the little Portacapture device, but I think I'm on track now and it'll be smooth sailing.

Anxious to get started,

I really want to share some of my new tunes with you guys.

Show ya all I can do more than just swap pickups!

 

[László]

An observation about the higher-end pro gear vs the consumer gear: It's all about context.

It's worth the extra money if you're getting paid or have money to burn. If neither thing applies to you, you don't sacrifice much with current consumer stuff.

If you're recording a $3500 mic, sure, you'll hear the difference running it through a $1500 mic pre, as opposed to an interface or consumer mixer, provided you have good monitors or headphones to hear the difference in the first place.

If your clients are in a million dollar studio listening to your work on the mains monitors during an audio post session - my clients often do this - they're going to be disappointed unless it sounds f^ckin' great, so the money invested is worth it. It's commensurate with client budgets. Paying clients have expectations that must be met.

If you're doing stuff to play for friends, it's perfectly fine not to get carried away. Just buy the stuff you like and get on with it!

P.S. I still hate 60mm faders.

 

[Lewguitar]

An observation about the higher-end pro gear vs the consumer gear: It's all about context.

It's worth the extra money if you're getting paid or have money to burn. If neither thing applies to you, you don't sacrifice much with current consumer stuff.

If you're recording a $3500 mic, sure, you'll hear the difference running it through a $1500 mic pre, as opposed to an interface or consumer mixer, provided you have good monitors or headphones to hear the difference in the first place.

If your clients are in a million dollar studio listening to your work on the mains monitors during an audio post session - my clients often do this - they're going to be disappointed unless it sounds f^ckin' great, so the money invested is worth it. It's commensurate with client budgets. Paying clients have expectations that must be met.

If you're doing stuff to play for friends, it's perfectly fine not to get carried away. Just buy the stuff you like and get on with it!

P.S. I still hate 60mm faders.

I don't have any clients.

But I wonder what the faders were on my old Teac/Tascam Model 3 board?

We made a lot of recordings in the 70's on that mixer and a Teac 3340 recorder.

 

[László]

I don't have any clients.

But I wonder what the faders were on my old Teac/Tascam Model 3 board?

We made a lot of recordings in the 70's on that mixer and a Teac 3340 recorder.

https://imgur.com/IAY7NUy

I can't see a pic, but I think the Model 3 had faders that were either full-sized or close. I'm gonna say full-sized, going by memory. But it's been a loooong time since I've seen one in person.

 

[Lewguitar]

I can't see a pic, but the Model 3 had faders that were full-sized (or very close). I'm gonna say full-sized, going by memory.

Here's a Model 3.

https://imgur.com/xT0V0xP