EVH's "Brown" Sound...How?

[CandidPicker]

uh.... CP.... what was this thead about again???

Trying to listen to the differences between my HeadRush Gigboard and an actual EVH Plexi, or a close approximation thereof.

The purpose was to imitate as much of EVH brown sound with my Gigboard; if the effects within would allow. I'm not absolutely sure that's possible.

 

[Dirty_Boogie]

You build pedals? I've got a BSIAB pedal that was built with lower gain transistors. I have two more BSIAB kits unbuilt, (I need to fix that!) but this one sounds GREAT!!! I dime the gain and it's very open and plexi-ish.

Where did you get the board to build the Pinnacle clone?

Oh yes, I build pedals... more than I know what to do with! I built this Pinnacle on vero board (http://guitar-fx-layouts.42897.x6.nabble.com/Wampler-Pinnacle-with-Trimmers-td15351.html), but pedalpcb.com has the PCB (called the "Pineapple"). With all the J201 FETs, it's a bear to bias and to keep the noise in check, but once dialed in, it's amazing how tube-like this pedal is. In the last couple of months I built the Pinnacle (covers the hot rodded Plexi tones) and a Dr. Boogie (which covers the Dual Rec tones), and I actually then sold my Mesa Mark V:25. I run these two high gain monsters (not at the same time!!) into a little Quilter Interblock 45, and honestly, I like the tones I'm getting more than the real amp. Anyway, here they are:

Anyway, back to the OP's thread...

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Very nice! I built a few on vero board, but mostly used boards from one of the DIY guys, or built kits from BYOC and a couple from General Guitar Gadgets. I need to build my BSIAB, because the lower gain version I'm using now sounds fantastic. Using the regular transistors would give me the same thing but high gain.

Nice job on the cases too! That's one reason I didn't build my last BSIAB kit, was because I wanted to VH stripe the case and never got around too it. I think I have that and two BYOC kits still unopened in the boxes, as I kind of completely got away from moding and building small amps, and building pedals. I need to at least finish the ones I have though.

 

[Dirty_Boogie]

Very nice! I built a few on vero board, but mostly used boards from one of the DIY guys, or built kits from BYOC and a couple from General Guitar Gadgets. I need to build my BSIAB, because the lower gain version I'm using now sounds fantastic. Using the regular transistors would give me the same thing but high gain.

Nice job on the cases too! That's one reason I didn't build my last BSIAB kit, was because I wanted to VH stripe the case and never got around too it. I think I have that and two BYOC kits still unopened in the boxes, as I kind of completely got away from moding and building small amps, and building pedals. I need to at least finish the ones I have though.

Thanks. The nice thing about the Pinnacle is that you can cut the gain significantly with the Gain switch - and it still retains the general flavor of the pedal.

 

[CandidPicker]

Thanks. The nice thing about the Pinnacle is that you can cut the gain significantly with the Gain switch - and it still retains the general flavor of the pedal.

Boog,

What are your thoughts on the MXR 5150, or Carl Martin Panama? Are these close approximations of the Pinnacle?

 

[Dirty_Boogie]

Boog,

What are your thoughts on the MXR 5150, or Carl Martin Panama? Are these close approximations of the Pinnacle?

Haven’t used either of those. If EVH put his name on the MXR, I’d think it would be a great pedal. That Pedal Show did a comparison of the best “brown sound” pedals -

 

[CandidPicker]

Haven’t used either of those. If EVH put his name on the MXR, I’d think it would be a great pedal. That Pedal Show did a comparison of the best “brown sound” pedals -

Thx. Pete Thorn did a clip of the MXR EVH 5150. Pete's guitar must have been detuned to low C or B, and his chops were heavy. The EVH 5150's internal noise gate is what sets this pedal apart from its competition. A tweakable built-in noise gate proves invaluable for high gain riffs that complement the 5150's circuitry well.

I noted that the EVH has slightly crisper high end than the Pinnacle, because of the EVH's EQ. The Pinnacle, by comparison, more mid presence. Is this what you're hearing as well?

 

[Dirty_Boogie]

Thx. Pete Thorn did a clip of the MXR EVH 5150. Pete's guitar must have been detuned to low C or B, and his chops were heavy. The EVH 5150's internal noise gate is what sets this pedal apart from its competition. A tweakable built-in noise gate proves invaluable for high gain riffs that complement the 5150's circuitry well.

I noted that the EVH has slightly crisper high end than the Pinnacle, because of the EVH's EQ. The Pinnacle, by comparison, more mid presence. Is this what you're hearing as well?

I can't compare it against the other pedals, but I think it's how they had the pedal set. The Contour controls the mids - from very present to full scooped.

This video is much closer to how I hear my Pinnacle -

- he's using less Contour (mids) than the Pedal Show guys, and he shows the effect of the Contour control at 3:58

 

[CandidPicker]

I can't compare it against the other pedals, but I think it's how they had the pedal set. The Contour controls the mids - from very present to full scooped.

This video is much closer to how I hear my Pinnacle -

- he's using less Contour (mids) than the Pedal Show guys, and he shows the effect of the Contour control at 3:58

Thx! How much of the gain structure is useable without incurring appreciable noise in the circuit? The last 30 seconds of the vid seemed to describe this, but it would help to know at what gain level....

 

[Dirty_Boogie]

Since mine is hand-built, with lots of internal wiring for the 4 pots and 3 switches, I'm sure it's a lot noisier than a production Pinnacle. Wampler probably uses a PCB with surface mount components, heavy shielding, and minimal, if any, internal wires, which pick up noise in such a high gain circuit. My gain control starts to get really noisy around 3 o'clock, but I can't see why I'd ever need to go above 2 - it's already getting super saturated at that point. I don't think I can give you an accurate answer.

 

[CandidPicker]

Since mine is hand-built, with lots of internal wiring for the 4 pots and 3 switches, I'm sure it's a lot noisier than a production Pinnacle. Wampler probably uses a PCB with surface mount components, heavy shielding, and minimal, if any, internal wires, which pick up noise in such a high gain circuit. My gain control starts to get really noisy around 3 o'clock, but I can't see why I'd ever need to go above 2 - it's already getting super saturated at that point. I don't think I can give you an accurate answer.

So'k, you've provided what I needed to know.

In other news regards trying to emulate the "brown sound," some of my research included this video and some rather disconnected parts which tries to cop EVH's tone with a HeadRush Pedalboard and a TS-9 with specific settings. Hang on while I find the video again...ah, here...please bear with the intro monologue...

Doc McF uses a Peavey 5150 amp preset that isn't supplied stock with the Gigboard, so I used a stock HeadRush '67 Plexi Variac with boosted treble and bass, and flat mids., also a JRC-GREEN TS-9 with drive above 50% and tone about 55 to 60%. The Orange Phaser, Tape Echo and Air Reverb are very similar effects Eddie used with his original rig.

The first 20 minutes describe most of EVH's rig from the late 70's early 80's. The remaining part of the vid Doc diverges from EVH's rig and adds some stuff per request of his live chat ...

The '67 Plexi Vari sounds darn close to what I recall hearing in EVH's tone. Couple EQ tweaks, master volume NOT dimed, normal volume about 55%, high volume 50%.

I've needed to adjust my EQ settings on several of my rigs...some are bass and low mid heavy, somewhat muffled, not enough cutting through. After hearing EVH's rig I now understand what will cut through and project, compared to sit way back in the mix...

 

[RickP]

Interestingly, an opportunity came up for me to pick up a new Variac at about 70% off. In Ed’s memory, I had to buy it! I’m going to try it on some tube amps and see how it works! Really, it seems crazy now that I never tried it before.

 

[bodia]

Interestingly, an opportunity came up for me to pick up a new Variac at about 70% off. In Ed’s memory, I had to buy it! I’m going to try it on some tube amps and see how it works! Really, it seems crazy now that I never tried it before.

Would love to hear some samples!

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Interestingly, an opportunity came up for me to pick up a new Variac at about 70% off. In Ed’s memory, I had to buy it! I’m going to try it on some tube amps and see how it works! Really, it seems crazy now that I never tried it before.

What are they going for these days? I've never bothered to check for a price on one.

 

[RickP]

Would love to hear some samples!

I’ll have to do that! Seems a good experiment to see what all the talk has been about.

What are they going for these days? I've never bothered to check for a price on one.

There are cheap Chinese ones you can get for under $100, but I wanted one of the big, heavy ones like he was using. I found a Superior Electric 3PN116C, which normally go $600-700, new in the box for $200 including tax and shipping. It’s a chunk of metal, but will take 120 VAC and give you anything from 0-140 VAC out. 10 amps max, so it’ll cover any amp I have with tons of headroom.

It isn’t the exact one Ed used, but it’s pretty close!

One of the things I want to hear is if my old Fenders that were designed for 110-115 from the wall sound different on proper power (my wall outlets are always 122-124).

Anyway... another unnecessary toy for the music room, but it will answer 42 years of curiosity!

 

[Deleted member 5962]

I looked years ago and seemed to remember them being around $300 or so, but that was a long time ago. This should be a really cool experiment. I have played amps with full amp power scaling, and build a couple small ones with it as well. As fun as it was with them, the two amps I always wanted to try it with was of course the plexi, and a JCM 800 as well.

Now though there are new lower watt plexi's that could also benefit from it. There are guys at TGP just gushing about how great the new 20 watt plexi Marshall sounds, and then either selling them or having to buy a Power Station or something, because, like real plexi, the amp needs to be really opened up to sound great, and it is REALLY loud. One guy said he measured the SV (I think is the one) 20 through the same cab and it was louder than his 50 watt Mesa. I was thinking a while back that I might get one of the newer lower powered ones IF I had an affordable way to tame it. $1200 for an amp and $1200 for an Ox or even $700 ish for a Power Station takes it into boutique price land, so I lose interest as I could just get a killer Splawn instead.

 

[Rider1260]

Its kinda funny buy my HBII thru my MKV Mesa in MK1 Mode in the Variac mode did a very VH tone to my ears

 

[CandidPicker]

Rick,

Remember that Eddie's magic number was 89 VAC for optimum results.

 

[CandidPicker]

For those on a budget, here something recently released from Wampler...not quite the Pinnacle, but does a Plexi really well in a mini format...that's just in case one doesn't own a '67 Plexi...

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Rick, you're going to be surprised how much more gain your amp has when you roll the voltage down some.