Breaking silence: Some S2 models...Too much pick guard!

I've wondered about sales figures for the S2 and SE lines recently - as it seems most of the NGD threads are for one of those two lines. So their decision to produce some lower price point models seems like a good one so far.

I'm pleasantly surprised at the quality and popularity of the S2's. Of course they have some haters, but they've really caught on despite not having the full "core" treatment. For me, the quality and value has been very satisfying, and obviously I'm not the only one.

It was a risky play by PRS in my book, sometimes these things are dismissed as being inferior and it would've been bad news for PRS if they never gained traction. If my guesstimations are correct, the whole S2 project (concepts, production line, etc.) was a big initial investment. But people have seen that these instruments are high quality, not just a name on a headstock. And they're selling well as a result - I already have 2, and wouldn't turn down a third depending on the model. Probably could've saved up for one core, and loved it, but I love the way they play and sound, and to be honest I'm less scared of taking one out to play at a crummy bar!

I saw a video a while back where Paul discussed the sales numbers of SE's, S2's, and core - and they do indeed sell a LOT of S2's and SE's. I'll repost it if I run across it again.
 
On whether the backs should be routed so pick the rear covers are flush - first, added expense, and second, Fender doesn't mount theirs flush either.

PRS himself said they really struggled to cut the costs on the S2s to bring them in at a popular price point. And they're evidently selling well!

So probably not very many people really give a rat's behind about the cosmetics that are being complained of, except for folks who probably would only buy a Core model anyway.
 
My first PRS was an se cu24 30th and the quality of this guitar is steps above other brands in its price point. Once I put my faith in PRS, I wanted a single cut semi hollow. I A/B'd an SE ZM and an S2 SC semi. Not discounting the ZM in any way, I know many love theirs but I went with the S2 simply because of the feel, quality and finish. The same day that I purchased it, a friend of mine who owns a core SC 10 top said he couldn't tell the difference in feel from his, but did note a difference in the pickups. Bottom line-the S2 line is the closest you can get to core without the core price and it's worth every penny. My next PRS will be a core model. Some day........
For now I'm going to enjoy playing my SE and my S2
 
I think PRS has done a very god job of segmenting the marketplace and providing quality instruments at many different price points. As far as the S2 line goes, they are a great value for about $1,100. Do I love the looks, no, but I would not take a number of the models off the list just for the pick guard. Kind of a decent retro look with nothing to do with the quality of the guitar.
 
I dislike locking trems. Therefore, they should not be made anymore.... and if a company is foolish enough to make or install such awful devices, all guitarists should boycott.
 
I like the S2 models but can see where some would not like the pickguards. They do seem to be growing, kinda like tumors. I've got an S2 Custom with no pickguard and a nice flame top. Also have a DGT. Think it's great that there are so many models to compare tone and prices. So glad that PRS is available with the quality and price points they have. Can't expect all offerings to sell equally well.
 
No Floyd Rose??? You guys need to get in touch with your inner Van Halen! :D
 
I don't think the guards are all that big. A Telecaster Deluxe, that's a big pickguard. The flatter mahogany tops look plain to me without a guard. There are a few rear routed S2 Standards floating around BTW.

I don't get the issue with the Mira. It's either plastic rings or a plastic pickguard. It's plastic either way.

The compromises are apparent, but I think they're made in the right places. And the prices are crazy low for what you're getting.

But if you don't like them, don't buy them. The market will speak. The used market is great, so you could get a nice older McCarty Standard or a Singlecut Standard Satin or a Standard 22 or a Standard 24 for about the price of an S2 and aftermarket pickups.
 
No Floyd Rose??? You guys need to get in touch with your inner Van Halen! :D

Not that I play anything like Van Halen, but I had a Floyd back around 1990 or so on a Jackson. I will never own another guitar with a metal contraption with bolts on it over the nut, or that requires two little tools to be attached to the back of the headstock.

On the other hand, I did think that the fine tuning adjustment was a good idea.

But my frustration with that hunk of toneless metal and wood did lead me to go looking for a new guitar, and that's when I found out about (and bought my first) PRS, back in 1991.

So thank you, Floyd.

I'm glad PRS has satisfied the Floyd crowd, but it's utterly and completely not a thing for me.
 
I don't think the guards are all that big. A Telecaster Deluxe, that's a big pickguard. The flatter mahogany tops look plain to me without a guard. There are a few rear routed S2 Standards floating around BTW.

I don't get the issue with the Mira. It's either plastic rings or a plastic pickguard. It's plastic either way.

The compromises are apparent, but I think they're made in the right places. And the prices are crazy low for what you're getting.

But if you don't like them, don't buy them. The market will speak. The used market is great, so you could get a nice older McCarty Standard or a Singlecut Standard Satin or a Standard 22 or a Standard 24 for about the price of an S2 and aftermarket pickups.
Totally agree with this
 
Dave's guitars has some Standard S2's without the pick guard. After seeing those, I found that I like the S2 guitars better with the pick guard than without it. I frankly love the Vela pick guard. The Brent Mason has a really nice pick guard. And the 80's/90's Strats without a pick guard never really took off like the tried and true Strats with the pick guard. It's all a matter of preference.
 
I like the pickguard designs on the SE and S2 Standards, and I have a Brent Mason, so I don't have a problem with pickguards--some of my favorite PRSi have them (DC3, for instance). That being said, if I could afford a Private Stock Brent Mason I wouldn't want a pickguard covering up the top, and there are some gorgeous Private Stock Brent Masons out there. Maybe I need to play the lottery...

Human: "God, please let me win the lottery!"
God: "Hey, meet me halfway--buy a ticket!"
 
I didn't like the guards at first...but they grew on me.

S2s are very much function-first designs. I respect immensely what the company did with these and how they did it.
 
Which begs the question you didn't answer. What 'epic failures'?

I think Paul himself would list the HG amps as less than successes. I have one in my office that is quite the novelty item. But I still don't think it qualifies as an epic failure...

I was referring to and this is straight from Paul when I met him in Salt Lake City and at Stevensville. He said getting the shape of the guitar just right was a disaster early on, neck shape problems and dealing with Carlos was very difficult in the beginning. But recent blunders I think are the Narrow field pups, Mira X, Strat copy guitars (now discontinued), V12 finish (the jury is still out), I like the old finish process better IMO. Over abundance of SE Artist guitars (fixed). The best success was the court decision about the Singlecut versus the Gibson Les Paul. the judge saying "you'd have to be a complete idiot to mistake a Singlecut and Les Paul at 20 feet." That was such a victory. That law suit about broke Paul. Paul's relentless drive to perfection put him and the company back on track. I just hope that the Indonesia guitar thing doesn't backfire.
 
No way I would call the Narrowfields a "blunder." More like the bee's knees! Plenty here would disagree with them being a "blunder." Love mine in the Studio.
 
I was referring to and this is straight from Paul when I met him in Salt Lake City and at Stevensville. He said getting the shape of the guitar just right was a disaster early on, neck shape problems and dealing with Carlos was very difficult in the beginning. But recent blunders I think are the Narrow field pups, Mira X, Strat copy guitars (now discontinued), V12 finish (the jury is still out), I like the old finish process better IMO. Over abundance of SE Artist guitars (fixed). The best success was the court decision about the Singlecut versus the Gibson Les Paul. the judge saying "you'd have to be a complete idiot to mistake a Singlecut and Les Paul at 20 feet." That was such a victory. That law suit about broke Paul. Paul's relentless drive to perfection put him and the company back on track. I just hope that the Indonesia guitar thing doesn't backfire.

OK, I understand now. 'epic failures' for your tastes personally, not as a guitar maker.

Close relationships are hard. But they are worth working on. Carlos was already big when Paul was still wet behind the ears. Paul had to prove himself and earn Carlos' respect. I think the end result is pretty clear.

I'm having a hard time seeing how the progress of learning to build and getting to a guitar and neck shape that is not just good, but great is any kind of failure, much less an epic one.

The narrowfield pickups are such epic blunders that they are featured on the 20th anniversary private stock currently offered. Ummm...

One reason you don't see a lot of Mira X guitars on the used market is because the people that have them like them. It's OK if you're not a fan.

Strat copies: You only have to look around this forum to see that there are lots of members who want something like the EG back. And people are swapping humbuckers for HB wide single coils all over the place.

SE artist guitars are a very smart way to test the market for new design tweaks. Look at the success of the Bernie. That could easily end up being a core model. It makes a lot more sense to experiment at that price point than in the core or S2 lines. The opposite of a 'failure'.

Paul took a risk early with the SC. He thought he made it different enough from a Gibson that it was it's own guitar. In the end, the courts agreed. It's business, end of story.

SE guitars are made in Korea, not indonesia. Tough it is a common misconception that Korea is part of Indonesia, it is not. Currently, I'm pretty sure that the SE line far outsells anything else PRS makes. (anyone with sales figures?) That's a failure?
 
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OK, I understand now. 'epic failures' for your tastes personally, not as a guitar maker.

Close relationships are hard. But they are worth working on. Carlos was already big when Paul was still wet behind the ears. Paul had to prove himself and earn Carlos' respect. I think the end result is pretty clear.

I'm having a hard time seeing how the progress of learning to build and getting to a guitar and neck shape that is not just good, but great is any kind of failure, much less an epic one.

The narrowfield pickups are such epic blunders that they are featured on the 20th anniversary private stock currently offered. Ummm...

One reason you don't see a lot of Mira X guitars on the used market is because the people that have them like them. It's OK if you're not a fan.

Strat copies: You only have to look around this forum to see that there are lots of members who want something like the EG back. And people are swapping humbuckers for HB wide single coils all over the place.

SE artist guitars are a very smart way to test the market for new design tweaks. Look at the success of the Bernie. That could easily end up being a core model. It makes a lot more sense to experiment at that price point than in the core or eS2 lines. The opposite of a 'failure'.

Paul took a risk early with the SC. He thought he made it different enough from a Gibson that it was it's own guitar. The copurts agreed. It's business, end of story.

SE guitars are made in Korea, not indonesia. Tough it is a common misconception that Korea is part of Indonesia, it is not. Currently, I'm pretty sure that the SE line far outsells anything else PRS makes. (anyone with sales figures?) That's a failure?


There are Indonesian made SE Standards and Korean made SE models as you said. Don't get me wrong, I'm not bagging on PRS. I love Paul. I went you got to check out a Mira X at a local dealer and there's a sticker on the headstock, FROM THE FACTORY that says "Mira X" , I was like....ummmm really? Was wanting a backup guitar and it was a turn off for me.
 
Ah, yes, and my S2 Custom SC, Dark Cherry Burst has no pickguard and that was one thing that attracted me to it. But, I liked the real tortoise PG on my Gibson Lucille. Nowadays, they are plastic. BB King signed it for me and I swapped one out in plastic when I gave the guitar to my brother.
 
Meh... I myself am pretty put off by the pup rings being part of the pick guard on the mira and the vela. That looks very unbalanced to me. I guess I need to stress that I am fully aware that this is only my personal opinion, and do not presume to speak for anyone, and that I fully acknowledge that it is completely up to the company to decide what they want to do :-D

Of the two, I like the Vela best. It's also funny how much the pickguard looks like half a mustache :-D
 
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