Brazilian-rosewood-neck-guitars

[Newdawnfades]

Hi to all,

For a while now, I've been looking around to buy a more expensive guitar. Last week I had the opportunity to play a McCarty-model with an Indian rosewood neck. It sounded and played so great, I knew this was the real deal for me. I've found out that there where two types of these necks, Indian and Brazilian Rosewood and I've been reading quite a lot about them. I thought (since full BW necks are getting pretty rare) this might be a good investment. I've found a Modern Eagle 1, with full Brazilian neck in mint condition inc case. It would cost me app 5000 dollars. Only problem: it stretches my budget way beyond its limits. Do you guys think Brazilian necks are worth the extra money investment-wise?

Thanks in advance

 

[CatStrangler]

Of the full rosewood necks I've spent time with (IRW BRW, honduran) my favorite was the IRW. So no in my opinion sound wise, the BRW might not be worth the extra cash, but as an appreciating investment, who knows? I personally avoid thinking of any gear purchases as investments for a number of reasons.

 

[JMintzer]

And to counter, my BRW McCarty (from 1999) sounded and felt better than any of the IRW McCartys I played.

 

[AaeCee]

IME there is a certain quality to BRW, a certain 'zing' to the notes that seemed to be present on all I've tried, but like all things tone there's a high degree of subjectivity. That said, my one guitar with a full BRW neck, a Santana Brazilian, is truly special and a lifetime keeper. I've owned two others with the full neck including an original ME like the one you mentioned, and while I could still cite certain dynamics that may have been attributable to the neck, neither stuck around.

The investment angle is another variable altogether, but as the poster above mentioned, I wouldn't make a decision on that basis.

 

[]-[@n$0Ma☩!©]

The original BRW-neck PRS... the "Brazilian Rosewood McCarty" will cost you about a grand less than the Modern Eagle 1. And, the BRW McCarty is made with darker old-growth lumber that Paul got from Martin (when they stopped using it on their fretboards). The BRW on Modern Eagles is generally much lighter.

There were 250 BRW McCartys made in the production run (plus a couple extras here and there) between 1999 and 2000. You may not like it any better than an IRW-neck McCarty but you probably won't lose money on it when/if you sell it.

 

[László]

The original BRW-neck PRS... the "Brazilian Rosewood McCarty" will cost you about a grand less than the Modern Eagle 1. And, the BRW McCarty is made with darker old-growth lumber that Paul got from Martin (when they stopped using it on their fretboards). The BRW on Modern Eagles is generally much lighter.

There were 250 BRW McCartys made in the production run (plus a couple extras here and there) between 1999 and 2000. You may not like it any better than an IRW-neck McCarty but you probably won't lose money on it when/if you sell it.

Interesting, because Martins generally have had ebony fretboards for many, many years!

 

[AP515]

I previously had a IRW McCarty and will always have my BRW Cu22. I don't know if it is the BRW or just the inherent differences in guitars, but the feel of and tone of the BRW is noticeably better.

 

[django49]

I have very high opinions of a handful of guitars with BRW necks.......PRS, a couple Hubers, one or two others. I have no desire to let loose of any of them. Not sure that I can give a definitive opinion re BRW vs IRW, etc. I do think they (RW) have a certain degree of clarity (someone said above, "zing") that other guitars lack. But it is NOT the same as saying it will give the "warmth" of a "genuine 'Burst". Seems to me the well received recent Private Stock models hit that target very well (though I have yet to try one)

VERY hard to generalize, as so much else goes into the tone, including the body and pretty much everything else. BRW alone will not make it "the one". But I think it is well worth trying. If you can, I would recommend trying the ME I before buying. Seems like a price below $5k would be hard to find. Like others, I do not try to think of such things as investments. The collective ability of makers (PRS and others) to produce (Some say overproduce) very high end instruments totally eclipses my ability to "corner" any part of that market. So buying used is wise, where possible.

FWIW, I think the ME I does have more clarity than something more faithful to the original Les Paul 'Bursts. But side by side, it does not (quite) have the same fat tone of the closest thing I can come up with at the moment. (In this case, a Huber Orca '59 with really great (IMO) woods and BRW BOARD. Yes, I do know it is a 25" scale!)

FWIW, the absolute best sounding guitar I have played (highly subjective!) is a Huber Dolphin (Redwood) with BRW neck and board. (Redwood top on a chambered mahogany body). Very light and resonant. "Voice of the angels!"

BTW, the one pictured nearby (Ted DC245) has an IRW neck and BRW board. It is rather nice!

Good luck.

 

[veinbuster]

I'm a big braz fan. I have examples of both braz and Indian necks as well as acoustic bodies. To my ear the Braz has a richer bottom, which I like, though I admit that is a personal taste.

Both make great guitars. I believe the braz will hold its value better, but I am starting to wonder if the challenges of taking it across international borders will impact that over time.

I would buy the braz.

 

[]-[@n$0Ma☩!©]

Interesting, because Martins generally have had ebony fretboards for many, many years!

Oh well. Maybe I'm wrong. I have started to forget a lot of the things I used to know. Old Skool PRS trivia just doesn't matter that much to me anymore.

 

[django49]

BTW, an UNFINISHED RW neck is a wonderful thing!

 

[JMintzer]

The original BRW-neck PRS... the "Brazilian Rosewood McCarty" will cost you about a grand less than the Modern Eagle 1. And, the BRW McCarty is made with darker old-growth lumber that Paul got from Martin (when they stopped using it on their fretboards). The BRW on Modern Eagles is generally much lighter.

There were 250 BRW McCartys made in the production run (plus a couple extras here and there) between 1999 and 2000. You may not like it any better than an IRW-neck McCarty but you probably won't lose money on it when/if you sell it.

Interesting, because Martins generally have had ebony fretboards for many, many years!

No, you're correct, Hans. It was BRW left over for sides and backs, that was too small to make sides and backs...

PRSH told us how he got the wood at the very first (Old Original) PRS Forum Event...

 

[JMintzer]

And Hans is also correct about most of the initial '99-'00 run being older, darker BRW...

Mine is like a chocolate bar...

 

[Tag]

To counter everyone, I have had many Brazzies and Indian RW necks, and I could not tell them apart tonally. There were as many variation in tone between like models (ME1s for example, all Brazzy necks) as there were between Indian and Brazzy necked guitars of the same model. That being said, I buy Brazzy when I can because it generally looks better, and I HOPE will help hold the guitars value longer, but that has not been the case this far. I would in no way buy a brazzy neck guitar thinking it will go up in value, especially if you have to stretch $$$ wise to do it. IMO, YMMV, etc etc.

 

[bluefade]

Hi to all,

For a while now, I've been looking around to buy a more expensive guitar. Last week I had the opportunity to play a McCarty-model with an Indian rosewood neck. It sounded and played so great, I knew this was the real deal for me. I've found out that there where two types of these necks, Indian and Brazilian Rosewood and I've been reading quite a lot about them. I thought (since full BW necks are getting pretty rare) this might be a good investment. I've found a Modern Eagle 1, with full Brazilian neck in mint condition inc case. It would cost me app 5000 dollars. Only problem: it stretches my budget way beyond its limits. Do you guys think Brazilian necks are worth the extra money investment-wise?

Thanks in advance

NO...Indian rose wood is just as sweet for less dough...I've had both...Brazilian is OVERATED...just my opinion, besides guitars are bad investments...there are many other ways to invest your money for a good return...

 

[shinksma]

NO...Indian rose wood is just as sweet for less dough...I've had both...Brazilian is OVERATED...just my opinion, besides guitars are bad investments...there are many other ways to invest your money for a good return...

I invest in guitars for my sanity, not financial reasons: I play guitars, I stay (a bit closer to) sane; without guitars, I get a lot closer to crazy.

To invest in a guitar hoping it will gain in value seems equivalent to going to Vegas with the same money: you might come out ahead if you time it right, but you probably won't. Doesn't mean some winners don't exist, just that the odds are against you...

IMHO, I am not a financial advisor, I don't play one on TV, and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night...

 

[django49]

^^^
FWIW....I AM a financial advisor (of sorts) and HAVE spent some time on live TV talking about "budgets and finance and such", though never after staying at a Holiday Inn Express. :wink:

Though I HAVE made a buck here and there when I did cut loose guitars, that is NOT the norm. As above, buy them for your own happiness and, hopefully, USE them rather than lock them away as "too precious to play". It is obvious, but if you CAN find the one you want used, at least you are more likely to avoid the bigger hit.

 

[Kiwi]

I'd guess that a BRW ME-1 will hold its value over time, if you buy it used. That is, you could sell it to the next collector for about what you paid for it, and lose an amount equal to inflation during your ownership period.

That's it for investment theory. I don't know too many PRS people who truly expect their instrument values to go up over time. I don't read many posts crowing about the big gains in PRS prices and values over the last 10 or 20 years, allowing for inflation. Maybe for a few of them?

With the investment angle covered, the next question is BRW vs. IRW. Opinions vary, as shown above, including whether there is much or any sonic difference between the two. One of them can present problems in international shipping and transportation, and resale.

If the investment end and the BRW-vs-IRW aspects are done, then consider: Are you certain you still want a rosewood neck? They have a different sound and attack / note envelope from standard mahogany necks. That is, if you’re playing it and not letting it sleep in a case while it (maybe) appreciates.

Hoping this decision tree makes logical sense, and can guide your thought process. The guitars-as-investments question is the most uncertain. But it drives everything that follows.

For what it’s worth, I was able to buy an IRW ME Quatro last year, clean and used, for about 65% of its new retail price. I avoided that initial 35% hit to value, and I get to appreciate the unusual tonality and response of a rosewood-necked guitar with 53/10 (unobtainium) pickups, plus staggering workmanship on the inlay and a 3-D flame top.

Will it go up in value? I doubt it, because I’m sure PRS will be making more of them, but not BRW. But I’d guess I could maybe sell it some day for about what I paid for it. That’s as close to an investment analysis as I care to make on guitars. Meanwhile, I enjoy playing it.

 

[Tag]

For RW necks, I think a good way to compare would be to have a bolt on neck guitar, and 3-4 each IRW and BRW necks. Have someone blindfolded, and have him play each of the necks bolted to the same guitar body at random. Have them pick the ones they think sound the most similar, and then see what you come up with. Speaking for myself, I know I could not do it. There would be a mixture of Indian and Rosewood in both piles. These is such variation in even say Maple necks, how coulkd anyone make a blanket statement about Brazilian VS Indian?? I have had several Strats, all Maple necks, and switching them onto the same guitar gave large variations in tone. Thats maple alone! Three ME1s all at the same time, and each sounded very different. You basically can get the idea of what a Maple neck sounds like compared to say Mahogany, as they are very different.. However, I would think if someone bolted on several Mahogany necks onto the same guitar, and thenh several Maple necks, I would be hard pressed to get all of the correct. YMMV,IMO etc etc.

 

[László]

PRSH told us how he got the wood at the very first (Old Original) PRS Forum Event...

Yes, I have no doubt that he got it from Martin. My only point was that Martin didn't especially use RW on fingerboards, they used it for backs and sides.