Ten Thousand Things - Rough Cut Oats Demo

Draconomics

Fearless Papa of The Brethren of the Crust
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So uh...I'm kinda nervous about showing this but I would like some feedback, and I suppose the bread is baked enough for you to get an idea of what it tastes like, so to speak. So, an explanation is in order.

This is the leadoff song from an album that has been YEARS in the making. The piece is called Ten Thousand Things, based off the Eastern philosophical concept of the same name. I wont go too far into the spiritual stuff, but lyrically its sort of a reflection of my own spiritual journey over the course of the last decade. This has been a hard project, and alot is my doing. Procrastinating, losing focus, taking on something probably too ambitious for my skill level, so right now I'm shelving it for a short time while I complete a competing project that will be done far quicker. I need to refocus myself. However, I do at least have this to show you.

The recording posted here is comprised of two movements: "Skycycles" and "Yet Still".

"Skycycles" is fully instrumental, taking cues from similar part of Kansas's The Pinnacle and themes inspired by Yes' Future Times/Rejoice. Its not really an overture, but a statement of the main theme followed into various subsections branching off it. Sort of like "here's a thread, let's see where it goes", type thing. The main theme is intended to be cyclic, so it basically ends where it begins and can therefore in concept repeat forever. At the time I was getting into classical music concepts, namely the reoccurring motif that if simple enough can be played in different keys and modes, acting as a connecting thread through the length of the song regardless of what's going on. Musically, probably the most complex junk I've written. Doesnt mean its good, just means its difficult, like taxes. There's still issues, instrument levels, some of the guitar harmonies are slightly off proper tune or timing, getting rid of "scaffolding" that's still there, working out some of the counterpoint melodies with the bass here and there, reverb levels...just many little things.

"Yet Still" has lyrics, though no vocals yet, but is more straight forward. This part introduces the closing theme, well...80% of it anyway. It's a bit rougher, some things arent as synced up as they should be. I was inspired by a bit of "Frame by Frame" by King Crimson, and "Close to the Edge" by Yes. I have issues with timing in certain areas, still some "scaffolding" that needs to go or needs to get cleaned up, program in the OB-3 in more places.

So uh...the rest of it. Probaly six-ish movements, maybe....18 minutes total? I dunno, there's more work to do. ALOT more work. I hope you enjoy, let me know what you like, what you dont like, etc. Oh yeah, as far as credits, I played everything, all guitars, bass, keys (a combo of actual playing and fishman triple play for more complicated stuff), and drums are Superior Drummer 3 (combo of playing live triggers and note-by-note building in editor). Its a nightmare.


 
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Cool.
I definitely hear Yes in it.
I got a bit lost in the first minute or so - too much happening for my brain, so I kind of wanted it to ease off for a few seconds. Once I got past that, it felt like natural progressions.
Just after 5 minutes, the drop in pace was a bit disorienting.
Tricking my brain isn’t necessarily bad...just logging my thoughts as I listened.
 
very prog! can definitely hear the stated influences, i think i would change the piano instrument to something more proggy, bring in more bass under the main guitar, and fire that drummer or at least hide the snare.
Thanks! So, for the piano...I have to sort of disagree. It's not a typical prog keyboard choice, but I think it adds a bit of organic quality to the thing, compared to something more traditional like a Hammond. There is an organ in there, but I don't use it for leads here.

I do need more bass in areas. Like I said, the levels need adjustment. I prefer a very aggressive, Chris Squire type bass, so the more pronounced the better.

As for the drummer, well uh...can't really fire him. I'm technically the drummer. Lol. I know it's busy in places and I might need to reel em in. What don't you like about the snare though? It's a Ludwig Colluseum, has a lot of crack in it. I'm trying not to go into St Anger territory, but I do want it to be cutting and present.
 
Should still be there. I haven't pulled it, so maybe a SoundCloud error.
Not sure what the deal is. All I see in your OP is a greyed out Sound Cloud box with nothing to click on. I'm on the PC, but will check the iPad later, just for grins. JXE hooked me up with the link. I dig it. I get the Yes and Kansas. Maybe a little Transatlantic, too. I could listen to this.
 
Not sure what the deal is. All I see in your OP is a greyed out Sound Cloud box with nothing to click on. I'm on the PC, but will check the iPad later, just for grins. JXE hooked me up with the link. I dig it. I get the Yes and Kansas. Maybe a little Transatlantic, too. I could listen to this.
SoundCloud can be sorta screwy sometimes depending on your browser. I don't know why, but sometimes it won't work for me either.

Funny you mentioned Transatlantic. Ive listened to most of their catalog, I still remember going thru The Whirlwind years ago, so I suppose there's probably an influence in there somewhere. I was never too huge into them, or Flower Kings, or Spock's Beard. Always felt like they lack a certain "bite" that older prog bands had.
 
Cool.
I definitely hear Yes in it.
I got a bit lost in the first minute or so - too much happening for my brain, so I kind of wanted it to ease off for a few seconds. Once I got past that, it felt like natural progressions.
Just after 5 minutes, the drop in pace was a bit disorienting.
Tricking my brain isn’t necessarily bad...just logging my thoughts as I listened.
Thanks! Yeah, that initial minute or so is pretty busy and chaotic and truthfully it was the intent. Sort of a parallel to the opening of Close to the Edge. I think the disorienting part you mentioned is right after all that buildup and settles on a Gmaj7add9. This part is probably the most incomplete in that movement, more "stuff" is needed for sure so the drop in energy isn't so bad.
 
SoundCloud can be sorta screwy sometimes depending on your browser. I don't know why, but sometimes it won't work for me either.

Funny you mentioned Transatlantic. Ive listened to most of their catalog, I still remember going thru The Whirlwind years ago, so I suppose there's probably an influence in there somewhere. I was never too huge into them, or Flower Kings, or Spock's Beard. Always felt like they lack a certain "bite" that older prog bands had.
Yeah, I agree about TA. I have to be in a certain mood to listen to them. Can't be driving, that's for sure. And I can only take them in small doses.
 
Thanks! So, for the piano...I have to sort of disagree. It's not a typical prog keyboard choice, but I think it adds a bit of organic quality to the thing, compared to something more traditional like a Hammond. There is an organ in there, but I don't use it for leads here.

I do need more bass in areas. Like I said, the levels need adjustment. I prefer a very aggressive, Chris Squire type bass, so the more pronounced the better.

As for the drummer, well uh...can't really fire him. I'm technically the drummer. Lol. I know it's busy in places and I might need to reel em in. What don't you like about the snare though? It's a Ludwig Colluseum, has a lot of crack in it. I'm trying not to go into St Anger territory, but I do want it to be cutting and present.
i like the piano in there, wouldn't replace it with an organ -- i have a logic/kontakt instrument called something like 'prog piano' that mixes a grand pian with some kind of bass synth pad, as they do, and that's what i was thinking, like a heavier piano. because i guess i just like more bass. which i guess is what i was saying about the snare and i guess the guitar too. can you add more bass to the nonexistent vocal? maybe i just need bigger speakers?

and not that you asked for my arrangement advice!
 
i like the piano in there, wouldn't replace it with an organ -- i have a logic/kontakt instrument called something like 'prog piano' that mixes a grand pian with some kind of bass synth pad, as they do, and that's what i was thinking, like a heavier piano. because i guess i just like more bass. which i guess is what i was saying about the snare and i guess the guitar too. can you add more bass to the nonexistent vocal? maybe i just need bigger speakers?

and not that you asked for my arrangement advice!
Ah, I see. Yeah, so for most of the piano parts, the bass notes are played in a higher register, so they don't get muddied up with the bass guitar. There's only one subsection where the piano plays lower register notes (around C1), and it's due to the bass guitar climbing upward with everything else, like the whole arrangement lifts an octave.

The snare is pretty cracking, but the same thing applies, too much low end and it'll get muddied up with other instruments who live in that frequency range. I did another version with a snare tuned a bit lower, and...well, I don't dislike it, but I feel like I'm missing some energy. Btw, it's important to see what this mix sounds like thru all speakers, so you guys are helping me out tremendously. I run dailes thru headphones, monitors, car speakers, crappier truck speakers, and then finally the top of the audiophile heap: a ghetto blaster.
 
The snare is pretty cracking, but the same thing applies, too much low end and it'll get muddied up with other instruments who live in that frequency range. I did another version with a snare tuned a bit lower, and...well, I don't dislike it, but I feel like I'm missing some energy.
have you considered a 'phil collins gated snare'?
 
have you considered a 'phil collins gated snare'?
Actually...I don't like gated snares very much. After he popularized it, everyone who copied it sounded like a semi-flat basketball being dribbled in a massive auditorium. I think that sounds works best when it has space. If anything, I like his snare sound from Foxtrot.
 
Actually...I don't like gated snares very much. After he popularized it, everyone who copied it sounded like a semi-flat basketball being dribbled in a massive auditorium. I think that sounds works best when it has space. If anything, I like his snare sound from Foxtrot.
i was joking you know but it was not obvious. your track doesn't sound at all like a gated snare person.
 
This is freaking awesome. You are one very, very talented person!

I'm pretty sure I want to hear this multiple times.

Just...wow! I'm in awe.

Good on you, Draco!
Wow, thanks! I'm really just some country bumpkin with too much time on his hand sometimes. I really wanted to try to write something that pushed the boundaries of my skill to the edge of disaster. Writing for instruments I'm not familiar with was a trip too, but fun.
 
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