2 channel custom 50 combo...which tubes and speaker

[gdmiller88]

Just curious what tubes and speaker(s) everyone is using in the 2 Channel Custom 50.

The amp sounds good...but I think it can sound better. Before I sell it, I thought I'd change out the tubes, and possibly the speaker to see if I can get it to where I want it. I'm not entirely sure where that is though.

So, if you swapped out tubes and/or speaker...what did you move to, and what did it do to the sound?

Thanks!

 

[Rider1260]

I got mine with JJ EL34s in it and it works for me
Never tried it with the 6L6s that are normally in it
( Mine is a 2 channel H )

 

[László]

It's always possible to tailor the sound of an amp with tube selection and speaker selection. What is it you're looking to accomplish, i.e., what sound are you after?

 

[gdmiller88]

I guess I'm looking for the dirty channel to be a bit...thicker...I hope that makes sense. The clarity on the dirty channel isn't bad; it doesn't sound muddy at all. The clean channel is good, but the dirty is just not quite what I'm looking for...or I haven't yet been able to dial it in right. The clean channel is so good that I find myself playing only on that, and using pedals for the dirty stuff. I've been thinking that it's a waste to use it as a single channel amp. I don't need super high gain, as I have pedals that can push it over the top when/if it's needed. I'm just looking for it to be a bit fuller sounding.

I replaced the power tubes late last year with some JJ 6l6's. It definitely changed the tone a bit, and I don't know if it changed it for the better. That's why I was looking to see what other people have put in. I've thought about changing it to use EL34's, but I'm worried about screwing up the cleans.

Really, any advice or thoughts are welcome. Even if it's to tell me I'm being stupid, and I just need to do "x" and everything will be right.

The guitars I'm mainly playing through it are a Suhr Modern (mahogany body, maple top, maple neck, ebony board), a Vela, and a Reverend Buckshot.

 

[László]

I guess I'm looking for the dirty channel to be a bit...thicker...I hope that makes sense. The clarity on the dirty channel isn't bad; it doesn't sound muddy at all. The clean channel is good, but the dirty is just not quite what I'm looking for...

There are a few things you might try, though of course, one man's thick is another man's WTF...so take my advice with a grain of salt, please.

By coincidence, in addition to my PRS amps, I have a Mesa Lone Star, whose cleans I like when I want very spanky cleans, but whose OD channel is a bit hard to get that saturated but not over-the-top sound with. I like it very much with a Suhr pedal called the KokoBoost. It's simply a magic box. You don't have to push the front end of your amp with more volume. Even at unity gain, it's a "make it better sounding" box.

And you can use it in standard mode, where it just makes things...uh...a little thicker and more "there" ...or in mid boost mode, where you can select the frequency you want to emphasize. The pedal is one of my little secrets for recording.

Another thing you might try in the pedal department is a good EQ pedal, if for no other reason than to find out which frequencies you'd like to mess with. People underestimate what a graphic EQ pedal can accomplish, they'll rush out and buy a new amp when a bit of EQ in the right frequency band can solve the problem.

In the tube department, I'm not a big fan of the JJ 6L6 tubes for some reason. I do like the Tung Sol 6L6 GC reissues if you don't want to spring for NOS.

And of course various vendors have NOS, which usually is an improvement in tone both clean and dirty. I've seen Sylvania and RCA recently at not too scary prices. You won't find better 6L6GCs than those. The Winged C 6L6s are now considered NOS, but they're worth investigating for a bit less dough.

Preamp tubes can also make a big difference, and I'd at least try NOS in V1. I have NOS preamp tubes in both my HXDA and DG30, and they sound great, clean or dirty.

And of course speakers will make the biggest difference of all, but that's an encyclopedia in itself and you just need to listen to a bunch.

Good luck on your quest!

 

[bodia]

I'll give a big +1 on the Suhr Kokoboost. Outstanding pedal! I replaced a V30 with a Scumback J70 that I had him break in prior to shipping. I like what that speaker did to my HXDA.

 

[11top]

..... one man's thick is another man's WTF...

So true. My head has 6L6s, and I use a Boogie 2x12 vertical with V30s, and I really like the gain channel's tone. It's not metal intense, but that's not what I'm after.

 

[gdmiller88]

Thanks for the replies.

The Koko boost is on my list of pedal wants...along with a Suhr Rufus, a ZVex Double Rock, an H9, another wah, a compressor, and, and, and...You get the picture.

I'll probably start with the power tubes, and probably go with the Tung Sol to start. If that doesn't work, maybe I'll try the Winged C's.

I'll probably order a new pre amp tube while I'm at it.

Which brings me to my next question: Where are you all buying your tubes from? I've usually bought from Tube Depot, but if I can get better prices/selection somewhere else, I'm all ears.

Thanks again!

 

[László]

Where are you all buying your tubes from? I've usually bought from Tube Depot, but if I can get better prices/selection somewhere else, I'm all ears.

Thanks again!

I like Tube Depot and Tubestore. They both will test the tubes, and have good policies. I don't know of better places, but KCA is also very good I'm told.

 

[dmatthews]

I'm currently on a tube swap walkabout myself. This is for the H but I have a Custom 50 combo as well.
I absolutely love my H combo but last gig the power tubes started to crap out. What came out are Winged C 6L6. What went in are Groove Tube 6L6SD (Low) because that's what was available at the local.
Well holy guacamole!
I bought the H used so there's an excellent chance the Winged C are not stock. The GTs changed the amp dramatically! The clean went over the top super chimey, and the lead channel lost that modern crunchy goodness I have come to love. Adjusting the bias helped a little (30mw +-5).
That made me contact PRS and ask what the recomended replacement power tube is.
Answer? Ruby 6L6. The Rubys arrived yesterday and I can't wait to try them out this weekend.
Did you bias the new tubes?

 

[gdmiller88]

I still have the Rubies that came in the amp, I might throw those back in. I have some Tung Sol's on the way, as well as a new Tung Sol for the dirty channel.

I played the amp last night, and really wasn't happy with it. No matter what I did, it sounded muddy and muffled like I had thrown a heavy blanket over it. I'm hoping the tubes help.

What is the recommended bias? When I put the JJ's in, I made sure it was around 30. I checked again last night, and that's still where it's at so there hasn't been any creep in either direction.

If the tubes don't help, this may be going up for sale, and a Friedman or Suhr may be in my future. Played a Friedman Wildwood Smallbox 50 a couple weeks ago. Holy crap was that nice. More than I can spend right now, but they have their new Runt 50 that looks/sounds pretty great too.

I don't want to give up on this amp though. I believe it can be "the one," but I don't want to replace everything just to try to get it there.

 

[dmatthews]

Well my Custom 50 is nowhere near muddy and muffled, at least to my ears. Yes, the recommended bias is 30 +/- 5, so you could monkey with that a bit. What are the effect loop pots set at? Around 2:00pm for both is good on mine.

 

[gdmiller88]

Effects loop pots are around 2. My issue with those is that at 2 I have a ton of noise, but if I turn them lower the I have to crank the master.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

(Note to self: Koko boost on the list) Check

 

[gdmiller88]

Just got word that the tubes should be here Saturday. Do I need to worry about burn in? I've read conflicting things that I should absolutely do it, and that it doesn't matter.

I'll post an update after I get everything installed and biased. Keep your fingers crossed.

Thanks again, everyone!

 

[Deleted member 5962]

If you bought them from a reputable dealer, they are already tested and should be OK. I'd recheck bias after a couple weeks though, just to be sure.

 

[bodia]

(Note to self: Koko boost on the list) Check

Here's a hint: move it to the top of your list.......that good!

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Glad you said this. I've gone twice to by an EP boost and both times they were sold out.

 

[László]

Glad you said this. I've gone twice to by an EP boost and both times they were sold out.

The EP Boost is designed to do a different thing.

The EP cuts the bottom end a little bit, puts a little bit of grit on the high frequencies, and has a different sound. Has a different purpose, of course, to sound like the old solid state Echoplex circuit a la Jimmy Page and others who had theirs on regardless of whether the tape was rolling.

The Koko, in addition to having the selectable mid-boost, has a full-range mode that adds just a little bit of compression and harmonics, and gives the sound a polish and shimmer that most boxes can't. It's hard to describe, but once you hear it, you know what it is, and most players hearing mine have said, "I gotta get me one o' those!"

So both are great. The Koko can be someone's "always on" magic box, while the EP is more specialized. Or...vice versa!

 

[andy474x]

I still have the Rubies that came in the amp, I might throw those back in. I have some Tung Sol's on the way, as well as a new Tung Sol for the dirty channel.

I played the amp last night, and really wasn't happy with it. No matter what I did, it sounded muddy and muffled like I had thrown a heavy blanket over it. I'm hoping the tubes help.

What is the recommended bias? When I put the JJ's in, I made sure it was around 30. I checked again last night, and that's still where it's at so there hasn't been any creep in either direction.

If the tubes don't help, this may be going up for sale, and a Friedman or Suhr may be in my future. Played a Friedman Wildwood Smallbox 50 a couple weeks ago. Holy crap was that nice. More than I can spend right now, but they have their new Runt 50 that looks/sounds pretty great too.

I don't want to give up on this amp though. I believe it can be "the one," but I don't want to replace everything just to try to get it there.

How loud are you playing it when it sounds muffled? I've noticed that the high end sizzle cuts back quite a bit when the master is opened up, maxing the presence helps with that. You really need to have it turned up, it's subtle to the point of unnoticable in the first 90% of the travel. It's not a bad reduction in highs, it just tames the harshness as many of us love about tube amps. I also keep the bass quite low on both channels, at or below 9:00.