Hello, I briefly had a PRS SE standard 24, and I loved it (apart from some tremolo/tuning problems I mentioned in another thread), but I traded it for another guitar I wanted more.. Now I kind of regret that, so I'm looking to get a new SE of some kind, but I'm not sure which model to choose. So I checked out a few demo videos etc., and I found this one, where Rob Chapman at approx. 19:00 demonstrates the sustain from the SE 245 model with the 245 pickups; it's almost like a "sustainer" effect; where there's a combination of sustain/harmonics/feedback happening, quite similar to what my old Fernandes Sustainer guitar could do. The SE Standard models with the HFS pickups are also featured in the video, and although they also seem to have very good sustain (which I also experienced with my standard 24 the short time I had it), it isn't demonstrated whether the Standard with HFS pickups can achieve the same "sustainer-effect" as the 245.
PRS SE pickups "sustainer" effect?
- Thread starter Ketil
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He did that in a previous video with a silver one and it was also one of the 245's. I think it was a standard. I'd say it is the 245 pickups, not the HFS remakes. He's also setting in front of the amp when he turns up the gain on the guitar, so understand that he's primed to get it.
Dusty Chalk
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...and a really good player. But yeah, being able to crank it is the key ingredient.
Yes, of course I realize that he sits close to the amp and uses a lot of gain, but he always does that, and he states in the video that he's never played any other guitar/pickup that does this (and he have played many..) So what's the big secret about the 245 pickups then, and why doesn't the HFS have the same feature? (Do any other PRS pickups have this?) This also makes my choice a lot harder, I guess, because I would like to have this feature on my future SE, but I'd also like to have split-coils and a tremolo, like the Standard 24 has. But none of the 245 models have neither split-coils nor tremolo..
Well, I guess, but then I would have to buy a guitar, an extra set of pickups (are these even sold separately?) plus hire a guitar tech to install them (I wouldnt' trust myself doing this..), and I don't even know if the 245's could be split-coiled..? All in all, that would be too much of an expense/hassle, I think.. But I see now that the Santana SE has the 245 pickups AND a tremolo (but no split-coil feature, though)
Huggy Love
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OP, what a few members stated about volume, amp, and proximity to said amp, IMHO has more to do with how he's getting that tone than those pups. From what I've read they are a vintage vibe pickup that provide a pretty clear tone when not pushed. I had Dragon IIs on my first core CU22 and I'm sure they were a ton hotter than any vintage vibe pup that PRS puts out.
I have to agree with AP515 & Boogie in that cranked up, with the overdrive pushed on a good tube amp you'll get all those sounds & more on just about any guitar..
I have to agree with AP515 & Boogie in that cranked up, with the overdrive pushed on a good tube amp you'll get all those sounds & more on just about any guitar..
Yes, I hear what you're saying, and of course I know the things you are mentioning have a lot to do with sustain. But when Rob Chapman, who has tested hundreds of guitars/pickups, and always uses a lot of gain (and volume) and sits close to the amp in his demos, says that he has never experienced this kind of sustain effect with any other guitar/pickup, except those with built-in sustainer/sustainiac, I think there must be something in it..
Huggy Love
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Then maybe it has more to do with the construction of the gtr than the pups, but I wouldn't give it too much weight in my purchase decisions. I'm able to get that effect with my hollow body very easily, and it has arch top pups, the most vintage and least hot pups that PRS has ever put out.
Ok, but there's also a video of the SE Santana where R.C. does the same thing, commenting onthese (at least according to him) unique pickups (the Santana also has the 245s), and AP515 also says he's seen a video where he's doing the same with a PRS Standard with 245s (haven't seen that video)
But don't all the Standards have HFS pickups, btw, and not 245s..?
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Dusty Chalk
alberngruppenführer
He's suggesting it's primarily the pups (and there's an implication that it's the whole guitar), but he's not explaining it.
Do you have a Guitar Center near you? I would go into one and see if you can recreate the feedback with several guitars. I'm sure you'd be able to find one eventually.
I managed to get that nice Santana bloom (the guitarist, not the guitar -- think Inner Secrets era -- not quite feedback, but it still seems to...go up? get louder? change timbre? as time progresses) with my Paul's Guitar by standing right in front of my MDT, with the guitar right in the plane of the top two speakers of the 4x10 array (it's up off the ground a couple feet).
Ted Nugent -- on his Double Live Gonzo album -- is credited with playing "feedback guitar". I would investigate what techniques and strategies that entailed before equipment, but by all means, don't rule out equipment -- I agree with Huggy, I don't think it was just the pickups, if anything, it's the whole guitar, but then I'd take it to the logical extreme -- it's the whole guitar/amp/speakers/settings...and the player. Maybe it only did it with new strings, and with the particular amp he was playing through, because they both emphasized that certain frequency region without going all the way up to the true complete feedback squeal that, for example, Iommi was famous for. This sounds more controllled.
You know how a sustainiac works, right? It actually sends signal back to the string to keep it vibrating. So it's essentially feedback. He just found a way to do it without it being prebuilt into the guitar.
Do you have a Guitar Center near you? I would go into one and see if you can recreate the feedback with several guitars. I'm sure you'd be able to find one eventually.
I managed to get that nice Santana bloom (the guitarist, not the guitar -- think Inner Secrets era -- not quite feedback, but it still seems to...go up? get louder? change timbre? as time progresses) with my Paul's Guitar by standing right in front of my MDT, with the guitar right in the plane of the top two speakers of the 4x10 array (it's up off the ground a couple feet).
Ted Nugent -- on his Double Live Gonzo album -- is credited with playing "feedback guitar". I would investigate what techniques and strategies that entailed before equipment, but by all means, don't rule out equipment -- I agree with Huggy, I don't think it was just the pickups, if anything, it's the whole guitar, but then I'd take it to the logical extreme -- it's the whole guitar/amp/speakers/settings...and the player. Maybe it only did it with new strings, and with the particular amp he was playing through, because they both emphasized that certain frequency region without going all the way up to the true complete feedback squeal that, for example, Iommi was famous for. This sounds more controllled.
You know how a sustainiac works, right? It actually sends signal back to the string to keep it vibrating. So it's essentially feedback. He just found a way to do it without it being prebuilt into the guitar.
There are no Guitar Centers near me, I live in a small town in Norway and there's only one small guitar shop in my area, and they don't stock PRS.. So I have no place I can go to try out different PRS guitars, if I want to try one, I just have to order one.. I haven't tried the Sustainiac, but I've had two guitars with built-in Fernandes Sustainer system, so I know how these things work. And I know you can create more or less controlled feedback with essentially any guitar/pickup, in the right environment regarding relative placement to amp, gain/volume, room etc. That's not my point. My point is; why would Rob Chapman, who has a ton of experience testing hundreds of different guitars and pickups (videos of which can be seen on youtube), claim that he's never tried another guitar/pickup that can do this, if there's nothing in it? Are you saying RC doesn't know what he's talking about? (or that he's payed by PRS to say it..? ;-) And mind you, he's also done this with different PRS guitars (with 245 pups) in different videos going into different amps.
Dusty Chalk
alberngruppenführer
No, no no no, I'm not saying that at all. I bow down before Rob, he has a ton of experience, and definitely knows what he's talking about. I'm just saying the statement goes by too fast, is far too general to be taken at face value, especially considering he's a salesperson. The statement merits qualification, I just want to know what it is.
IKnowALittle
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I always thought that a "Sustainer" was a male enhancement device.
Ok, and yes, me too..
I always thought that a "Sustainer" was a male enhancement device.
;-)
Remember: a rig is the sum of the parts, player+guitar+cables+pedals(s)+amp+cab(s). Change one of those variables -even slightly - and the results can change. With his rig, setup, picking style, proximity to cab, etc., he may be able to coax something different than you and I. That doesn't mean what he's stating is wrong or inaccurate, just that it may depend upon his situation and may not be completely reproducible, for us.
Here's a quick, mostly one handed video I took during a play test of an SE245 in my dining room with my Boogie, making a LOT of noise. It's crap playing but exemplifies the possible sustain qualities you're seeking.
Here's a quick, mostly one handed video I took during a play test of an SE245 in my dining room with my Boogie, making a LOT of noise. It's crap playing but exemplifies the possible sustain qualities you're seeking.
