The "Forum" Guitar

[JMintzer]

Forgive me for being cynical...but as a moderator...I kinda think you are able to get one if you ask. Perhaps one of the protos..

And if you knew me at all, you would know that I would NEVER make such a request. In fact, I'm hight insulted you would insinuate such a thing!

And yes, you're coming off as a spoiled child...

 

[JMintzer]

Bennett, really? Seriously? It's a guitar, not a once in a lifetime opportunity to meet Rick Astley. Tell you what, if they don't open up any more spots, you can have mine. That way I'll get it cheaper when you flip it in a few months :tongue:

 

[iahawk36]

Bennett, really? Seriously? It's a guitar, not a once in a lifetime opportunity to meet Rick Astley. Tell you what, if they don't open up any more spots, you can have mine. That way I'll get it cheaper when you flip it in a few months :tongue:

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

 

[veinbuster]

I'm going to hold-off on bringing this to Jack until things calm down. Also, if people are seriously offering to give up their slot already, I am going to micro-manage this to make sure the order of commitment is honored.

#26 is Daniel
#27 is Veinbuster
#28 is tiboy
#29 is docbennett
#30 is shadetree (assuming he claims a dealer soon)

The 1st of the 25 that goes unclaimed goes to Daniel. The 2nd goes to Veinbuster, and so on.

But this whole conversation puts the cart before the horse. Next step is for PRS to review the request (when/if I send it to them). My suggestion is that nobody lose any more brain cells over it until we know if they'll even do it.

Applause

 

[alantig]

The only way 54 people would have agreed to the concept was if the guitars were free. And even then...

Hans, nice job! This is for you:

You've earned it!

 

[rugerpc]

I'm not sure what surprises me more, getting 25 people willing to write a check in 73 minutes flat or the fact that more people keep piling on.

It is interesting, isn't it? I understand the rationale for the number 25. At the time of your post, Forum history showed that it was difficult to get more than 15 or so people to commit to a guitar design. Everyone had features they liked and hated. That is the nature of design by committee.

But actually committing to the stated 'final' design and being asked to put your money where your keyboard is is quite another thing compared to the design process itself. When debating the specs, the guitar was a fiction, a temptation, a pleasant dream.

But, even though PRS has not given the 'go', this is different. The design (by the committee that is this Forum) is SET with limited options - it won't change. It is also the first ever Forum Guitar and there will NEVER be another 'first' if this guitar gets made. Those two facts alone make this guitar something very special.

In my heart, I believe every Forum Member who is willing to plunk down their money deserves one of these guitars. I may be mistaken, but I thought the idea was for us to design a guitar unique to the Forum, available only to Forum Members to celebrate our community.

I also understand the commitment issue. The company needs to know that every guitar they make in this special run has a home and will, in fact, be purchased. I get it. The company needs to have a guarantee of some initial number to make it worth their time specing and tooling and that number appears to be 25. So, monstrous and immense Kudos to the first 25 to sign up. Without your commitment, we would not even be having this discussion. If I had known and been online, I would have tried to beat Shawn in posting...

But the guitar is more 'real' than it ever has been to this point. There are more than 25 people interested and willing to pay. And, no matter what comes down the pike as a 2nd or 3rd or whatever Forum Guitar, there will never be another 1st. Limiting the run to 25 when there are more than that willing to commit doesn't seem to be the community based approach we started with.

I propose, respectfully, that the commitment to the guitar be limited not by a fixed number but by a signup DATE. Give the entire forum a chance to commit to this one and only FIRST guitar. The initial 25 needed to try get the company interested has been gathered and then some. I propose opening the signup to any Forum Member who was a member before 5/1/13, limit one guitar per member, and each member must commit before 5/31/13 or some nearer date.

Would it be a tragedy that even 100 of these guitars are built and sold to forum members? 150? The idea was to make the guitar unique to forum members. THAT was what I understood to be the limit on the limited edition concept.

Maybe I got it wrong.


EDIT: I was just logging in to move this post to this thread and delete it over there, but one of the mods beat me to it. Saves me the effort, thanks

 

[11top]

I'll me moving most of the comments over to the original thread.

I need this thread to be clean to maintain a clear head-count.

And what happened to "I promise?"

 

[]-[@n$0Ma☩!©]

It must have gotten lost somewhere with all the posts of all the people who currently populate the first 25 on the list who contributed absolutely NOTHING to the design, development and support of this project from inception to present.

I never promised anything. 11top was joking.

All of the comments you "lost" are (here) in the original thread.

 

[Drew]

Even though the final design was not to my liking, I am appalled at how someone can just arbitrarily decide to ask for 25, and to heck with anyone else who may want one. What some people fail to realize is PRS is probably more likely to say yes to a larger run, versus a smaller run. That is business. Your profit margin increases with each additional identical item made, when you factor in the efficiency curve and the ability to spread the cost of research, prototyping, labor to procure special materials, etc over a larger number of items. Very wrong how this all turned out. I hope PRS reads these forums and decides to make them for ALL who may want one.

 

[CoreyT]

I am happy with the final design since it allows us to pick the neck.
I prefer thin necks.
I also prefer the 25" scale verses the shorter 24.5" one, but I can live with it.
Unless you can put a longer neck on
Not sure if that is possible.

I will have to pull one of the SEs out of my new guitar case cabinet to make room for a new one.
Maybe give my SE Santana to my younger son if he wants a second guitar.

 

[11top]

I never promised anything. 11top was joking.

All of the comments you "lost" are (here) in the original thread.

Hans:
I wasn't joking. My comment was not aimed at you, but at those who keep promising to not post anymore, and then post a few hours later.

 

[themike]

Even though the final design was not to my liking, I am appalled at how someone can just arbitrarily decide to ask for 25, and to heck with anyone else who may want one.

You realize that is NOT what happened right? We haven't been able to get past 17-18 people to commit to one, so Hans decided that for his last attempt at spec'ing together an instrument based on all of our input that he would make a magic number of 25 before approaching PRS. This number was an overshot and there was no way of knowing how quickly we'd reach it, if at all. Based on the previous attempts it could have taken a week to get to that number - but suprisingly, it happened quick.

 

[László]

Guys, there had to be a cutoff number at some point, simply so that Hans could contact PRS with an exact figure. Otherwise it'd take forever and never happen. It was time to get the show on the road.

Whether the number was 25, or 50, or 100, there'd always be the next guy who decided to get one, and would complain about the number. PRS no doubt needed an exact figure to make the run - if they make the run, which now I kind of hope they decide not to bother with given the pissing and moaning.

Bennett, you broke your promise to stop the caterwauling after only one (!) day? Disgraceful. Suck it up, man!

 

[]-[@n$0Ma☩!©]

When/if I ever decide to send a request to PRS (to make a forum guitar), I'll give them a list of all the people who said they wanted in on Rev 4.

Right now I'm inclined to delete all my threads and move on. I'm just completely disgusted right now - with all of it. To be accused of saying or implying "to heck with everyone else" flies in the face of everything I've ever done for this community.

 

[iahawk36]

Even though the final design was not to my liking, I am appalled at how someone can just arbitrarily decide to ask for 25, and to heck with anyone else who may want one. What some people fail to realize is PRS is probably more likely to say yes to a larger run, versus a smaller run. That is business. Your profit margin increases with each additional identical item made, when you factor in the efficiency curve and the ability to spread the cost of research, prototyping, labor to procure special materials, etc over a larger number of items. Very wrong how this all turned out. I hope PRS reads these forums and decides to make them for ALL who may want one.

I REALLY hope that this wasn't serious. Hans did a TRUCK LOAD of work to even get this idea off the ground. Then he couldn't get more than 18 or so people to commit, so out of the goodness of his heart (and anyone who really knows him realizes how big that heart really is), he gets it together with NO commitment from PRS that it will even happen! And now you're going to complain that "I am appalled at how someone can just arbitrarily decide to ask for 25, and to heck with anyone else who may want one." Please....I REALLY hope you were kidding.

 

[László]

When/if I ever decide to send a request to PRS (to make a forum guitar), I'll give them a list of all the people who said they wanted in on Rev 4.

Right now I'm inclined to delete all my threads and move on. I'm just completely disgusted right now - with all of it. To be accused of saying or implying "to heck with everyone else" flies in the face of everything I've ever done for this community.

I agree. It's become another stupid internet argument over something that doesn't even exist yet. Hans is right. Not worth it. Too much acrimony. In fact, I'm out. Next guy in line can have my place.

I'll get a Paul's Guitar or some other production model and never think about it again.

 

[C&M Music - Lafayette]

It must have gotten lost somewhere with all the posts of all the people who currently populate the first 25 on the list who contributed absolutely NOTHING to the design, development and support of this project from inception to present.

Since I am well aware from private communications received of the vast amount of people unwilling to publicly comment as I have.....out of some concern or fear of reprisal.....I felt the absolute need to validate Bill's (Ruger) excellent and well spoken post on this thread. I have already been labelled here....I can only hope that I have the freedom of speech to express my thoughts without fear of being banned so long as I remain polite and stick to the facts.

You are wrong! As #17 on the list, I did participate in designing this guitar. Again, "you promised". Do not measure other peoples ethics when you cannot manage your own. I could go on but I do not see the point. And I do state my post respectfully. Please do not misinterpet. And to show I am sincere. Did you ever consider that when the phone call does come down the pipe that maybe, perhaps Hans will make the count at whatever is currently on the wait list. Just a simple, logical novel idea that may exist in ones mind. Seems logical and reasonable to me. Please quit fussing, I think we are all going to be happy in the end.

 

[Danerada]

Man...try to do something cool and people pee all over it.

 

[C&M Music - Lafayette]

I agree. It's become another stupid internet argument over something that doesn't even exist yet. Hans is right. Not worth it. Too much acrimony. In fact, I'm out. Next guy in line can have my place.

I'll get a Paul's Guitar or some other production model and never think about it again.

When/if I ever decide to send a request to PRS (to make a forum guitar), I'll give them a list of all the people who said they wanted in on Rev 4.

Right now I'm inclined to delete all my threads and move on. I'm just completely disgusted right now - with all of it. To be accused of saying or implying "to heck with everyone else" flies in the face of everything I've ever done for this community.

Right On Les. Hans, if you decide to drop it, you get no beef from me. You are class act dude all the way, you can interupt my gig any day and assume guitar duties. Thank you Hans! I have no problem ordering a Paul's Guitar if you say the word. Love ya!

Guys...Ol' Bennett seems to ignore my peaceful post. Maybe it is time we ignore him. How much is there left to really say anyway!

 

[László]

C'mon Les...you know me well enough by now....The day I suck it up and remain silent when I perceive something that needs to be said...is that day that those who care about me will be attending my funeral. You know that about me already. If that makes me an iconoclast, so be it. My posts are for the DOZENS of private emails I've received from like minded members who were....for whatever reason...too scared of consequences to post what I have consistently done. What bothers me as well is why so many people are in fear of posting a comment that goes against the "popular" opinion. But, that is for them to understand. I have never remained silent when I thought that I was observing something that was (for whatever reason) not including those who wanted to participate.

Maybe it's the memories of the look on those kids faces in the schoolyard in elementary school who were always last to be chosen in team sports.
I've always felt bad for the "outsiders" who wanted to be included...for whatever reason, and tried my best to ensure they were included. Now I find myself in that position. And I should remain silent??? I don't think so.

Do what you want, and say what you like, but I'm 100% over and done at this point.

To imply that the mods would somehow take disagreement out on people is nonsense. They bend over backwards to allow everyone a voice and accommodate different points of view.

The accusations that have been made lately are completely wrong-headed. Plus, you've made your point ten zillion times. Go be Don Quixote.

In any event, you have moved up one place in line. You should be happy. Celebrate your good fortune.