Singlecut vs. Doublecut? What's the difference?

[matonanjin]

Besides the obvious I mean. There is the appearance, of course! But what's the real difference? Is there any besides just personal preference of that appearance?

Some of the discussion I have seen centers around access to the upper frets. That the doublecut is made to provide better access. Makes sense. But is anyone really going to be accessing those frets from above? Does it happen?

I also saw someone saying that a singlecut is going to more closely sound like a Les Paul. Again, makes sense; I can see that possibility. But would a doublecut Les Paul, if there had been one, sound differently than an actual Les Paul. Would the difference in (the amount of) wood have made a difference.? Which leads me to...

Does the extra wood make a difference sonically? Does the extra wood provide more sustain?

And, most importantly to me, can I assume the double-cut is going to be lighter than the single cut? Of course, it would have to but does that small amount of wood make a significant difference?

Or is all the above absolute pure hooey and it is just aesthetic preference of the beholder?


ps. This seemed like such an obvious topic that it had to be discussed before. But I did a search, as best I could, and couldn't find a post in the last three years.

 

[veinbuster]

I don’t find a difference in fret access. A player who wrapped their thumb around the neck might.

I can’t really say anything about the amount of wood removed from the upper part of the body because my single cuts all have noticeably thicker bodies than my double cuts. So there is a lot more wood, which does impact the tone. And the feel of the guitar.

 

[László]

In theory, the extra wood on the upper bout stiffens the neck, which somehow affects tone, and the greater mass in the body can often give a Singlecut a bit more girth and resonance.

It’s almost like on a synth, where you can bring up a sub oscillator.

I think I’ve had all of the SC models PRS has made, except the Ted and the 594 SC. I love the PRS sound with that extra juice an SC lends. It’s really beautiful.

So, yes, the tone difference is for real. Most SCs are also going to be a little heavier than DCs.

 

[jvin248]

...Does the extra wood make a difference sonically? Does the extra wood provide more sustain?..

That way leads to madness.

There will be a lower weight, if you're curious then look up the models on Sweetwater and check weights of several (wood itself varies in weight from piece to piece). Some equate weight with quality, a thin light widget should be priced cheaply vs a thick heavy widget should be priced dearly -- and that's why the guitar market is in such chaos regarding weights. Most think they have a pretty good guitar if it weighs between seven to eight pounds.

The tone differences will dramatically enter if you choose 22 vs 24 fret models. That's the same as choosing a LP vs SG on two thirds of the switch positions. Or the same effect as switching a Strat from the neck to the middle pickup.

.

 

[AP515]

...But would a doublecut Les Paul, if there had been one, sound differently than an actual Les Paul...

You could ask the thousands of guys who own them...

 

[matonanjin]

You could ask the thousands of guys who own them...

Thanks, AP515. I didn't realize there were doublecut LP's. Mine was a singlecut and I thought they all were.
But I think we need to keep in mind I am in charge of sarcasm here

 

[BMiller]

I need to get my hands on a Core SC.

Les Pointed out some solid points.....especially about the neck joint and extra wood on the upper bout. A hypothesis would be that with the upper bout contacting the neck at 16th fret compared to at the 21st, you might be changing the frequency at which the neck itself vibrates. Harmonic generation and all that. Just a thought.....and now I have an idea to look up instead of mowing the yard or changing strings. But I think that it stands to reason that it adds to a tighter and punchier low end.

Weight wise, I doubt that you will notice the difference much if the body thickness, wood, and neck are the same spec.....say between the 594 Double and Single cuts.

As for upper fret access, I don't play up that high often....especially on the low strings. You're not going to see me going for a B on the low E string on any of my guitars (at least I have yet to play anything that requires that note at that fret). I tend to be a bit of a "thumb wrapper" so If I change my technique a bit when hitting the upper register.

 

[mark cassidy]

I'm gonna say it is a strictly cosmetic difference. I am no expert but, given the multiple layers applied to sound / tone by pickups, pedals and amps, any difference will be negligible and, to some extent at least, imagined. Again, Robert Fripp or Pat Metheny or [add any famous / pro name] might be able to hear a difference but I would not and that's what is important at my level. I believe that much more important is the quality of build and, in that regard, I would say that PRS has a definite edge across the hundreds of guitars they produce. Also, wouldn't you have to take a particular pickup and put it first in a double cut and then in a single cut to hear a difference in tone? All great stuff though. I love this kind of conversation!!

 

[Mozzi]

This is a good video as it discusses what (if anything) is fundamentally different between a Single Cut and Double Cut on the 'same' PRS model. Obviously, these two share a LOT of common hardware and the only difference is the body. They do discuss things like 'neck' access too.

No video though is a substitute for trying both in you own hands, playing both through the same amp - even if its not your set up, you can get an idea of how both feel, sound and play like - even up at the dusty end. You can't really hear the full difference after you tube has compressed it and certainly not if you are listening on a phone without using headphones.

For me, the differences were NOT significant enough that I had to pick one or be compromising too much to have the other. The differences to me were no more than the differences you may expect between 2 of the same shape guitars could have. I went for the guitar that I preferred cosmetically and whilst it may be close to a Vintage LP in its layout and tones, I preferred to have my guitar look more like a PRS than the guitar it was inspired by. It sounds, plays and feels amazing. I do feel that the Double Cut helps for access. That could be psychological because I expected it to feel better than the SC but I did feel it was easier.

I love my DC594 (pictured above) and have absolutely no regret for picking the DC over an SC. I know that some struggle to accept a switch on the upper horn unless the body shape is a Single Cut, maybe similar to those that struggle to accept a Strat type guitar with a 3+3 headstock. If you are bothered by the 3-way switch position, PRS have an option for you...

 

[László]

I'm gonna say it is a strictly cosmetic difference. I am no expert but, given the multiple layers applied to sound / tone by pickups, pedals and amps, any difference will be negligible and, to some extent at least, imagined.

Actually, the difference is quite noticeable, and not imaginary. This isn’t something theoretical. Put a real-time analyzer on a track with an SC, and do do the same with an RTA on a DC, and there will be a difference in amplitude in the bass frequencies well within the audible range of hearing. Most DAWs now have RTAs in their toolkit, so you can check this for yourself if you have SC and DC of the same models of guitar. Try it!

As a player, notes on the lower strings have more ‘push’ (sorry, the only way I can describe it), and what I referred to above as something similar to a sub-octave oscillator on a synth. You can dial up a synth sound on an analog synth, and it sounds good, but bring in a little bit of sub, and it’s got weight to it. Dial it out, and you miss it when it’s not there!

It’s the same note, just beefier. Something similar happens with a good Singlecut (obviously, things can vary from guitar to guitar, no two pieces of wood being exactly the same).

Also, with more push behind the note, there’s a subtle difference in the way the guitar responds to pick attack.

Yes, the multiple layers applied by the pedals and amps matter, and of course, the more gain you add, the less noticeable differences get (heavy distortion increases but also muddies up the apparent level of bass in both guitars as the wave goes from sine to square). So the audience may or may not care about the difference or notice it., especially with the bass guitar and drums, etc, fighting for the same frequencies in a mix. But that’s the phenomenon known as masking, which is an altogether different kettle of fish having nothing to do with the differences between each guitar.

 

[CandidPicker]

IMHO, the SC typically offers an adjustable bridge, whereas a double-cut might offer either a trem or adjustable bridge. If perhaps you know what you think you need with bridges, the SC doesn't waver, unless you buy something like a Tremonti or SC trem, or go the PS route.

Personally, I prefer the adjustable bridge, not the trem. I also think that the body shape tends to add more lower midrange, making the guitar more suitable for jazz applications (call it my quirky understanding) compared to upper midrange that Cu24s might have. Cu22s seem to be more balanced because of the fretboard length and location of the pickups, but everyone's ears "hear" differently because of our physiologies.

I also prefer covered pickups, that aren't always an option on Cu22 or Cu24s.

Regards the body shape of the singlecut, there is supposedly the added stability of the neck pocket and body mass that lends itself towards more pronounced midrange (read: ability to cut through the mix).

Over the years, I've owned both SC and DC style guitars, but often appreciate the SC design more specifically because of the "look," and lightweight feel if one chooses the S2 SC Satin route. That being said, it's not often one can find a 7.3 lb SC guitar, but I've got one incoming by the end of next week.

 

[László]

This is a good video as it discusses what (if anything) is fundamentally different between a Single Cut and Double Cut on the 'same' PRS model. Obviously, these two share a LOT of common hardware and the only difference is the body. They do discuss things like 'neck' access too.

No video though is a substitute for trying both in you own hands, playing both through the same amp - even if its not your set up, you can get an idea of how both feel, sound and play like - even up at the dusty end. You can't really hear the full difference after you tube has compressed it and certainly not if you are listening on a phone without using headphones.

I saw that video when it came out. I wasn’t there, of course, and can’t comment on the amp settings, etc., the mics, the audio that came through on the video, the individual guitars, etc., that they used, or their choice of material.

You’re 100% right when you say that no video is a substitute for your playing both with your own hands, clean, dirty, and everything in between.

A lot depends on the chords and notes you’re playing - the bass notes in particular - so who knows.

I bought a DC 594 because I already have a McCarty Singlecut that’s very thick (thicker than the 594 SC), similar in vibe to the 594SC, and it handles all of my SC needs. And the DC weighs a lot less. That was a big factor.

The SC isn’t “better” than the DC. It’s just different in frequency emphasis in the low notes.

 

[Huggy Love]

To me the biggest difference is ergonomics.

Yes there are tone differences, but TBH my dbl cut HB is more resonate and darker sounding than my sgl cut HB, and looks?.... they both have there own kind of cool. For me it's ergonomics, I sit, hold and play each one a little differently due to the shape. It's not a bad thing, my sgl cut has more of a small jazz box feel and my dbl cut is more blues, rock, fusion, and I play them that way. I can rock on either or get jazzy with both but each one lends to a certain style better than the other. I even sit up straighter playing my sgl cut for some reason.

 

[AP515]

Thanks, AP515. I didn't realize there were doublecut LP's. Mine was a singlecut and I thought they all were.
But I think we need to keep in mind I am in charge of sarcasm here

No worries. I just wanted folks to know that they existed. They have been around in one form or another since about 58, and this is my opinion only, but it seemed to me that "imitation was the most sincere form of flattery" with these in the 90's when they started looking very much like a PRS DC. If they would have been more popular, Gibson would be touting them still. One could also argue that the 594 SC is a "sincere form of flattery" to the Les Paul. While I believe it is true that PRS did it because that is what the buying public wanted/demanded, it's still a nod to the power of history which by default is a nod to Gibson.

 

[merciful-evans]

A great many asymmetrical doublecuts join the neck the same way SC's do. The only difference being the absence of a horn on the SC.

Obviously there is a lot of variation in asymmetrical designs, but a quick guide is check at what fret position the body joins.

 

[CandidPicker]

To me the biggest difference is ergonomics.

Yes there are tone differences, but TBH my dbl cut HB is more resonate and darker sounding than my sgl cut HB, and looks?.... they both have there own kind of cool. For me it's ergonomics, I sit, hold and play each one a little differently due to the shape. It's not a bad thing, my sgl cut has more of a small jazz box feel and my dbl cut is more blues, rock, fusion, and I play them that way. I can rock on either or get jazzy with both but each one lends to a certain style better than the other. I even sit up straighter playing my sgl cut for some reason.

The SC's also tends to cover more of the the midriff bulge we "show" when we grow older, too. (Speaking for myself, as well as others who have similar issues)

 

[Mozzi]

The SC isn’t “better” than the DC. It’s just different in frequency emphasis in the low notes.

I completely agree. Neither is 'better', it comes down to personal preference and which aspect is most important to the purchaser. If the weight and aesthetics of a DC is more important than the difference in sound, buy the DC if not, buy the SC. I don't see what the problem is and why its so complicated. You may also get the 'sound' you prefer by utilising an EQ pedal or EQing the Amp differently - adjusting the mid/bass differently.

As I said though, I felt that the differences were not enough to me to make me feel like I was compromising on the tonal qualities of these guitar. Others may feel different when it comes to them trying out both for themselves into the same amp to hear the difference and, whether they have a preference either way.

I posted the video primarily for those that may of missed this to see how two models in the same series differ. If you are looking for a Tremonti for example, it doesn't matter the shape as you only have 1 choice. The SC/DC only matters (in my opinion) where PRS offer the purchaser a choice and not every model comes with that choice. I think only the 594 has the choice - assuming you are buying from the 2019 models. If you don't have a choice in body style, you do have a choice to buy whatever shape it comes in or spend your money on a different model that does come in the shape you prefer.

To reiterate, if you have a choice, like you do with the 594, try both and decide which sounds more appealing to you, which feels more comfortable to play - especially if weight matters a lot and how it feels to play the higher notes too. If you don't have a choice, because PRS are only offering the shape in that particular model, then the only choice is whether to buy or not.

Money no object, I would add the SC594 more because I can than because I regret buying the DC but I could happily live without a SC and make do = not that its a hardship with the collection of guitars I have accumulated - all 5 are Double Cuts! I don't believe that I am lacking something that a Single cut offers but none of my current Guitars could do. I do want a DC 594 Hollowbody ii as well but after purchasing my PRS Special 22 (another Double Cut), I doubt I will be adding another new guitar for quite some time...

There isn't a right or wrong to this, its a matter of personal choice and preference - something that will require people to go out and try, decide what's best for them - it may even vary between models - you may prefer a SC594 but prefer a DC on a Hollowbody for example or vice versa...

 

[mark cassidy]

Actually, the difference is quite noticeable, and not imaginary. This isn’t something theoretical. Put a real-time analyzer on a track with an SC, and do do the same with an RTA on a DC, and there will be a difference in amplitude in the bass frequencies well within the audible range of hearing. Most DAWs now have RTAs in their toolkit, so you can check this for yourself if you have SC and DC of the same models of guitar. Try it!

As a player, notes on the lower strings have more ‘push’ (sorry, the only way I can describe it), and what I referred to above as something similar to a sub-octave oscillator on a synth. You can dial up a synth sound on an analog synth, and it sounds good, but bring in a little bit of sub, and it’s got weight to it. Dial it out, and you miss it when it’s not there!

It’s the same note, just beefier. Something similar happens with a good Singlecut (obviously, things can vary from guitar to guitar, no two pieces of wood being exactly the same).

Also, with more push behind the note, there’s a subtle difference in the way the guitar responds to pick attack.

Yes, the multiple layers applied by the pedals and amps matter, and of course, the more gain you add, the less noticeable differences get (heavy distortion increases but also muddies up the apparent level of bass in both guitars as the wave goes from sine to square). So the audience may or may not care about the difference or notice it., especially with the bass guitar and drums, etc, fighting for the same frequencies in a mix. But that’s the phenomenon known as masking, which is an altogether different kettle of fish having nothing to do with the differences between each guitar.

Well I certainly give a nod to your knowledge and effort to recognize the differences! What your comment does for me is make me much more attentive to what I am hearing beyond the tune when I play. I play completely bare, the guitar through a Fender Blues junior. No pedals. So, I ought to be able to hear what is going on. However, I do not, generally, switch between guitars too often. I play my PRS for weeks, then I play my Strat for a long time. Then my ES 137. I don't jump back and forth. So I don't recognize sound differences with the same alacrity as I might.

 

[László]

Well I certainly give a nod to your knowledge and effort to recognize the differences! What your comment does for me is make me much more attentive to what I am hearing beyond the tune when I play. I play completely bare, the guitar through a Fender Blues junior. No pedals. So, I ought to be able to hear what is going on. However, I do not, generally, switch between guitars too often. I play my PRS for weeks, then I play my Strat for a long time. Then my ES 137. I don't jump back and forth. So I don't recognize sound differences with the same alacrity as I might.

No worries! Sometimes it’s a matter of knowing what to listen for, or doing something for a very long time.

I make my living in music production, and I do a lot of mixing. I use real-time analyzers so I can decide more accurately which frequency ranges are masking one another. That way I can clean up and allow various instruments come through in a mix. Do this stuff for 30 years or so, and differences are probably a lot easier to hear.

But I do think lots of players hear this stuff pretty well. Everyone’s different.

 

[mark cassidy]

Well I think it's incredibly cool to meet someone who is in the business!