Should it matter if my PRS DG 2X12 V30's are not made in............

Deedsoftommy

I ♡ chip's n' salsa.
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ENGLAND???????

I opened up my DG 2X12 and noticed the little white sticker on the magnet that says "Made In China". Has anyone ever noticed it???????? They sound great but how would YOU feel about this?
 
Most Celestions, especially V30's, are made in China nowadays. Only a few amp makers still get England made V30's, Mesa being one, maybe also Marshall?

Wouldn't bother me a bit if it sounds good.
 
I think Mesa is the only company that has them made in England, and that's probably because 1) their speakers were already a custom production run and 2) they have enough leverage to force Celestion to keep doing it for them.
 
Yes, my V30s in my two 1x12 Mesa Mini Recs are made in England.
I have an Orange 1x12 cab too with a Celestion V30, and both the cab and speaker are made in China.
 
They sound great but how would YOU feel about this?

I try to avoid buying Chinese products for several philosophical reasons.

In fact, as good as the SEs are, I won't buy the Korean product because I like supporting American labor. I'm weird that way. It's no bargain for me if it costs Americans jobs, though I do understand why PRS needs to do that.

Though I still wonder why people will buy 5 or 6 inexpensive Korean guitars, but not simply save for one great US guitar...instant gratification, I guess.

And of course, Celestions are not US products, anyway, but I still have issues with the way things are done in China.

When Celestion originally moved most of their production to China, people were up in arms, and there was a debate raging on guitar forums as to whether people were able to hear a difference.

Some insisted they could, many others insisted that they were identical sounding.

Unfortunately, today "Celestion" means "Speakers Made in China" unless the brochure specifies "Celesions made in England."

In any case, would I be pissed? No.

I'd only be pissed if they'd specified English Celestions, and I got Chinese ones.

I did get misled a few months ago buying what I felt was a pretty expensive suit, that the salesman told me was "Made in Europe." When I put the suit on to go to a wedding, I noticed that yeah, the fabric was made in Italy, but the suit was made in China. I was truly pissed off, but I'd lost a lot of weight, couldn't wear my old suits, and the function I bought the suit for was that night. So I kept it, and told the store that was the end of my dealing with them. Over $1300 for a made in China suit!!! I'm still angry!! In fact, I don't even want to think about it, because I'm all pissed off a second time. :mad:
 
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It's my understanding the same machine that makes them in England makes them in China (with the same materials). I know the Golds are british made.

Economic policy is one thing, but I have to think there are people in China who love guitars and love making guitars and gear.
 
I don't actually know what "squirt" means.

Except in the context of squirt guns, hoses, Squirt soda, and various things that squirt liquids or colloids when squeezed.

Explain?

From the PRS Lexicon Thread http://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/the-prs-lexicon.1044/page-3
Squirt- 1. The polar opposite of "pie". When you wish to state something but have no idea where to start, you say: Squirt.
2. Sparkling citrus beverage that pairs well with rum.
 
To address the original question, no, it shouldn't matter. Does it sound great? If so, who cares if there are British Celestions in there or two giant Oreos dampened with marshmallow fluff? There are certain realities in today's manufacturing world that are insurmountable, and one is that you will encounter Chinese assemblies or components. If you wish to philosophically or financially choose, that's your prerogative. Personally, the pine 2x12 speaks for itself.
 
While I understand both sides of this discussion, I have heard no difference in sound between Chinese-made and British made Celestions. If I did hear enough of a difference to warrant dissatisfaction, I would find out which Celestions were made in England and change over to those.

Concerning Les' comment about why someone would buy 5 or 6 Korean or Asian built guitars, rather then one American made one, it might be that as it is easier to part with less money for a given product and as a lot of players do not feel as many here feel about having no problem saving up and buying more expensive gear, that would be my reasoning for it.

I have read where some players, who had nothing but less expensive gear all of their playing life, all of a sudden decide that they would rather have one or two more expensive guitars. They trade away the lesser guitars and purchase one expensive guitar, and then realize what they had been missing.

Still some others are literally afraid of scratching or creating "honest wear" on more expensive gear, and just feel more comfortable playing less expensive gear.

I know that having played really fine gear all of my life, I don't even blink at either buying or playing in bars with high end gear. I know how to take care of it, and I am not afraid of playing it and wearing it in.

If a person has really fine gear and doesn't use it, I feel it's a crime. Why save it? Some other person will wind up with it eventually and they will use it, as it was built to be played.

Every high end company or person building guitars that I have bought and played, have always told me that they want to see their products played and enjoyed, not put in a glass case.
 
While I understand both sides of this discussion, I have heard no difference in sound between Chinese-made and British made Celestions. If I did hear enough of a difference to warrant dissatisfaction, I would find out which Celestions were made in England and change over to those.

Concerning Les' comment about why someone would buy 5 or 6 Korean or Asian built guitars, rather then one American made one, it might be that as it is easier to part with less money for a given product and as a lot of players do not feel as many here feel about having no problem saving up and buying more expensive gear, that would be my reasoning for it.

I have read where some players, who had nothing but less expensive gear all of their playing life, all of a sudden decide that they would rather have one or two more expensive guitars. They trade away the lesser guitars and purchase one expensive guitar, and then realize what they had been missing.

Still some others are literally afraid of scratching or creating "honest wear" on more expensive gear, and just feel more comfortable playing less expensive gear.

I know that having played really fine gear all of my life, I don't even blink at either buying or playing in bars with high end gear. I know how to take care of it, and I am not afraid of playing it and wearing it in.

If a person has really fine gear and doesn't use it, I feel it's a crime. Why save it? Some other person will wind up with it eventually and they will use it, as it was built to be played.

Every high end company or person building guitars that I have bought and played, have always told me that they want to see their products played and enjoyed, not put in a glass case.

I agree fully.

I've not heard a difference between English and Chinese V-30s. However, I'd still spring for the ones made in England, given the choice. In part, that's because the Chinese aren't honoring patents, copyrights, or trademarks. In part, it's because I've found that gear made in China has QC issues. And I don't like to see US or British workers undercut by cheap, or political prisoner, labor (this does happen, it isn't a conspiracy theory of some kind, according to Amnesty International). Finally, the Chinese are being complete dicks about their claims to territorial waters, and are making up nonsense claims to their "historical" territories. Right now we have an aircraft carrier fleet or two patrolling in the China Sea to get them to back off their claims. In other words, we are showing that we will use force. We don't have to do that with England.

I don't like empowering them with my own personal money. YMMV.

I do get that people will buy several cheap guitars, instead of one great one. I could see getting one or two for temporary use, while saving up for the good one. And I understand that companies like PRS have to keep their doors open and give the market what it wants: mostly inexpensive stuff. I think they'd be better off in the long run just buying the good one at some point, but it's not for me to judge, I just mention it in passing.

And I agree fully that it makes very little sense to have great guitars and not play them when playing out; when I do a session, I want to give the client my very best playing and tone, and for the most part, that's going to come with my best instruments. Same when I used to play out to entertain people. It's what the instruments are for!

The great classical musicians often have multimillion dollar fiddles, or six figure pianos, etc., that they travel with to play on concert stages. They don't keep the good ones at home and perform with the cheap stuff, though some do use carbon fiber instruments on summer outdoor stages, they are very high quality, expensive carbon fiber things!

In any case, our audiences (or clients) deserve to get the best we can give them. Anyway, that's how I think about it. And I have a pride of playing as well as I can, on instruments that let me do that best. I know, it's not necessarily the case that the cheaper stuff can't do that, of course it can work. But I have my own cross to bear, as do we all. ;)
 
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From the PRS Lexicon Thread http://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/the-prs-lexicon.1044/page-3
Squirt- 1. The polar opposite of "pie". When you wish to state something but have no idea where to start, you say: Squirt.
2. Sparkling citrus beverage that pairs well with rum.

Yes, Bill helped me find that.

I get what you're saying, but wouldn't it be less dismissive to simply say, "I completely disagree, and don't even know where to begin," thus inviting discussion, instead of using a code word, junior high school, put-down?

Just my thinking on this, feel free to disagree.

Very few adults, including 99% of the people on this site, use expressions like "squirt" instead of expressing their thoughts.

Maybe the world would be a better place if they did, maybe not. I think not.
 
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Yes, Bill helped me find that.

I get what you're saying, but wouldn't it be less dismissive to simply say, "I completely disagree, and don't even know where to begin," thus inviting discussion, instead of using a code word, junior high school, put-down?

Just my thinking on this, feel free to disagree.

Very few adults, including 99% of the people on this site, use expressions like "squirt" instead of expressing their thoughts.

Maybe the world would be a better place if they did, maybe not. I think not.

See, I don't think of "squirt" as dismissive, or a put down. Sure, you could use it that way. But it's use can have many meanings:
- that's so cool, I have no words
- completely agree, don't know what to add
- etc

I feel it's like "aloha", simply many ways to interpret. I have no idea what Sergio was getting at, but it may not have been negative.
 
Yes, Bill helped me find that.

I get what you're saying, but wouldn't it be less dismissive to simply say, "I completely disagree, and don't even know where to begin," thus inviting discussion, instead of using a code word, junior high school, put-down?

Just my thinking on this, feel free to disagree.

Very few adults, including 99% of the people on this site, use expressions like "squirt" instead of expressing their thoughts.

Maybe the world would be a better place if they did, maybe not. I think not.


Wasn't meant to be a put down at all.

I had drafted a lengthy post, decided it was too political, and was exhausted with myself, so I typed 'squirt'.

I had intended to revise or delete my response after I calmed down from my bout of flag-waving-patriotic Nerd Rage... but then LJD made a very nice point, and I didn't want it nuked if I deleted my post.
 
In part, it's because I've found that gear made in China has QC issues.

I was hoping someone would mention this issue. For example, let's say 1,000 Celestion V30's are made in one production run. And all things being equal(machines, material, etc) how many of these speakers are 'sample tested'? 5?, 1?, None?. And how are tested? On an automated Pass/Fail tester? You can bet that none are tested using an actual guitar amp with someone playing thru that test sample. And we can't know the 'defect' percentage either. So I think it's possible that there are 'lemons' sent out to retailers and the only person that's 'lucky' enough to get the lemon at the end of the supply chain is pissed. But I might be completely wrong...
 
Hang on...

Just because something is made in China doesn't mean it's crap.

Consider further that the piece in question is going into a PRS amp.

Anyone here truly have a beef with PRS quality control???

Teacup, meet tempest.
 
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