SE McCarty 594 vs S2 McCarty 594…worth the price difference?

[S2C22]

I'm in the same camp right now, and I believe I'm jumping on an SE 594.

I've owned 5 or 6 S2's, from when they came out, to the current 594's.

The older S2's had better tuners than the newer 594's, IMO. I don't find any value in the S2 594's, (and I'm strictly talking singlecuts). The pickups are muddy, lack clarity, and the tuners can be a bit wonky. With that in mind, it becomes a mod platform at that point, so if I'm yanking pickups, and upgrading tuners, I see the mahogany SE 594 Singlecut Standard as the perfect donor. At the end of the day, I'm not trying to polish a turd into a Core, I just want a nice looking, playing, and sounding guitar. I already have a Goldtop Les Paul 50's Standard, so I don't have the itch to spend S2, let alone Core money. A used Core? Sure, if peoples' asking prices hadn't gotten delusional last couple years. The days of getting a nice SC250, 245, or even a Stripped '58 for 2k are long gone. And there's not a snowball's chance in hell the S2's are worth $1949 new. I think that's insane. I wouldn't pay $1500 for one mint, either. The S2 594's just aren't a good value, unless you're getting one super cheap. I honestly don't see the point in even offering them, until better tuners and USA electronics are in the mix. At the new or used S2 price points, I'd just get another Les Paul. So, the SE 594 seems the clear winner, in terms of value. You are getting a nice guitar, and some upgrades keeps you well below used S2 prices, that I'd have to sink MORE money into to get better tuners and pickups.

 

[Broseph]

Argument is very flawed. How’s the SE a nice guitar but the S2 not? You’re confusing money for how the guitar plays.

Both new 594 S2 and SE will have same electronics. So can’t complain about one and not the other. Cost difference is for the finish and woods. A Veneer, multi wood backs, and poly finish will keep the costs down considerably.

Making fun of the wonky tuners that’s the same as the core? Just say you don’t like the tuner then. Don’t blame it being s2. I’ve had plenty of the 594 style tuners. They work well. Not locking, but if they are wrapped right, there should be little issue. If you want phase 3, then you’ll have to get some older 594 core or do some mods. Trust me, I get being upset about lack of locking tuners. I doubt any of us mere mortals could hear a difference between phase 3 tuners and the vintage style phase 3. I too wish Paul kept it locking.

If we’re talking value: then I think comparing to Les Paul for costs is moot. Did you factor in a major risk for headstock repair? And replacing the tuners there too?

 

[Longneck Tenon]

I'm in the same camp right now, and I believe I'm jumping on an SE 594.

I've owned 5 or 6 S2's, from when they came out, to the current 594's.

The older S2's had better tuners than the newer 594's, IMO. I don't find any value in the S2 594's, (and I'm strictly talking singlecuts). The pickups are muddy, lack clarity, and the tuners can be a bit wonky. With that in mind, it becomes a mod platform at that point, so if I'm yanking pickups, and upgrading tuners, I see the mahogany SE 594 Singlecut Standard as the perfect donor. At the end of the day, I'm not trying to polish a turd into a Core, I just want a nice looking, playing, and sounding guitar. I already have a Goldtop Les Paul 50's Standard, so I don't have the itch to spend S2, let alone Core money. A used Core? Sure, if peoples' asking prices hadn't gotten delusional last couple years. The days of getting a nice SC250, 245, or even a Stripped '58 for 2k are long gone. And there's not a snowball's chance in hell the S2's are worth $1949 new. I think that's insane. I wouldn't pay $1500 for one mint, either. The S2 594's just aren't a good value, unless you're getting one super cheap. I honestly don't see the point in even offering them, until better tuners and USA electronics are in the mix. At the new or used S2 price points, I'd just get another Les Paul. So, the SE 594 seems the clear winner, in terms of value. You are getting a nice guitar, and some upgrades keeps you well below used S2 prices, that I'd have to sink MORE money into to get better tuners and pickups.

I have had my McCarty 594 SE for almost a week now, and I am very happy with it. I really like the pickups, I am sure the core model 58/15 pickups are better, but not enough to justify their price. I might swap out the tuners at some point, but they stay in tune, so I am in no hurry. I still love my older core models, but I can’t justify the price of the new ones. I end up playing my SE Silver Sky, this 594 and an Epiphone 59 reissue Les Paul more than my “expensive” guitars at this point.

 

[S2C22]

Argument is very flawed. How’s the SE a nice guitar but the S2 not? You’re confusing money for how the guitar plays.

Both new 594 S2 and SE will have same electronics. So can’t complain about one and not the other. Cost difference is for the finish and woods. A Veneer, multi wood backs, and poly finish will keep the costs down considerably.

Making fun of the wonky tuners that’s the same as the core? Just say you don’t like the tuner then. Don’t blame it being s2. I’ve had plenty of the 594 style tuners. They work well. Not locking, but if they are wrapped right, there should be little issue. If you want phase 3, then you’ll have to get some older 594 core or do some mods. Trust me, I get being upset about lack of locking tuners. I doubt any of us mere mortals could hear a difference between phase 3 tuners and the vintage style phase 3. I too wish Paul kept it locking.

If we’re talking value: then I think comparing to Les Paul for costs is moot. Did you factor in a major risk for headstock repair? And replacing the tuners there too?

I don't see flaws in an opinion. I never said the S2's weren't nice, I said they weren't worth the price.

I'm aware the S2 and SE have the same electronics, my point was, it makes more financial sense to go SE, since I'd have to gut the S2 at a much higher price-point.

I wasn't "making fun" of the tuners, either. I had issues with both S2 594's I've owned with tuners. A couple were smooth, a couple weren't, a couple were sloppy, and inconsistent. My opinion, they suck. Nothing to do with tuning stability, I didn't like them, period.

And talk about flawed argument, I've probably owned over 30 Gibsons, none needed a headstock repair. Are we to factor in a broken headstock for every Gibson we purchase now, or do you just get butthurt when somebody mentions Gibson?

 

[Broseph]

I can assure you I’m not butthurt here. I could care less how you spend your money. Or which brand you like. I’m simply pointing out a known problem in a guitar you mentioned. I never said LPs suck. Most of the stuff i listen to were produced on them!

And for what it’s worth I’ve said the SE is the better deal. For exactly the same reasons you mentioned: Great for modding at a lower cost point. I’m very curious to hear the new 58/15 LTs as the S version was very muddy to me in the thicker s2 594s. The S sounded great in the Thinlines tho.

 

[Longneck Tenon]

I can assure you I’m not butthurt here. I could care less how you spend your money. Or which brand you like. I’m simply pointing out a known problem in a guitar you mentioned. I never said LPs suck. Most of the stuff i listen to were produced on them!

And for what it’s worth I’ve said the SE is the better deal. For exactly the same reasons you mentioned: Great for modding at a lower cost point. I’m very curious to hear the new 58/15 LTs as the S version was very muddy to me in the thicker s2 594s. The S sounded great in the Thinlines tho.

The pickups in my new McCarty 594 SE are probably the clearest PRS humbuckers I have ever heard. They compare very favorably to the Burstbuckers in my Les Paul. Love the sound of the lower frequencies, not a trace of muddiness to be found.

 

[Broseph]

Is that true of the singlecuts version too? Are they 58/15 LT S +?

 

[Longneck Tenon]

Is that true of the singlecuts version too? Are they 58/15 LT S +?

As far as I know, there are no electronic differences between the single cut and double cut 594 SE Mac’s.

 

[frankencat]

I am getting ready to do some mods to my SE 594 SC. I already changed the nut out for bone which was an improvement IMO. I like the sound of the pickups with the pots on 10 but it gets a little muddy when rolling back. I installed a 180p treble bleed on the neck pickup but it is not as effective as I had hoped. I think it may be the cheapo pots so the next thing I am going to try is replacing the volume pots for some CTS 500k. I also have a set of pickups for it but I want to see if just changing the pots gets it closer to where I want it. We’ll see, it’s fun to try stuff anyway.

 

[frankencat]

As far as I know, there are no electronic differences between the single cut and double cut 594 SE Mac’s.

I figure if the quality is good and it plays and sounds good I can get pretty close to the same place. I already have an S2 Standard 24 that I love but I did a ton of mods including a Mann bridge, new pickups and electronics, and phase iii core tuners. It’s a monster and I love the neck profile but for what I have into it I am easily into used core territory $$ wise. It’s a great guitar so I am happy. I have owned many core PRS so I know what the difference is and I have no illusions of creating a core 594 out of the SE but besides the obvious differences in wood and finish, there is not as large a disparity between the SE 594 and S2 594. The biggest difference I see is the quality of the assembly and setup and since I am a luthier with my own shop I can do all of that work myself, but for someone who has to pay to have this work done you may be in the S2 range $$ wise after mods an setup. This is why I bought the guitar, so I can see the difference for myself and be able to advise my customers. At the end of the day I either end up with a cool guitar to bring out to gigs and such or somebody gets a really nice tweaked out SE 594 with the work already done.

 

[dogrocketp]

The SEs are excellent guitars.
The S2s are incredible value American Made guitars.
The S2s are made from less pieces of wood, usually a plus.
Biggest difference I've seen between the S2 and the SE is the fretwork and the frets themselves.
The tops are usually nicer on SE models as its a veneer and not a solid figured top.
The backs on most S2 models I've seen are much nicer.
Both may do well with a pickup swap depending on your taste

I agree with all this. My luthier told me that the frets are glued in on the Korean SE’s but not on the Indonesian ones. The S2’s are done the same way as the cores.The wood on the S2’s will be drier, and the fret work varied from excellent to spectacular. They vibrate like mad when played. My SE’s have all needed fret work after a year or two, but they’re still with me. They just don’t vibrate as much. I consider it good, better, best from Se to core. The big thing is always sound. They’re all unique.

 

[Mark Ray]

I just got an S2 10th anniversary with the USA pickups and electronics. It’s better than the SE I played. IMHO.

I'm still waiting on my 10th Anny S2.

How do you like it so far?

 

[Mattldm]

I was able to play the singlecut SE and S2 back to back at a local dealer…. Let me say that the particular SE they had was great. For most players I think it would be hard to justify the $1000 price difference.
The neck on the S2 was a little thinner than the SE. the weight was similar, sound was near identical… the SE is darn good.

 

[D k Souther]

I'm still waiting on my 10th Anny S2.

How do you like it so far?

I like it! The U.S.A. pickups and Cuban “hog” neck make a difference worth the up charge. It’s more clear and articulate than the non-anniversary S2 Mc594s that I compared it to.

 

[andy474x]

I’ve owned a handful of all levels (except PS) now… overall they usually manifest tone, feel, quality in line with their price point. Occasionally a standout guitar will perform as well as the next level up, SE to S2 or S2 to Core. The PRS consistency is fantastic, I’ve not gotten any duds, but some are just special.

My SE Akesson, I wouldn’t trade for an S2. My S2 Standard Satin 22, I wouldn’t trade for a Core (granted, both upgraded to Core pickups, but still well under the price of “leveling up”).

S2’s have a better feel to me than the new SE’s, more solid somehow, and they sound better on the whole. I’m hoping the recent change to the LT version of the 58/15 S brings an improvement to both lines, the 58/15 S (non-LT) were lackluster in my S2 594 compared to the core LT’s that I swapped in.

One thing to remember, the law of diminishing returns is at work even between the SE and S2 lines.

 

[Broseph]

I will say out of the box s2 typically have great fretwork. SEs can be very hit or miss. Still could pay a luthier to level them (or plek) and stay well under the $1k price difference.

 

[Monahan]

Curious as to whether or not to spend the extra or go for the SE? Seem to be ease to the same save for country of origin and sold maple top. All input appreciated.

During the last few weeks I've had the same question on my mind.

Without first playing the SE, I purchased the S2 McCarty. It arrived, and was nice. Went to town shopping for an amp, and played the SE version of the S2 594... Same bridge/ pickups/ electronics/ tuners... but the carve on the SE felt and looked better to my eyes. The S2 played slightly better, but the SE felt much better (even the SE neck felt better). Over the next few days I really struggled with the fact that I spent so much for a guitar that was at least equaled if not bettered by the import version. Result; I returned the S2. To me, the price difference wasn't even the main issue-- The SE just felt better.

Ultimately I must say, the McCarty isn't a good fit for me-- either version, but that's a different topic. The SE line is a true gem in the guitar world IMO

 

[vconstant2]

Over the past few months, I looked at and tried many PRS guitars in search of my first purchase. As I compared new models in the same class, I thought the S2 had better build quality, though some were twice as much in price. I found the differential in quality and price did not seem to match. However, I also saw a few like new, used S2s at Guitar Center at substantially reduced prices compared to new if used guitars were considerations.