S2 Custom 24 Tuning Stability

[Doublehelix]

First post here, so be kind!

Just picked up an S2 Custom 24 to use as a live guitar with 24 frets and a tremolo. I've had tuning stability issues since I bought it, and I am hoping to find a solution so I can keep the floating trem in tact.

I purchased a Mann tremolo bridge, but that did not help, although I love the machined brass over the cast stock model. I also replaced the nut with a GraphTech TUSQ XL nut, and that also did not seem to help (I always use Nut Sauce on the nut as well). I tightened the nuts holding the low-mass locking tuners in place, and that helped a bit, but the tuning pegs still seem "wobbly" to me without string tension. I guess I am used to more solid-feeling tuners, but I wonder if this wobble leads to any issues?

I am pretty frustrated with the tuning issues. At first I thought the nut grooves were not wide enough and the strings were getting bound in the nut grooves, so I filed them all just a touch before replacing with the TUSQ nut, which of course needed filing to get the string heights correct.

Any suggestions? New tuners? Block the tremolo? I suppose I could block the tremolo as a test and see if that helps the tuning stability. If not, then it comes down to the tuners as the most likely culprit.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

 

[Kiper]

Is the tuning stability issue mostly present after playing with the trem? Or even when you don't touch the tremolo?

 

[Birdsofprey]

Revisit the nut, I would have put a core PRS nut on myself. 99% of the time tuning issues are a problem with the nut. Trems move strings, tuners hold them nuts cause all the grief. Sure a string can hang up on a saddle or a tuner can slip but even brand new nuts need attention some time.

 

[dirtbiker427]

I agree with starting with the nut. What kind of files do you have? To get a nut really right you need a proper set of files. They don't need to be expensive but the quality ones usually are.

 

[Doublehelix]

Revisit the nut, I would have put a core PRS nut on myself. 99% of the time tuning issues are a problem with the nut. Trems move strings, tuners hold them nuts cause all the grief. Sure a string can hang up on a saddle or a tuner can slip but even brand new nuts need attention some time.

I agree with starting with the nut. What kind of files do you have? To get a nut really right you need a proper set of files. They don't need to be expensive but the quality ones usually are.

Thanks for the replies.

This was my first inclination as well, to check the nut, which is why I replaced it with the TUSQ nut (which I use on all of my guitars). I use Music Nomad and StewMac nut files, and they are matched to my my string gauges. I have a lot of experience with nut replacement and filing, so I am pretty sure I am good here. I use feeler gauges to check string height at the 1st fret when I am filing the nut, and I am very, very careful to take only a little bit at a time, and check the height, repeat until perfect (!). As mentioned before, I also use Nut Sauce on all of my nuts.

Most of my guitars are stop tailpiece setups, with one Floyd Rose that only dives, and 2 strats with Wilkinson floating trems that are pretty rock solid. This floating trem on the S2 is giving me fits however.

 

[Doublehelix]

Is the tuning stability issue mostly present after playing with the trem? Or even when you don't touch the tremolo?

It happens all the time, but mostly when using the trem. I notice BOTH flat and sharp issues which is puzzling, but a lot of sharp notes, which is not usual for me. Normally for me, when strings go out on stop tailpiece guitars, they go flat.

 

[Kiper]

It happens all the time, but mostly when using the trem. I notice BOTH flat and sharp issues which is puzzling, but a lot of sharp notes, which is not usual for me. Normally for me, when strings go out on stop tailpiece guitars, they go flat.

The reason I asked is because I just installed the MannMade trem block in my CU24 and am getting tuning stability issues because the block rubs against the cavity wall. Curious if you're experiencing the same thing. See my pictures here: https://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/cheap-trem-block-lesson-learned.59394/post-901284

 

[Doublehelix]

The reason I asked is because I just installed the MannMade trem block in my CU24 and am getting tuning stability issues because the block rubs against the cavity wall. Curious if you're experiencing the same thing. See my pictures here: https://forums.prsguitars.com/threads/cheap-trem-block-lesson-learned.59394/post-901284

Dang. You had me excited there for a minute because that sounds like a plausible issue with an easy solution, but alas, no. The block is not rubbing against the cavity wall. it is pretty close on the treble side, but not rubbing or hitting. I tried everything I could think of to get it to hit, and it clears it without problem.

Thanks for the suggestion however, it was worth the check.

 

[dirtbiker427]

Sounds like you are doing everything correct. Have you double checked the body pivot screws to make sure the are not binding?

 

[Kiper]

Sorry, a bit of a side question for you, do the 2024 S2 guitars come with the exact same bridge as the SE?

 

[Birdsofprey]

^ Yes

 

[Birdsofprey]

OP I get your reply loud a clear and will again suggest after this much frustration buy a PRS core nut do not modify it and I’m going to bet your sharp/flat tuning issues go away. Floyd, floating, doesn’t matter Trems only move strings it’s the pivot points that cause 99% of sharp/ flat tuning issues.

 

[Kiper]

I would maybe take it to a tech to get the nut worked on a bit first, see if it can be fixed without replacing the nut. Getting a core nut would be good too, but that's just what I would do.

Also, looking at the SE, S2 and Core guitars on the PRS website, they all day "PRS" nut. Maybe they use the same nut across all segments now?

 

[SinSir]

Sorry, a bit of a side question for you, do the 2024 S2 guitars come with the exact same bridge as the SE?

Same bridges but obviously different manufacturers and guitars. A sum of all parts. Your issue has less to do with the trem and more to do with where the mounting holes are drilled and/or possibly cavity space carved out of the guitar.

 

[show_a_little_faith]

Is it possibly an intonation issue, and that's why you're hearing bad notes? Or does it affect open strings that start out proper then go sharp/flat too

 

[dogrocketp]

I don’t think that the mounting holes or the cavity space are the problem. 2 big questions 1: Did you deck the trem? 2. Did you disconnect the trem springs before resetting the bridge height? If you turned the bridge screws with tension on the bridge (after the new block), you may have knocked the holes on the bridge plate out of round, or partially sheared one of the screws. Start with the nut being professionally installed. I have two S2’s, one with a Mann trem, and the other with a Mann block. They both stay beautifully in tune.

 

[SinSir]

I don’t think that the mounting holes or the cavity space are the problem.

My response about tolerances was in reference to:

Cheap trem block - lesson learned

I bought my first PRS last December when they were having the big sale. I bought a SE Custom 24 Quilt which was a new model at the time. I played it in store and really fell in love with it. A combination of the sound, resonance and looks really struck me. I also couldn't resist that beautiful...

forums.prsguitars.com

For OP, I agree with you and don't think one bit the issue is mounting holes or cavity space for a s2. I'd say setup/installation as well.