PRS SE 35th Review

[Yosua Wijaya]

Hi Yosua! So when I sand the nut I use a block of wood that I have already sanded level and flat, and attach a square of sandpaper on the top. Then just run the nut back and forth over it. If you go slowly you'll be fine, just keep checking to ensure the nut base is flat. It'll take some time, it took me an hour yesterday to remove about 1.5mm off my new nut. Once I get enough material off, I run the nut over a bastard file to smooth out the cut and fully flatten the base.

Now, do the nut slots need to be filed before putting strings on? Not necessarily. If its a preslotted nut, the only reasons to file the slots is to A: Match fretboard radius and B: To widen the slots to accommodate larger gauge strings. To match fretboard radius, you can buy a radius tool that has a profile of different fretboard radii. I just trace the radii arc onto my nut and just file to match. Something to remember, the difference between the arc length of a typical guitar fretboard radius versus what it would be if flat is very small, but enough to influence how the neck feels quite a bit so you do want to pay some attention to matching fretboard arc. As to string gauges, ideally you want the string to sit in its slot nicely, so a big string in a slot too small may pop out of its slot. Usually nut files are made to match specific string gauges so you dont have to guess, but this also means the nut will be made for a specific string size and may be less effective with other gauges. Again, just go slow, get all the proper tools, check your work constantly and you'll be fine.

Hi Draconomics,
Great advice! Now I do know how to sand the nut base. I plan to buy the PRS core nut that is preslotted, do I have to file the nut slot again? Or it's ready to be installed directly? I don't have any tool to check if it's matched with the fretboard radius.

 

[Draconomics]

Hi Draconomics,
Great advice! Now I do know how to sand the nut base. I plan to buy the PRS core nut that is preslotted, do I have to file the nut slot again? Or it's ready to be installed directly? I don't have any tool to check if it's matched with the fretboard radius.

On these nuts, probably not. They are specifically made for PRS neck carves, so they should already have slot compensation to match a typical 10" radius too, which I believe is generally the same radius on most cores.

BTW, if you do need to sand the nut down, use 220G or 180G paper. I wouldnt use anything coarser than that. I also highly suggest to get a string action ruler if you dont have one. You can buy those most places, I got one from Amazon. As far as how much you material you need to remove from the base of the nut, the way I Iearned from a local luthier who taught me is, considering your frets are level beforehand, ideally you want the strings very close to the top of the first fret, nearly kissing it. So, keep a string on and every so often place the nut on the guitar, put a string in its slot, and check your work with the ruler. On my SE 35th I think I keep around a half millimeter of clearance at the first fret, same as my SE Paul's guitar. Again, take your time with the installation, have proper measuring tools beforehand, and you'll be fine.

 

[Yosua Wijaya]

On these nuts, probably not. They are specifically made for PRS neck carves, so they should already have slot compensation to match a typical 10" radius too, which I believe is generally the same radius on most cores.

BTW, if you do need to sand the nut down, use 220G or 180G paper. I wouldnt use anything coarser than that. I also highly suggest to get a string action ruler if you dont have one. You can buy those most places, I got one from Amazon. As far as how much you material you need to remove from the base of the nut, the way I Iearned from a local luthier who taught me is, considering your frets are level beforehand, ideally you want the strings very close to the top of the first fret, nearly kissing it. So, keep a string on and every so often place the nut on the guitar, put a string in its slot, and check your work with the ruler. On my SE 35th I think I keep around a half millimeter of clearance at the first fret, same as my SE Paul's guitar. Again, take your time with the installation, have proper measuring tools beforehand, and you'll be fine.

Glad to hear that because now I don't need to worry about the fretboard radius

The technique that your local luthier taught me is assuming that the guitar is well setup?? I think there are some factors that affect the distance of the string to the frets; the action, the neck relief/truss rod adjustment, and the nut's height. I'm afraid that my guitar isn't well setup because the first time I received it, my high E and B string is buzzing on the first fret. So with so little knowledge and without any tools, I just looked up on the internet and adjust the truss rod until the buzz is gone.

I'm thinking to sand the new nut until its height is the same as the installed nut, what do you think about that??

 

[Draconomics]

Glad to hear that because now I don't need to worry about the fretboard radius

The technique that your local luthier taught me is assuming that the guitar is well setup?? I think there are some factors that affect the distance of the string to the frets; the action, the neck relief/truss rod adjustment, and the nut's height. I'm afraid that my guitar isn't well setup because the first time I received it, my high E and B string is buzzing on the first fret. So with so little knowledge and without any tools, I just looked up on the internet and adjust the truss rod until the buzz is gone.

I'm thinking to sand the new nut until its height is the same as the installed nut, what do you think about that??

So when I'm talking about the string height, I'm talking about only at the first fret and the first fret should be level with everyone else, not higher or shorter. This is only for setting the height of the nut, nothing else. The height above the first is pretty much only going to be affected by the nut, unless your action down the line ends up in telephone pole wire territory. As far as sanding it the same height as the first, I would instead sand it to where you get proper clearance above the first fret. The new nut may have shallower or deeper string cuts,

Now, the truss rod...oh dear, dont mess with that yet. If youre getting buzzing at the first fret, and the first fret only, then that's probably not from the neck being back bowed so you may not have need of a rod adjustment. The sign of needing a rod adjustment is if you get buzzing further up nearly to the middle of the board, thats a sign of backbowing. In my experience, first fret buzz is either caused by a high fret thats popped out or a nut that has been gouged into by the strings (more likely). That is to say, because the nut is not super hard, the strings may have gouged their way down into the nut and have effectively lowered their clearance so much they are right on top of the first fret. Before you do any truss rod adjusting, make sure you get some feeler gauges. PRS lists optimal recommendations for how much relief you should get, and it should be between .005-.010" at the 8th fret when you capo the 1st, and hold down on the last fret. Truss rod adjustments on a new guitar should generally only be done to compensate for climate acclimation or a bad initial setup. Generally, setups on SEs are pretty good. My PG basically has the same setup values as when I got it save for very minor tweaks.

 

[Draconomics]

Little update: So, I went for it and did a fret level myself. I took about four hours today and checked all the frets with a fine comb. I thought there were two problem frets...nope, seven. It was'nt an easy job, taking material off with a fine grinding stone that I use for sharpening fine blades, then working up to 8000 grit paper for polishing, but it looks like a success. The action basically got halved, and it feels like the inhibitions the guitar had before are gone. So with that and the new Tusq nut, I'd say 95% of the issues I had are now gone. All I need next is a wood cover for the trem springs, a truss cover, and new knobbies then all upgrades will be complete.

 

[Alnus Rubra]

Great news

 

[bodia]

Little update: So, I went for it and did a fret level myself. I took about four hours today and checked all the frets with a fine comb. I thought there were two problem frets...nope, seven. It was'nt an easy job, taking material off with a fine grinding stone that I use for sharpening fine blades, then working up to 8000 grit paper for polishing, but it looks like a success. The action basically got halved, and it feels like the inhibitions the guitar had before are gone. So with that and the new Tusq nut, I'd say 95% of the issues I had are now gone. All I need next is a wood cover for the trem springs, a truss cover, and new knobbies then all upgrades will be complete.

Nice!

 

[Yosua Wijaya]

So when I'm talking about the string height, I'm talking about only at the first fret and the first fret should be level with everyone else, not higher or shorter. This is only for setting the height of the nut, nothing else. The height above the first is pretty much only going to be affected by the nut, unless your action down the line ends up in telephone pole wire territory. As far as sanding it the same height as the first, I would instead sand it to where you get proper clearance above the first fret. The new nut may have shallower or deeper string cuts,

Now, the truss rod...oh dear, dont mess with that yet. If youre getting buzzing at the first fret, and the first fret only, then that's probably not from the neck being back bowed so you may not have need of a rod adjustment. The sign of needing a rod adjustment is if you get buzzing further up nearly to the middle of the board, thats a sign of backbowing. In my experience, first fret buzz is either caused by a high fret thats popped out or a nut that has been gouged into by the strings (more likely). That is to say, because the nut is not super hard, the strings may have gouged their way down into the nut and have effectively lowered their clearance so much they are right on top of the first fret. Before you do any truss rod adjusting, make sure you get some feeler gauges. PRS lists optimal recommendations for how much relief you should get, and it should be between .005-.010" at the 8th fret when you capo the 1st, and hold down on the last fret. Truss rod adjustments on a new guitar should generally only be done to compensate for climate acclimation or a bad initial setup. Generally, setups on SEs are pretty good. My PG basically has the same setup values as when I got it save for very minor tweaks.

Hi Drac,
Now I got what you mean, it's important to have the proper nut height before the installation because it could ruin every setup that comes after that! I just changed my knobs and pickup rings, but I don't have any courage for now to change the nut; maybe sometime later if I have the confidence!
Anyway, do you know if the PRS pickup is compatible with our SE?? I'm thinking about upgrading the pickups but I'm not sure if it's compatible since our SE have different wiring

 

[dogrocketp]

Keep in mind, you should be checking the nut height ON the guitar frequently, not trying to presand it to the height of the old nut. Also, be sure to watch as many videos on YouTube as possible to learn.

 

[mtnman82]

That's one of the nicest one's I've seen! I got one of the black/gold and might have to get one of the blue ones then sell the black/gold...

You could put any 4-wire humbucker in these guitars and wire it the same. What you will be losing is the 'tuned-capacitance' part of the system, which I believe is what Paul did with helping make the tapped mode sound like a true single coil and also having the minimal volume difference between humbucker and single coil modes. That being said, I've personally always wired the coil tap on a humbucker by grounding the taps between the coils; whereas the TCI system actually floats the slug coil (i.e. isolates the slug coil). One could certainly wire any 4-conductor humbucker this way. It'd be interesting to see how some Duncan's sound tapped in this manner for example. I'm Paul make a tweak or two and sprinkled his magic fairy dust on things to make everything just right.

To be honest Dracon', I usually change the pickups out on my guitars. Have been doing so for 40 years and have tried a lot of different stuff over the years. I bought the guitar with the intent of replacing the pickups as part of the overall setup process. After hearing them, I will keep them. I think there are some nicer sounding pickups out there to be sure, but for the versatility and range of tone this system provides, you'd be hard pressed to beat it.

==break break==

When you guys are talking measuring string height at the first fret, are you measuring with the string pressed between the second and third frets correct?

 

[Draconomics]

That's one of the nicest one's I've seen! I got one of the black/gold and might have to get one of the blue ones then sell the black/gold...

You could put any 4-wire humbucker in these guitars and wire it the same. What you will be losing is the 'tuned-capacitance' part of the system, which I believe is what Paul did with helping make the tapped mode sound like a true single coil and also having the minimal volume difference between humbucker and single coil modes. That being said, I've personally always wired the coil tap on a humbucker by grounding the taps between the coils; whereas the TCI system actually floats the slug coil (i.e. isolates the slug coil). One could certainly wire any 4-conductor humbucker this way. It'd be interesting to see how some Duncan's sound tapped in this manner for example. I'm Paul make a tweak or two and sprinkled his magic fairy dust on things to make everything just right.
To be honest Dracon', I usually change the pickups out on my guitars. Have been doing so for 40 years and have tried a lot of different stuff over the years. I bought the guitar with the intent of replacing the pickups as part of the overall setup process. After hearing them, I will keep them. I think there are some nicer sounding pickups out there to be sure, but for the versatility and range of tone this system provides, you'd be hard pressed to beat it.

==break break==

When you guys are talking measuring string height at the first fret, are you measuring with the string pressed between the second and third frets correct?

Thanks! It really is a nice looking one. SE's can be a bit of a treasure hunt trying to find those stellar ones. Its a fun hunt though. I actually was going to do the same and replace the pups, I mean I've done it with any SE I've gotten, but these are really nice pups. I think its what the SE line was really missing. To my ears, most stock SE pups are...erm. Middling. My only gripe now is the nut.

Also, when I mentioned first fret string height at 1st fret, I've always measured it straight without pressing the string down anywhere which at least for me seems to work, probably only because the overall action is kept really low so the angle from nut to bridge isnt far from being nearly parallel with the fretboard. I've heard of people holding down the third and using a feeler gauge at the first, and I've tried that too. Another one I heard was to fret at the first, measure the clearance on the second fret, and use that as your first fret clearance value. I think maybe a more accurate way might be to measure the fretboard thickness, the first fret height, and add a clearance amount, and that value would be the height of the nut under the slots. I'm trying that method on a new blank Tusq nut for another axe, while trying my hand at slotting it. Usually I buy pre slotted ones.

 

[Yosua Wijaya]

That's one of the nicest one's I've seen! I got one of the black/gold and might have to get one of the blue ones then sell the black/gold...

You could put any 4-wire humbucker in these guitars and wire it the same. What you will be losing is the 'tuned-capacitance' part of the system, which I believe is what Paul did with helping make the tapped mode sound like a true single coil and also having the minimal volume difference between humbucker and single coil modes. That being said, I've personally always wired the coil tap on a humbucker by grounding the taps between the coils; whereas the TCI system actually floats the slug coil (i.e. isolates the slug coil). One could certainly wire any 4-conductor humbucker this way. It'd be interesting to see how some Duncan's sound tapped in this manner for example. I'm Paul make a tweak or two and sprinkled his magic fairy dust on things to make everything just right.

To be honest Dracon', I usually change the pickups out on my guitars. Have been doing so for 40 years and have tried a lot of different stuff over the years. I bought the guitar with the intent of replacing the pickups as part of the overall setup process. After hearing them, I will keep them. I think there are some nicer sounding pickups out there to be sure, but for the versatility and range of tone this system provides, you'd be hard pressed to beat it.

==break break==

When you guys are talking measuring string height at the first fret, are you measuring with the string pressed between the second and third frets correct?

Hi mtnman82,
The TCI pickup sounds great but I'm still looking the tone that I want. I'm planning to replace the TCI system with the PRS 59/09 pickups. It has 3 wire (Red, Black, and White) and one braided wire (which I don't know what wire is this). Can you suggest how to wire the PRS 59/09 pickups?? I'm getting confused on mini toggle switch part.

 

[mtnman82]

Have you tried using the tone knob? Seriously, I'm not being sarcastic... I have a core McCarty P22 with the 59/09's, they are a more mellow pickup.

The braid is shield. Is the braid around a wire? The TCI system fully isolates a single coil when splitting, which requires access to all 4 conductors - i.e. the + and - of each coil. It sounds like the 59/09's only bring out 3 wires which are most likely (but not guaranteed) the + (positive off the 'top' coil), the tap (two coils tied together, middle of the two coils) and the - (negative off the bottom coil). In this case you can still tap the coils - i.e. ground out the unused coil (which is not the same as isolating a coil). Most guitars with the coil tap are done using this method. You can still use the existing mini-toggles but you would only need one of the poles on each switch to leave the tap alone (humbucker) or ground it (tapped).

 

[Yosua Wijaya]

Have you tried using the tone knob? Seriously, I'm not being sarcastic... I have a core McCarty P22 with the 59/09's, they are a more mellow pickup.

The braid is shield. Is the braid around a wire? The TCI system fully isolates a single coil when splitting, which requires access to all 4 conductors - i.e. the + and - of each coil. It sounds like the 59/09's only bring out 3 wires which are most likely (but not guaranteed) the + (positive off the 'top' coil), the tap (two coils tied together, middle of the two coils) and the - (negative off the bottom coil). In this case you can still tap the coils - i.e. ground out the unused coil (which is not the same as isolating a coil). Most guitars with the coil tap are done using this method. You can still use the existing mini-toggles but you would only need one of the poles on each switch to leave the tap alone (humbucker) or ground it (tapped).

I'm using the tone knob, and what's wrong with 59/09 pickup? Are they sound inferior to TCI S pickups? I do some research and I like the sound; little bit warmer and more power than TCI S.

Oh okay I understand the wiring now, seems easier than 4 wire conductor hehe. What are you going to do for the braided wire? Solder to ground?

 

[mtnman82]

nothing at all wrong with the 59/09's. Yes they are warmer, but I'm not sure if they're that much hotter than the TCI S. For me, I can get the mellow sound I want by backing off the volume or rolling off the treble with the tone knob.

Yes, braid goes to ground. Simply grounding the tap is easier than isolating the coil, but then you're not isolating the split coil. You may like the sound better that way. In the end, it's about what you want your sound to be.

 

[Peter Frank Zammetti]

I have only owned a Paul Allender bat fretboard model (White burst) and I called her my ghost. It was my favorite guitar in the world. Hopefully one day I will get to own a US model but after looking at the new 2019 versions in the store I see the quality of both older Korean and the new Indonesian models are very similar. I only preferred the Korean made ones because I felt they were the lightest.