People should stop obsessing about guitars being made in USA

[Abe]

I'm gonna have to get me some of that Stanhope content! Never saw the guy before (nor heard of him), but he is talkin' my language, including the shirt ;~)) Thanks for sharing!!

Well I didn't even read that shirt until you pointed it out. LoL. I thought it was like a Florida Marlins shirt with a Statue of Liberty on it, hehe.

I found --->> "Doug Stanhope says that libertarianism was a phase he went through, but described himself as an anarchist in 2017." <<--

To me he's kinda like a Bill Hicks, George Carlin, etc. Like a Comedian version of a Shaman, doing his work to point out some absurdities, which, as you'll see checking out some more of his videos, even with the smoking and drinking, he has done quite well.

It's not a representation of a hard-line stance of mine on imported guitars of course, LoL, but I always appreciate the 360° thoughtfulness some people bring to the table, because it's needed.

Human beings all over the world. The resources from which all guitars are made harvested and gathered from all over the world. And everything from competition, Us vs Them, and downright strong-arming each other out of bigger slices of pie to get more thanksgiving wishbone to one's 'side' in hopes to get so far ahead that you can't be brought back down again. It's all an insecurity really, and unfortunate. I could think of more evolved ways for people to learn to handle the whole thing.

I cannot personally relate to being a side with higher amounts of dollars and larger need to inherit the identity of whatever is around where I land in this world. The materials to make guitars and everything else, aside from the part of creativity that comes from within, here and there, were gathered from worldwide sources as resources. We should always learn to ongoingly do better with the best of possibilities.

 

[kipkohl]

As far as core vs SE, country of origin has little to do with quality. The fact that one is a “budget” brand has everything to do with it. Even so, they are high quality guitars, not core quality, but they were never meant to be.

 

[dogrocketp]

Americans are not getting jobs when we buy overseas things. Buckle up, it’s going to get worse on the employment scene.

 

[TheCraftsman]

As far as core vs SE, country of origin has little to do with quality. The fact that one is a “budget” brand has everything to do with it. Even so, they are high quality guitars, not core quality, but they were never meant to be.

Now owning both 3 SE and just obtained a core I can confirm the quality in feel and sound is clear

 

[Big Owl]

It all comes down to our government allowing this to happen. We have all been sold out by our government and even each other. I have 0 Chinese guitars and that's how I like it.

 

[Wyzard]

We have all been sold out by our government

Are you entirely unaware of the motives that drive offshoring, and which entities are actually doing it?

Not to mention: you made a political statement where none is permitted. Fortunately, you're off the hook for this one, as you've attributed political characteristics to economic actions.

 

[PeteRS]

I agree with this. I think the hard pill to swallow is that guitar manufacturing in places like Korea, China, and Indonesia has really closed the gap in quality with US-made stuff. Look at Gibson and Epiphone - if Epiphones had Gibson headstocks, the only people who'd buy Gibsons would be dentists who just want to say they have a Gibson while making chit-chat on the 9th hole. Maybe I'm off base but that's how I feel - Gibson headstocks look better and that's the one thing that puts me off Epiphones. Other than that, Gibson (owned by a private equity firm) cannot really justify Gibson prices and everyone knows that. PRS, on the other hand, has a much better case for their pricing.

 

[SinSir]

if Epiphones had Gibson headstocks, the only people who'd buy Gibsons would be dentists who just want to say they have a Gibson while making chit-chat on the 9th hole. Maybe I'm off base but that's how I feel - Gibson headstocks look better and that's the one thing that puts me off Epiphones.

Epi now has a line with a Gibson shaped headstock

 

[PXR5]

He isn't wrong, though I hope this isn't a precursor to PRS moving production out of the U.S.

I think thats likely with S2 guitars getting so expensive for most people and the SE guitars getting gradually better and suck good value.
The core guitars are just to expensive to buy new and used examples are really out of my price range now.
So what happens if Private stock stays made in USA plus maybe limited run special guitars and upper end signature guitars.
Then Core guitar methods and woods are used in a high quality PRS owned factory where labour is lower cost as well as overheads. Price about £1850 to £3000 new then the S2 range becomes surplus.
I still remember an early S2 I played didn't feel or resonate like my Mcarty did. Probably they are better now but I'd rather PRS Core which is a little plainer or new or a used but still good Core as it will more likely retain more value. The S2 seem to struggle and drop in value quite a bit sometimes nearly SE new money.
Plus I still not sure I want the non recessed back plates or offshore parts or the scarfe joint.
A well made real Core spec guitar made in a good factory would be a good option.

 

[PXR5]

My thoughts exactly. It's such an obvious statement to make that it makes me wonder if there are plans to shift production completely overseas at some point. Otherwise, trying to raise the reputation of your international product lines by blaming your primary customers about their perceived biases is a bold move indeed.

Especially considering that you helped create these biases via your own marketing of the American product as being a premium tier in both craftsmanship and quality components for years. I'm sure there are skilled guitar makers working over at Yamaha as well. Will Paul sit down for an interview to talk about how people shouldn't obsess over the PRS name and buy a Revstar because the guitar maker does not matter much? Silly.

I have a Yamaha SG1820 which plays great and sustains well and sounds good for me. Most of my guitars get modified in some way. Locking tuners, pickups, wiring and pots. Even my Mcarty for about 2003 had Locking tuners fitted and the coil split set to be just the neck pickup. Can't remember if I changed the pots out for more linear ones.
The SE s Locking Tuners, others like some Patrick Eggles had pickups and one a replacement bridge. The SG1820 is stock. No desire to change a thing. My Pacifica 311H stock. Having said that the Singlecut standard Natural/satin will have new pickups fitted and probably wiring and pots. The pickups are way to hot for me. So a PRS Core made in Japan would be fine or maybe one made in Europe. The woods and materials need to be the same as USA core though.

 

[dogrocketp]

I don’t believe European labor is any cheaper than American.

 

[PXR5]

I don’t believe European labor is any cheaper than American.

In a lot of Eastern European countries it certainly is cheaper labour.

 

[Ballistic]

I don’t believe European labor is any cheaper than American.

I work for a global manufacturer - most Europeans don't come close.

 

[Ballistic]

I think thats likely with S2 guitars getting so expensive for most people and the SE guitars getting gradually better and suck good value.
The core guitars are just to expensive to buy new and used examples are really out of my price range now.
So what happens if Private stock stays made in USA plus maybe limited run special guitars and upper end signature guitars.
Then Core guitar methods and woods are used in a high quality PRS owned factory where labour is lower cost as well as overheads. Price about £1850 to £3000 new then the S2 range becomes surplus.
I still remember an early S2 I played didn't feel or resonate like my Mcarty did. Probably they are better now but I'd rather PRS Core which is a little plainer or new or a used but still good Core as it will more likely retain more value. The S2 seem to struggle and drop in value quite a bit sometimes nearly SE new money.
Plus I still not sure I want the non recessed back plates or offshore parts or the scarfe joint.
A well made real Core spec guitar made in a good factory would be a good option.

Seems like an opportunity for PRS to consolidate the S2 and SE lines. If PRS could improve the quality of QC and final setup of the SE's, there would be no need for S2's. If Eastman can produce guitars in China with a high level of QC, PRS could do it and still be profitable. Of course, without S2 production in the US there goes a bunch of US jobs, but I can't imagine there's enough demand for S2 to keep it around too much longer anyway.

 

[DreamTheaterRules]

Seems like an opportunity for PRS to consolidate the S2 and SE lines. If PRS could improve the quality of QC and final setup of the SE's, there would be no need for S2's. If Eastman can produce guitars in China with a high level of QC, PRS could do it and still be profitable. Of course, without S2 production in the US there goes a bunch of US jobs, but I can't imagine there's enough demand for S2 to keep it around too much longer anyway.

Completely disagree. The S2 line should be expanded, if anything. Now that they have US electronics, they provide some great guitars that even in todays economy are affordable. The only PRS guitars I've looked at with any interest in buying in the last 2 years have been S2 models or US bolt on models. The cores have priced themselves out of my interest range.

 

[PXR5]

Completely disagree. The S2 line should be expanded, if anything. Now that they have US electronics, they provide some great guitars that even in todays economy are affordable. The only PRS guitars I've looked at with any interest in buying in the last 2 years have been S2 models or US bolt on models. The cores have priced themselves out of my interest range.

Yes cores are too expensive almost custom built prices. Andy Guyton would probably charge about £5000 or so. Others less

 

[Juan Luis Vidal]

Completely disagree. The S2 line should be expanded, if anything. Now that they have US electronics, they provide some great guitars that even in todays economy are affordable. The only PRS guitars I've looked at with any interest in buying in the last 2 years have been S2 models or US bolt on models. The cores have priced themselves out of my interest range.

I'm dying to try one of the "new" S2 with US hardware...let's see if the hit that sweet spot. I could not be happier with my CE, but the S2 line looks really interesting.

 

[PXR5]

Do you find they resonate as well as a core. I'm still mot convinced about the neck scarf joint. And uncertain about the way the s2 necks are manufactured. I'd prefer the necks to be made like the cores. But could live with moon inlays and a simple finish like the S2 have. Have them made offshore for a sale price in line with the current S2 series.
I've not played a S2 since they first came out and at the time found it not worth the extra over the SE line and way off a Core.
I recently picked up a used core Singlecut Natural fixed bridge but 2 tone 1 volume for S2 Mcarty money. The finish is very simple it's all mahogany.

 

[DreamTheaterRules]

Do you find they resonate as well as a core. I'm still mot convinced about the neck scarf joint.

It boggles the mind that this "myth" continues... There is NOTHING wrong with a scarf joint. Many of the worlds best guitars use them. Most will tell you its stronger than if the whole thing is carved out of one piece. WHY do people keep ragging on the scarf joint?

 

[TheCraftsman]

I’d rather used core than new s2, not sure where they’re taking that line and if it’s the new normal phasing out the core to a pure high end market, but even so the price of a new s2 you’d get a great used Core and I don’t understand that choice, personally is all, never played an s2, nothing against them. The SE of which I own 3 have a clear market fit, the entry to addiction and for the most part great guitars that’d beat many $ for $ value wise. The s2, pre US electrics etc made even less sense to me although I’m sure the difference is noticeable, however, now a new s2 selling at the price a new core used to go for is odd, again that’s just me. Hell if I could I’d have a rack of core but people buy guitars for different purposes, different tools different jobs, as to the question; if my Core played and sounded like it does and was built anywhere I’d still be a proud owner.