P90 vs coil-split humbucker? -GAS Flareup

[xxxadixxx]

Alright, I have been living the 3 guitar life for a few months without issues... Until recently when I started to get thoughts that a single cut with P90's would be a great addition to the pack. I am a bedroom (home office actually) player using relatively high gain (6505+ and amp sims). Much of the music I play does very well with my boosted 6505 (essentially the old 5150 after EVH was formed) and bridge hum buckers: Hatebreed, Deftones, Mastodon, Metallica, Black Sabbath, Trivium, Pennywise, etc.

My 594's and Tremonti are perfect for all of this music. Where I get into an issue is with the other side of my "range" (yes, I understand many here will say this is a very narrow range... my wife says it all sounds the same too) is when I use the same rig for other things like Bad Religion or Rancid. Bad Religion in particular, uses a lot of Les Paul Specials with P90's into Marshalls.

I can get close with my 594 using the neck pickup, but it is just not the same. I hoped coil-splitting would get me closer and it is ok but it seems to lose some of the energy. The logical solution is simply getting a guitar with P90's which would not only get closer for Bad Religion, but it would also likely sound great with Black Sabbath as well. Many Les Paul gold top's (50's standard reissue with P90) are out there and even SC PRS w/P90's come up from time to time. I do not have any direct experience with P90's and I am hoping someone here can give me a reality check. What does a P90 guitar provide over a McCarty 594 with coil-splits?

 

[dogrocketp]

I feel vaguely qualified to answer this. First, listen to “Mississippi Queen “ by Mountain. A good P90 guitar can give you mids which I can only describe as thicker and meatier than a single Coil or split. The earlier triple soapies had hot, hot, hot P90’s. With gain, they can blister paint off of walls. I think I have most of the pickup formats PRS made after 2000. P90’s are my favorite, especially with gain.

 

[Herr Squid]

A P90 is a fatter, hotter pickup than a split humbucker. By like, a lot.

 

[tiboy]

Great question OP. I’m sort of in the same boat with varying degrees of SC P90 GAS. I’m currently of a mindset to practice more and buy less. But we all know how fast that script can be flipped.

 

[Going Modal]

Generally, in order of strongest/most-powerful output to least-powerful pickups. Again, I say generally:

<stronger>
Humbucker
P90
Single Coil
Humbucker split into a single coil ("tapped" method where one coil in the HB has more windings)
Humbucker split into a single coil (traditional/basic method)
<weaker>

As others have stated, P90's will have a strong mid punch but yet retain a good clear/bright attack. IMO, any sort of split humbucker will be far from this sound. Not really a close comparison.

Some P90 sounds:
Mississippi queen (pretty much "THE" song everyone thinks about here)
Pretty much the first Weezer album (the blue abum)
The Doors
...LOTS more that I'm forgetting at the moment...

 

[xxxadixxx]

Great question OP. I’m sort of in the same boat with varying degrees of SC P90 GAS. I’m currently of a mindset to practice more and buy less. But we all know how fast that script can be flipped.

“Buy less” is definitely where my wife wants me to go on this one! I like the idea of practicing more though in my case, the more I play the more I want new sounds. I am glad to hear I am not alone on this.

 

[dmatthews]

I just packed my 594 soapy to go to practice this afternoon.
AGAIN!!!

 

[Revelation]

How about the mini humbucker in the Studio? When you don't want a full humbucking sound, the mini seems to be a great option.

 

[xxxadixxx]

@Going Modal Great information and I think you are addressing my issue directly. With your list, coil-split humbuckers in my 594's will just not get to the output of the P90, correct? I keep coming back to that same conclusion as well.

Thanks for the music recommendations. I checked out Mississippi Woman (which I had never heard) and the raspy/hot guitar tone is pretty cool. You had me when you mentioned Weezer's Blue Album.

This forum always gives great information though it generally leads to me buying more guitars! Let's see where this idea takes us. Thanks all.

 

[Going Modal]

@Going Modal...coil-split humbuckers in my 594's will just not get to the output of the P90, correct?

Correct, yeah. Coil-split humbuckers usually don't give much "oomph" or muscle... or, at least not as much as a P90 itself.

The only exception to this--where the coil-split humbuckers actually sound good--would be in my 408 model (and I suppose it would also be true in the Paul's Guitar model). Those pickups sound like really good humbuckers in humbucker mode, and pretty good single coils in single-coil mode.

OR check out some Seymour Duncan "P-Rails," where it's a "humbucker" that splits into a P90-like thing. Kind of interesting. Seem like they'd be cool, but I've never tried them.

 

[László]

By coincidence, I just posted this thing I wrote a couple of years ago on the amp section of the forum 'cause folks wanted to know about the DG30.

The two guitars are my 594 Soapbar taking the first solo, and the 594 with humbuckers taking the second solo. Unfortunately, the coils aren't split on the 594 humbucker, but I think you'll hear the difference between the two types of pickups immediately. I used the bridge pickups on both guitars.

Both guitars are played through the DG30 on identical settings. The Rhythm guitar is also the Soapy on the neck pickup.

You won't mistake one for the other, it's not even close. A clip is worth 1000 words. My caveat is that the music I play isn't anything like the music you play, so this is only a demo of what the pickups sound like.

https://soundcloud.com/lschefman%2Fmessy-22

 

[RickP]

By coincidence, I just posted this thing I wrote a couple of years ago on the amp section of the forum 'cause folks wanted to know about the DG30.

The two guitars are my 594 Soapbar taking the first solo, and the 594 with humbuckers taking the second solo. Unfortunately, the coils aren't split on the 594 humbucker, but I think you'll hear the difference between the two types of pickups immediately. I used the bridge pickups on both guitars.

Both guitars are played through the DG30 on identical settings. The Rhythm guitar is also the Soapy on the neck pickup.

You won't mistake one for the other, it's not even close. A clip is worth 1000 words.

https://soundcloud.com/lschefman%2Fmessy-22

Dude! You so read my mind. I was literally typing a reply recommending he check with you because you had a direct comparison already recorded! Spooky.

This is the best answer to the question, and why the 594 Soapbar is the one to get. Proper P90 tone.

 

[László]

Dude! You so read my mind. I was literally typing a reply recommending he check with you because you had a direct comparison already recorded! Spooky.

This is the best answer to the question, and why the 594 Soapbar is the one to get. Proper P90 tone.

Rick, you are SO right. The pickups truly have the vibe of the original P-90s on my 1965 SG Special, only the 594 sounds a lot better. A whole lot better!

 

[dogrocketp]

Correct, yeah. Coil-split humbuckers usually don't give much "oomph" or muscle... or, at least not as much as a P90 itself.

The only exception to this--where the coil-split humbuckers actually sound good--would be in my 408 model (and I suppose it would also be true in the Paul's Guitar model). Those pickups sound like really good humbuckers in humbucker mode, and pretty good single coils in single-coil mode.

OR check out some Seymour Duncan "P-Rails," where it's a "humbucker" that splits into a P90-like thing. Kind of interesting. Seem like they'd be cool, but I've never tried them.

My 408 has great split sounds, my soapies have even better sounds. I also have an SE Singlecut with P90’s that was my first PRS. I tried the p-rails in an SE, and they didn’t do it for me. Too generic in every mode. That meant the only reasonable solution was to buy one of each…….

 

[Gtrbldr]

By coincidence, I just posted this thing I wrote a couple of years ago on the amp section of the forum 'cause folks wanted to know about the DG30.

The two guitars are my 594 Soapbar taking the first solo, and the 594 with humbuckers taking the second solo. Unfortunately, the coils aren't split on the 594 humbucker, but I think you'll hear the difference between the two types of pickups immediately. I used the bridge pickups on both guitars.

Both guitars are played through the DG30 on identical settings. The Rhythm guitar is also the Soapy on the neck pickup.

You won't mistake one for the other, it's not even close. A clip is worth 1000 words. My caveat is that the music I play isn't anything like the music you play, so this is only a demo of what the pickups sound like.

https://soundcloud.com/lschefman%2Fmessy-22

Thnx for posting.

Funny thing is that my McSoapy sounds radically different. Granted, replaced the hi output Duncan's with low output wolfetones, but they have a lot more chime compared to my 57/08 loaded cu24. I was really surprised to hear this difference

 

[xxxadixxx]

@LSchefman first off, awesome playing! Second, this is such a cool comparison. It does a great job of comparing the two. I love it. The almost gnarly tone of the P90 stands out against the smoother humbucker. Both sound great though it really shows how different they are. Thank you so much.

 

[phoenixbt]

This thread is dangerous - I already own a 594 and now I want a soap bar…

 

[RickP]

This thread is dangerous - I already own a 594 and now I want a soap bar…

It’s a great mate to the excellent 58/15LT-equipped 594. Close enough to only require a quick tweak to your amp (and, as Les shows, you can go without it and enjoy the difference), but clearly different enough to add something really musical and authentic to your arsenal.

Not that we‘re known for gear acquisition enabling here…

 

[xxxadixxx]

This thread is dangerous - I already own a 594 and now I want a soap bar…

Welcome to my world. I got my first 594 in October and the forum quickly taught me how different the SC is from the DC…. My SC arrived in March. They are both fantastic but the SC is the clear winner for me. Now I am leaning towards digging around for a 3rd 594 now another SC with P90’s.

Several Posters indicated the 594 is the best guitar out there and I am double fisting that Kool Aid all day. Such a pleasure to play. I am just trying to space out the purchases a bit better….

 

[phoenixbt]

Welcome to my world. I got my first 594 in October and the forum quickly taught me how different the SC is from the DC…. My SC arrived in March. They are both fantastic but the SC is the clear winner for me. Now I am leaning towards digging around for a 3rd 594 now another SC with P90’s.

Several Posters indicated the 594 is the best guitar out there and I am double fisting that Kool Aid all day. Such a pleasure to play. I am just trying to space out the purchases a bit better….

Lol I hear you. I’ve had my core 594 dc for awhile and just recently got a DGT and I also have a MEV on order…while waiting for that I’ve been eyeing a 35th anniversary custom 24, but now this 594 soapbar has hit the radar. Down the rabbit hole we continue