NGD Wood Library DGT but kind of a let down

Proteus

Tru-Arc Bridgeworks
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I think one of the solutions is, look at how high end (and some low end) cars are shipped! They are covered in sticky film that protects the paint job from being blemished in shipping and at dealer. So that stuff should not come off until the final consumer has received and approved the product. I would argue that PRS should start doing something similar. All finished surfaces are covered with some clear contact paper (static applied, no glues) that peels off. When a dealer gets it, that stuff stays on. They do set up, etc with that contact paper still intact. And I would say it should even be shipped to the customer with that contact paper still intact. Then if the consumer removes it, they have accepted the guitar as being new and without blemishes. If consumer returns it with contact paper removed, the customer takes the hit. Now if they receive the guitar and the contact paper already has scratches, dents and marks on it (and have done an unboxing video) OR after removing the contact paper they find flaws or can even see flaws through the contact paper (once again, video would be paramount here to verify the removal of that paper exposing flaws), then it is all on the dealer INCLUDING SHIPPING IMO! If a dealer receives one with similar contact paper flaws (or flaws visible beneath clear paper), they can contact PRS and tell them something is not right and work it out amongst themselves.
I like this idea. It addresses a myriad of issues along the supply chain from builder to PRS to retailer to customer. If it's true that SEs all go to Stevensville first for inspection and setup as needed, I would argue that a film should be applied at the manufacturer for PRS to remove and inspect. If there's a problem under the film, it's a demerit for Cort or [insert other contractor name]. Accountability. (Though surely there's an accountability protocol now.) PRS fixes it and puts on the final film, which protects it from there down to the end user.

It's bound to be tedious, though - fitting top, back, round of neck, two sides of the headstock (with strings). That sounds like several films, no doubt die-cut around knobs, etc for each model. Then the rim of the guitar is another issue...I suppose a long thin wrap goes from heel around to heel - with holes for strap pins and jack.

Adds some expense too - but if implemented, it's the Safe Spex Protocol, the accountability prophylactic.
 

docteurseb

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I think one of the solutions is, look at how high end (and some low end) cars are shipped! They are covered in sticky film that protects the paint job from being blemished in shipping and at dealer. So that stuff should not come off until the final consumer has received and approved the product. I would argue that PRS should start doing something similar.
In theory it sounds good, but based on the false premise that every guitar coming out of the factory is flawless.
PRS has probably the highest Q/C in this industry, but odd stuff slips through the cracks once in a while. I got one such specimen on a Wood Library MEV last year that left me scratching my head.
 

Proteus

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And yeah, I see your back worming. I've had numerous "mint" and "excellent" guitars lately with scratches through the clearcoat, skin-breaking gouges and outright wood dents, wiring issues, and egregious setup disasters - all of which tell the guitar's whole story and (in the case of the electrical and setup goobers) explain why the guitar is back on the market.

In some cases, no doubt innocent and clueless owners simply didn't know what was wrong; in others, either the users or dealers (or both) just plain blatantly minimize the issues. I've seen big patches of finish missing down to the wood called "small blemish," chunks described as "chips", etc. And when you see an ad that says guitar may need set up to your preference and by the way, sold as is and no returns, you just KNOW what you're in for.

Or, as the sign says: We buy junk; we sell antiques.
 
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Proteus

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In theory it sounds good, but based on the false premise that every guitar coming out of the factory is flawless.
Well, that's why the factory gets to apply their own protective film: any faults beneath that belong to them.

I recently got a long-awaited mid-priced guitar which had an outright paint run on the heel. Not glaringly obvious - it's the back of the guitar, after all, and a highly reflective metallic paint. But not hard to find either, and not what one expects on a 1,500.00 guitar. It was obviously a failure in the paint booth, followed by QC failures at the factory, the American distributor and brand-name owner (who purports to do thorough inspection and setups here) - AND at the dealer.

In this case, the beleagured dealer graciously made it right for me; the American distributor/brand owner is in the same town as the dealer, and they know each other...but the distributor was no help at all. I believe pandemic-related disruptions come into play and may have aggravated the problem: the guitar was long-awaited and overdue for both the distributor and his dealers, and when some finally arrived (months later than hoped for), who's going to reject a paint run on the heel? I understood that finish and final setup problems have gotten more frequent in recent batches from this Korean builder, who in the past has had a reputation for pristine work. (And may regain it if and when conditions improve.)

Very much a first-world problem: overprivileged guy with way too many guitars whining about a flaw in a guitar shipped from halfway around the world, which he doesn't need. I can't legitimately complain. I just observe that while such flaws can be expected in the 200.00 - 800.00 range, where there are some excuses, they shouldn't happen when the price goes over, say, 1,000.00 (and the profit margins get higher). Production issues aside (and partially excused given current international trade conditions), it takes a certain cynicism to mass-produce mid- and high-priced brands - and then wave away and excuse poor QC. It certainly induces cynicism in We the Buyers.

Ironically, I frequently get virtually perfect guitars (at least in cosmetics and fit/finish) when buying the lower-priced spreads.
 
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docteurseb

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Well, that's why the factory gets to apply their own protective film: any faults beneath that belong to them.

how would you prove those belong to the factory in the first place considering most flaws we care about would likely not show up behind such a protective film ?
Record the entire unpacking/unwrapping and going over the guitar with a high intensity light in a single take ?
Rather unpractical don't you think ?
 

docteurseb

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Hi guys, this is my first PRS in over a decade. I previously had a custom 24 artist package and an SC 250 artist package. Both were gorgeous but I just didn't mesh with them. At first I thought maybe it was the 10" radius but over the years I started thinking maybe it was the frets. So I went with a DGT this time to give it another try. My main guitars are custom shop ESPs with jumbos so the DGT made sense. I do have a les paul custom with small frets that I get along fine with so who knows why I didn't dig the other PRSi I had. This time I wanted something less metal than my emg loaded ESPs and with more of a vintage vibe.

Anyway, I bought this guitar brand new and was a little disappointed in the finish quality. Maybe I am just being picky but the headstock, neck and back look pretty beat up for a brand new guitar. Is this typical of PRS quality now? I haven't had a chance to play it really so I can't comment on that. The top is gorgeous but everything else is a little lack luster, especially for the price. Not trying to be negative but I remember these guitars as being immaculate when brand new.






Found it, and I wasn't expecting it to be coming from this dealer from whom I bought two PRS with zero issue the past 2 years.

Your guitar though is a 2019 model, it's been there an unusually long time if you bought it only now.
I would contact them ASAP if you haven't already done so, send them the pictures saying this is unexpected for a new PRS...
 

joefods

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Found it, and I wasn't expecting it to be coming from this dealer from whom I bought two PRS with zero issue the past 2 years.

Your guitar though is a 2019 model, it's been there an unusually long time if you bought it only now.
I would contact them ASAP if you haven't already done so, send them the pictures saying this is unexpected for a new PRS...
Glad to hear it is unexpected from this dealer. They always seemed to have a decent rep in general. I tried buying from them in 2005 but we couldn't make a deal. Yes, it is a 2019 and the tag says January 2020 on it. I did know that before I purchased it. I thought it was a little odd it sat for so long but I just attributed it to the pandemic.
 

joefods

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Also, what’s “wood library” about that guitar? Brazilian board?

That’s a great top.
I do love the top and the color. That was the main factor in selecting this one. Here are the specs on it.
  • Artist Flame Maple Top
  • Lightweight Mahogany Body
  • Korina Neck
  • Brazilian Rosewood Fingerboard
  • Mother of Pearl "Old School" Bird Inlays
 

Proteus

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how would you prove those belong to the factory in the first place considering most flaws we care about would likely not show up behind such a protective film ?

Rather unpractical don't you think ?
I recognized the process could be burdensome, but my idea assumed that PRS does QC and setup on every imported guitar. In that scenario, PRS would remove the factory's envelope, do their check and setup, and re-sheath the guitar.
 

joefods

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Thanks for all the input guys. It was indeed sold as new. I sent a short email to the dealer early this morning saying I wasn’t happy with the guitars condition. I’ll update this when I hear back.
 

docteurseb

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I recognized the process could be burdensome, but my idea assumed that PRS does QC and setup on every imported guitar. In that scenario, PRS would remove the factory's envelope, do their check and setup, and re-sheath the guitar.
Again, it is then based on the false premise that every guitar coming out of the factory is flawless. That's not the case.

How could this guitar have passed Q/C and go out the factory w/o Q/C's green light:

FfdVOyk.jpg


More orange peel and lacquer splatter:
2ey2A7j.jpg

z8yGhZ9.jpg


QvtUMlG.jpg

QESMtkv.jpg



It effectively didn't get buffed in the heel area for some reason. And unless the lights were out that day it would not have been possible for Q/C not to see it.
 

joefods

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The dealer called me. They said the back is pretty typical from the buffing process. They did say the headstock is very odd and requested more photos of it. They said the guitar has never been out and it has never been sold. Their showroom has also been closed because of covid. So we shall see what happens.
 

Proteus

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How could this guitar have passed Q/C and go out the factory w/o Q/C's green light? ... unless the lights were out that day it would not have been possible for Q/C not to see it.
Yep, that's pretty blatant. From the figuring of the neck, I assume that's a Stevensville USA job. Several guys had to be asleep at the switch for that to escape the building. I hope stuff like that doesn't happen often, or I'll have to revise downward my heretofore high regard for PRS diligence and QC.

What was the resolution on that guitar?
 

docteurseb

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Yep, that's pretty blatant. From the figuring of the neck, I assume that's a Stevensville USA job. Several guys had to be asleep at the switch for that to escape the building. I hope stuff like that doesn't happen often, or I'll have to revise downward my heretofore high regard for PRS diligence and QC.

What was the resolution on that guitar?
It was a quilt top Wood Library Modern Eagle V, second hand.

Sent it back to the dealer because at the time PRS wasn't doing non-warranty work (i.e. no PTC for 'used' guitars at that time), which I understood even though the issue was from the factory.

At first I thought the original owner re-sprayed the heel/fingerboard for whatever and did a terrible job, but I sent pics to a friend and he told me he had indeed seen similar stuff being posted in recent weeks.
Later on as I was browsing Reverb I saw a brand new one and could immediately tell it had the same orange peel on the cut-away based on the light's reflection.

You now know why the notion a guitar coming out of the factory is flawless now makes me chuckle a little bit.
Luckily, it is true the vast majority of the time.

BTW, the original dealer (not the one I bought it used from) is the one with the amazing 55-point inspection, so now you know how bogus their inspection is.
 

AaeCee

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It was from a very reputable signature dealer. I believe I will have to eat shipping costs both ways sending it back. I figured they would know how to take care of a guitar. But if this is not normal, I will send them a message and see what they want to do.
It's beyond "not normal", and I would demand either a full refund for all costs including shipping, or an agreeable discount, as well as a link to this thread to PRS. They will not be pleased with this treatment.
 

Andrew Paul

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Again, it is then based on the false premise that every guitar coming out of the factory is flawless. That's not the case.

How could this guitar have passed Q/C and go out the factory w/o Q/C's green light:

FfdVOyk.jpg


More orange peel and lacquer splatter:
2ey2A7j.jpg

z8yGhZ9.jpg


QvtUMlG.jpg

QESMtkv.jpg



It effectively didn't get buffed in the heel area for some reason. And unless the lights were out that day it would not have been possible for Q/C not to see it.
OUCH. I remember that
 

Andrew Paul

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The dealer called me. They said the back is pretty typical from the buffing process. They did say the headstock is very odd and requested more photos of it. They said the guitar has never been out and it has never been sold. Their showroom has also been closed because of covid. So we shall see what happens.
That sucks.... keep us posted. I've never seen that on a new guitar. I wonder if it can be buffed out. If not, return it and hold them accountable. Hang in there
 
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