Neck heavy solution?

[Doug Edwards]

I have a 2018 PRS SE Santana that too neck heavy for my taste. (bought used online) The man who set it up told me that replacing the tuners might help. It makes sense. Then I started asking Google. There was a solution put forward for the Gibson SG where a button was placed on the heel.
Has anyone done this on a SG or PRS? Did it work?
Thanks... Doug

 

[CatStrangler]

Are the tuner buttons metal? even a change to plastic or wood can make a difference. The tone will change bit as well...I find heavier headstocks to be more compressed and scooped...YMMV

 

[SinSir]

Lighter tuners and buttons help. A rough strap back makes it almost a non issue though. There was a time I was an SG guy. I've read guys putting weight on the heel and relocating strap buttons. Try the rough back strap first.

 

[DISTORT6]

Try putting wheel weights in the control cavity.
Like these:

 

[Nice F Holes]

You can take the buttons off the tuners to see what kind of effect lighter tuners would have. If it’s enough you can use ebony or plastic tuner buttons which weigh Al,ost nothing, and not have to change actual tuners. If it’s a slight imbalance a suede strap works well. If it’s very neck heavy a grippy strap starts just pulling your shirt with it (my Epiphone Alleykat was like that.)

Moving the strap button: it depends on the geometry of the guitar and how you hold it, so what works for one guitar may not (probably won’t) work for another. Here’s a post that explains it pretty well (post #14):

Moving Strap Buttons.

Hi all, has anyone moved there rear central strap button to the old skool rear position (up a bit on the rear of the bass)? I've recently reaquired a 5 sting Jazzman and initially had a problem with neck dive and heard that moving the position of the rear strap button to the older position helps...

forum.warwickforum.com

What that doesn’t show is how the strap wraps around your body, ie if the strap isn’t actually vertical depending on how you hold the guitar. Sometimes it’s the strap wanting to move sideways to get vertical that causes the motion.

Personally, if the suede strap isn’t enough my second choice is weight on the strap. Some people use/like wireless rigs for this because of the battery pack on the strap.

 

[ViperDoc]

Relocating the strap button on a PRS Santana will make your problem worse. The Chibson SG heel is forward of the very shallow upper horns of that body design, so for that guitar, relocating the button to the heel works, as much as it can. Removing the tuner buttons to test the effect is a fabulous, easy and reversible test. Lighter tuner buttons could affect it. Weighting the control cavity is a cool idea, except that the Santana cavity is very small and doesn't have much room to spare. Just take care of where you try that to not create unintentional grounds, etc. when the plate is secured.

Perhaps the best way to easily address this is to add weight to the bottom end of your guitar strap. There used to be a product called "Heads Up" that addresses the SG problem specifically, but they don't seem to be made anymore. Maybe check Reverb. Here's an old photo:

The other thing you could consider is to take your guitar to a very skilled luthier and have your guitar neck reshaped/reduced and refinished. Even removing finish to a satin feel could be a start, but all of this is not reversible at all except for refinishing, and could be expensive.

Good luck!

 

[László]

The most elegant solution to all hardware problems is either Velcro, duck tape, or both.

You could, for example, stick some Velcro on the back of the guitar, and some Velcro on your belt. Attach guitar body to belt by mating the Velcro, and voila!

You’re good to go unless your pants fall down!

“You’ve done this?”

“Of course not. Sensible advice isn’t entertaining. It’s way more fun to go weird.”

“What’s your duck tape idea, then?”

“It involves duck taping a helium balloon to the headstock.”

“What’s the advantage over the Velcro solution?”

“At some point in the concert you can inhale the helium and have a funny voice.”

“You probably shouldn’t have inhaled anything tonight yourself.”

“True. I’m having trouble getting the duck tape adhesive out of my nose.”

 

[Tony M.]

Attach a short bungee cord from the bottom strap button to your pedalboard.
The only drawback is you have to keep your foot on the board at all times to
prevent the board from jumping up and hitting you in the knee.

 

[aphantomvaper]

Find an attractive counterpart to gently "lift" the guitar neck when drooping, like a Magicians assistant.

Or....they could be unattractive I guess. You just don't want no droopy guitar! Hee hee...

 

[ViperDoc]

Find an attractive counterpart to gently "lift" the guitar neck when drooping, like a Magicians assistant.

Or....they could be unattractive I guess. You just don't want no droopy guitar! Hee hee...

I like where this is going. The chick in my avatar says "NO" to droopy wood! See?

 

[Doug Edwards]

Are the tuner buttons metal? even a change to plastic or wood can make a difference. The tone will change bit as well...I find heavier headstocks to be more compressed and scooped...YMMV

Thanks for the reply!
They are standard PRS tuners, metal. From what I could find out they weigh 12.8 oz. The guitar weighs 113.6 oz. That is almost a 1/10th the weight of the guitar. Gotoh weigh 6 oz. so almost 1/20th the guitar weight.
I am going to add 6 oz fishing weights to the bottom side and see how that balances out.

 

[Doug Edwards]

You can take the buttons off the tuners to see what kind of effect lighter tuners would have. If it’s enough you can use ebony or plastic tuner buttons which weigh Al,ost nothing, and not have to change actual tuners. If it’s a slight imbalance a suede strap works well. If it’s very neck heavy a grippy strap starts just pulling your shirt with it (my Epiphone Alleykat was like that.)

Moving the strap button: it depends on the geometry of the guitar and how you hold it, so what works for one guitar may not (probably won’t) work for another. Here’s a post that explains it pretty well (post #14):

Moving Strap Buttons.

Hi all, has anyone moved there rear central strap button to the old skool rear position (up a bit on the rear of the bass)? I've recently reaquired a 5 sting Jazzman and initially had a problem with neck dive and heard that moving the position of the rear strap button to the older position helps...

forum.warwickforum.com

What that doesn’t show is how the strap wraps around your body, ie if the strap isn’t actually vertical depending on how you hold the guitar. Sometimes it’s the strap wanting to move sideways to get vertical that causes the motion.

Personally, if the suede strap isn’t enough my second choice is weight on the strap. Some people use/like wireless rigs for this because of the battery pack on the strap.

Thanks for your reply!
I have tried different straps and they don't help much and feel uncomfortable to me. The guitar tech mentioned another button on the bottom but I don't see how that would help

 

[Doug Edwards]

Lighter tuners and buttons help. A rough strap back makes it almost a non issue though. There was a time I was an SG guy. I've read guys putting weight on the heel and relocating strap buttons. Try the rough back strap first.

Thanks!
Tried it and no go.

 

[Doug Edwards]

Relocating the strap button on a PRS Santana will make your problem worse. The Chibson SG heel is forward of the very shallow upper horns of that body design, so for that guitar, relocating the button to the heel works, as much as it can. Removing the tuner buttons to test the effect is a fabulous, easy and reversible test. Lighter tuner buttons could affect it. Weighting the control cavity is a cool idea, except that the Santana cavity is very small and doesn't have much room to spare. Just take care of where you try that to not create unintentional grounds, etc. when the plate is secured.

Perhaps the best way to easily address this is to add weight to the bottom end of your guitar strap. There used to be a product called "Heads Up" that addresses the SG problem specifically, but they don't seem to be made anymore. Maybe check Reverb. Here's an old photo:

The other thing you could consider is to take your guitar to a very skilled luthier and have your guitar neck reshaped/reduced and refinished. Even removing finish to a satin feel could be a start, but all of this is not reversible at all except for refinishing, and could be expensive.

Good luck!

Thanks!
I am going to add 6oz of fishing weights and see how it offsets the tuner's (difference of currant to possible replacements) in weight of 6oz. I was looking for a lighter guitar so adding weights is not optimal.
And the guitar looks, feels and sounds SO good so I am not going to mess with reshaping the neck.

 

[Doug Edwards]

The most elegant solution to all hardware problems is either Velcro, duck tape, or both.

You could, for example, stick some Velcro on the back of the guitar, and some Velcro on your belt. Attach guitar body to belt by mating the Velcro, and voila!

You’re good to go unless your pants fall down!

“You’ve done this?”

“Of course not. Sensible advice isn’t entertaining. It’s way more fun to go weird.”

“What’s your duck tape idea, then?”

“It involves duck taping a helium balloon to the headstock.”

“What’s the advantage over the Velcro solution?”

“At some point in the concert you can inhale the helium and have a funny voice.”

“You probably shouldn’t have inhaled anything tonight yourself.”

“True. I’m having trouble getting the duck tape adhesive out of my nose.”

Most informative answer I've ever read. However I will tie the helium balloon to the headstock. Don't want to damage the finish of the guitar

 

[Doug Edwards]

Attach a short bungee cord from the bottom strap button to your pedalboard.
The only drawback is you have to keep your foot on the board at all times to
prevent the board from jumping up and hitting you in the knee.

Thanks for your answer!
I have tried the bungee cord but attached to my shoe so I could walk around. It came off and now I have a scar on my forehead

 

[Doug Edwards]

Try putting wheel weights in the control cavity.
Like these:

Thanks for the reply!
It is a possibility but I want to keep the guitar as light a possible

 

[Doug Edwards]

Find an attractive counterpart to gently "lift" the guitar neck when drooping, like a Magicians assistant.

Or....they could be unattractive I guess. You just don't want no droopy guitar! Hee hee...

Thanks!
And the unattractive assistants charge less too!

 

[CatStrangler]

Relocating the strap button on a PRS Santana will make your problem worse. The Chibson SG heel is forward of the very shallow upper horns of that body design, so for that guitar, relocating the button to the heel works, as much as it can. Removing the tuner buttons to test the effect is a fabulous, easy and reversible test. Lighter tuner buttons could affect it. Weighting the control cavity is a cool idea, except that the Santana cavity is very small and doesn't have much room to spare. Just take care of where you try that to not create unintentional grounds, etc. when the plate is secured.

Perhaps the best way to easily address this is to add weight to the bottom end of your guitar strap. There used to be a product called "Heads Up" that addresses the SG problem specifically, but they don't seem to be made anymore. Maybe check Reverb. Here's an old photo:

The other thing you could consider is to take your guitar to a very skilled luthier and have your guitar neck reshaped/reduced and refinished. Even removing finish to a satin feel could be a start, but all of this is not reversible at all except for refinishing, and could be expensive.

Good luck!

I am reminded that I need an SG around to plink on while couch surfing.

 

[Nice F Holes]

Wider straps help with weight, so if adding mass helps your balance issue then maybe you can try a 2.5" or 3."

The super light tooth tuners might not fit your guitar without modification. But most of the weight of the tuner is the knobs so changing them is almost as effective.