Little Disappointed in Carlos

[ViperDoc]

Eh, it sucks. They don't owe us anything, life moves on.

This, however:

THAT IS MENTAL.

 

[Warmart]

Yeah, sounds like me when my wife wants a selfie. I hate "posing" for pictures, he probably does, too. Sounds like he was friendly enough so don't sweat it just realize everyone is different.

 

[Bill SAS 513]

Interesting thread...I guess all people have Good and Bad days...or ways they look at interacting (or NOT interacting) with the general public.
Years ago, I ran into PRSh in Georgetown (DC), and he was walking with his wife. I was gross and climbing out of a Verizon manhole.
I asked for autograph. Instead, he took my address and sent me an AWESOME package of swag.
Signing Event...Mean Joe Greene (A personal hero to me), he was very short, and almost rude...Hopefully just had a crappy day. (Dammit!!)
Lucky enough to meet Alex and Geddy...phenomenal, humble, just very good dudes. Thankfully...
Bernie Marsden...Coolest guy...EVER!!!
Martin Sheen...(years ago)...Interesting...great stories...talked all night.

"Being Famous" (for lack of a better term) is kinda like a new restaurant...I'll give it 3 tries...if it stinks all 3 times, I'm going elsewhere.
If someone's a schmuck 3 times, well, than they are a schmuck. LOLOL. (Or, like Neil Peart, and others, like Carlos, just don't want to be in the spotlight, to some degree)
It does mess up the day though, when you get that chance to meet someone, and it doesn't go how you expected it would/should.

 

[DougUSMC]

I'm just a normal shmoe that has some long-time friends whose jobs bring them in circles with lots of famous folks. I DEFINITELY get star struck (no matter how many times I meet them), but my attitude is generally gratitude. I've probably met PRSh 4-5 times (I live in MD, I'm spoiled w/my ability to go to his events), and all I can ever say is some mumbled version of "Thanks for what you do, I appreciate and respect the $hit out of it". Same with when I meet other celebrities, if it's the first or 100th time, I get the same blank mind. Anyone that knows me can tell you I never shut up, so that's completely out of character to me.

That being said, I'm sorry, but I do believe people that make their career out of fame have a debt to their fans.

I'm not saying you should be interrupting their dinner to ask for an autograph, but if you wait until they are done and leaving, asking then is perfectly ok. That's actually one of the "rules" I was taught by those "in the biz".

Fame is a double-edged sword. Those of us that are fans have no right to expect servitude from our idols. We should expect civility and they should expect attention. Fans who feel they are owed are wrong, celebrities who feel they should be able to profit from fame but still not take selfies in the grocery store are wrong, and paparazzi should be more highly regulated before they ruin lives.

Yeah, I know, I'm all over the place here. I think people need to be respectful of "famous people", those same "famous people" need to appreciate the fleeting nature of their fame and those that grant it to them, and common sense should rule.

All of that being said: Carlos is the man, and I agree that his stopping to shake, and chat is cool. Lots of people don't like pictures, and tho I'd be bummed too it seems like that's just his thing?

 

[Tim S]

I can’t imagine why any celebrity would want to do selfies with strangers. It looks like the celebrity is endorsing the stranger. They have no idea if the stranger is a normal guy or the next serial killer.
Would you like your photo smiling & standing next to the mass shooter with your arm around him plastered all over social media?

 

[László]

Seems to me that any person’s right to privacy - that includes famous people - ought to be respected, not criticized. Privacy rights include deciding whether to be photographed.

Also, various claims have been made against famous people while posing for photographs with fans. It’s wiser to say no than to take that risk, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he was given legal advice to that effect.

Personally, I think it’s kind of rude to ask for a selfie and then be miffed if the person says they’d rather not.

 

[AP515]

One night in Phoenix my wife and I were a restaurant for dinner. Connie Hawkins (hall of fame B-ball layer) was at the table next to us. I noticed him and it looked to me like he would rather not be disturbed so I left him alone. I would have preferred to get an autograph (not many cell phone cameras back in 95), but not at the expense of his peace.

 

[DougUSMC]

I can’t imagine why any celebrity would want to do selfies with strangers. It looks like the celebrity is endorsing the stranger. They have no idea if the stranger is a normal guy or the next serial killer.
Would you like your photo smiling & standing next to the mass shooter with your arm around him plastered all over social media?

First off, I'd argue that the odds of that are so astronomically small as to be irrelevant. Secondly, I'm sure that 99.999999% of the world would agree that selfies are just a quick snap, and anyone that tried to claim they were an endorsement would be laughed out of the court of public opinion.

That being said, I consider my selfie of PRSh and I @ Experience '18 to be a endorsement of my Guitar God status.

Seems to me that any person’s right to privacy - that includes famous people - ought to be respected, not criticized. Privacy rights include deciding whether to be photographed.

Also, various claims have been made against famous people while posing for photographs with fans. It’s wiser to say no than to take that risk, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he was given legal advice to that effect.

Personally, I think it’s kind of rude to ask for a selfie and then be miffed if the person says they’d rather not.

Sure, everyone likes to say they have a right to privacy. The truth is many courts have ruled that they don't. I can take whatever pictures of anyone I want in public, b/c you DON'T have a right to privacy in public. In most cases you only have a right to prevent me from profiting from your image that I take in profit w/o your consent. Heck, I can fly a drone over your back yard and film you, and you doing anything to the drone is MORE illegal than me filming. So, "right to privacy" is a misnomer. (Please keep in mind that many of these laws are dependent on the municipality you live in, I understand that).

That being said, I DO agree that things have gone WAY out of whack in our society, and proper behavior is an expectation we are sorely missing. I COMPLETELY agree that just b/c something is legal doesn't mean you "can" or "should" do it. I agree that being miffed is unreasonable, not respecting others space is bad behavior, there HAVE been many claims that scare any reasonable person in our litigious society, and that celebrities are people too. Fans wanting a pic isn't unreasonable, fans being miffed isn't unreasonable (no one likes to be shot down). Celebs acting miffed that they were asked is unreasonable, fans lashing out b/c celebs politely reply "no" are unreasonable.

I'm sorry, I just can't feel badly for celebrities that make their fortunes partially from their fame being upset when they lose their privacy. IMO, if you're making money off your mug being in media, you've traded the ability for people to want a pic of your mug in public.

Just my $0.02, and IANAL.

 

[Tim S]

You do not necessarily have a right to photograph and publish photos of others in public. Laws vary state to state in the US as well as vary internationally.
Ironically enough, being a celebrity in some states gives you MORE rights to control the publishing of photos that a non-celebrity.

 

[Joseph Berlin]

Ehhh, yeah I'd be blown if that happened but I'd never hold it against the artist. In his eyes, he is not simply "declining 10 seconds out of his life." He is making a point to preserve as much of the personal life that has been stripped away from his as possible. If he says yes to one person he should say it to many more. Unless you had on a santana shirt and were freaking out I highly doubt he would make you that one exception. Don't take it personally. If I were famous I'd tell people to screw off if I was in a less than perfect mood.

 

[DougUSMC]

You do not necessarily have a right to photograph and publish photos of others in public. Laws vary state to state in the US as well as vary internationally.
Ironically enough, being a celebrity in some states gives you MORE rights to control the publishing of photos that a non-celebrity.

Interesting, can you post some proof of this, or anything in writing that supports it? I Googled some searches on this (here, here, here, here, here, as just a couple of examples), and can't find anything to support your position. I'm not saying I'm 100% right, but I can't find any contrary information.

 

[László]

Sure, everyone likes to say they have a right to privacy. The truth is many courts have ruled that they don't. I can take whatever pictures of anyone I want in public, b/c you DON'T have a right to privacy in public.

***

That being said, I DO agree that things have gone WAY out of whack in our society, and proper behavior is an expectation we are sorely missing. I COMPLETELY agree that just b/c something is legal doesn't mean you "can" or "should" do it. I agree that being miffed is unreasonable, not respecting others space is bad behavior.

I think we agree, though for me it isn’t a matter of feeling sorry for celebrities. It’s a simple matter of personal respect for anyone, under the basic ethic of ‘do unto others what you would have them do unto you’. So for me, it’s a philosophical question more than a legal one.

However, the legal points are probably worth talking about, though I’m probably out of date on anything that isn’t related to entertainment contracts.

If someone shoots your pic on the street, yes, certainly no problem, because there’s no reasonable expectation of privacy there; however, you always have the right to choose whether or not to pose with someone, and that’s what happened in the case of the OP. So maybe it’s worth sticking to that point.

In addition, I believe there’s a reasonable expectation of privacy in a backyard that isn’t open to public view from the street. I know that a 2015 law codified this view in Florida and expressly recognizes that right, but I think it would be enforceable in numerous jurisdictions under state and/or common law theories, as regards filming with drones.

You may be surprised to know that some jurisdictions don’t even allow shooting film in some public spaces; San Francisco, for example, requires a location release to shoot in its parks.

There’s also the matter that not all of this privacy stuff is about federal law. There are also common law and state law rights of publicity and privacy that are well recognized. In fact, certain federal jurisdictions like New York get a lot of federal entertainment law filings because New York’s recognition of pendent common New York State law rights of publicity and privacy are comparatively broad.

But, again, for me it’s more a matter of ethics than law, and the two don’t necessarily equate.

 

[Collywobbles]

Somewhere on the secret forum for ageing rock stars that none of us know about, because we’re not famous ageing rock stars, Carlos has started a post bemoaning the fact that he met a random unknown presumed fan in a restaurant, said hello to said random unknown presumed fan when recognised, shook said random unknown presumed fan’s hand, and is still getting flamed by said random unknown presumed fan for not posing for a selfie. He ended his post ‘Oh well, lesson learned’. Me, I’d probably just be happy a world-famous rock star had bothered to say hello and shake my hand. That said I don’t think this would have happened as I’d probably not have imposed myself on him in the first place.

 

[sergiodeblanc]

What do you even do with a picture of yourself from a random encounter with a celebrity that you have no real connection to anyway?

I guess you could post it on Facebook and get like, fourteen likes and a few racist comments.

 

[Mike Duncan]

I met Roger McGuinn when I was 17 years old. I was so excited - his handler told to not touch him. It was weird. Still got his signature. Since it was 1991, I didn't selfie him. I would have with today's tech.

 

[drjenkins]

I get it, I've had a few less than stellar brushes with famous people, but I've also had some amazing ones. It is a bummer and can kinda sting a little when it's somebody you really look up to and you feel like you got shorted though.

 

[sergiodeblanc]

I didn't selfie him. I would have with today's tech.

With today’s tech, I wouldn’t have had any of the amazing experiences I’ve had with celebrities, there’s just no way it would’ve worked.

Everyone is more accessible now, but it also makes them more guarded. The days of doing bong rips in public, slapping wigs and funny costumes on them so they wouldn’t be recognized, and basically blowing sh!t up is over. Everything’s an Instagram post or a TMZ scandal waiting to happen.

 

[DougUSMC]

A TON of valid comments, and TBH I agree with most of them. I think @LSchefman nailed it best when he said that there's a big difference in law vs. ethics.

I respect these artists, especially the 50+ years that Carlos has been crushing it in the music industry. I don't mean to devalue their personal lives, or suggest that they "owe their fans". I just know how excited I get when those opportunities present themselves, and forget that while they reap many of the benefits that they also pay their own price for that fame.

I apologize for going all "sea lawyer" on everyone, let's just call that my "competitive streak".

 

[shimmilou]

Could have been worse, like the time that Gary Coleman punched someone that called him Webster.

 

[Mike Duncan]

With today’s tech, I wouldn’t have had any of the amazing experiences I’ve had with celebrities, there’s just no way it would’ve worked.

Everyone is more accessible now, but it also makes them more guarded. The days of doing bong rips in public, slapping wigs and funny costumes on them so they wouldn’t be recognized, and basically blowing sh!t up is over. Everything’s an Instagram post or a TMZ scandal waiting to happen.

Things were more fun before the phone cameras. I was always "in" the event, now I just freak-out over worrying about capturing it on "film".

I hate it.