Ebtech and Archon

Discussion in 'Amplifiers' started by Lyric, Apr 17, 2018.

  1. Lyric

    Lyric New Member

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    As I was reading more and more about the Archon’s effects loop I started researching a little more because of course my Earthquaker Devices pedals don’t work well in the effects loop. My MXR pedals do great in the effects loop though.

    I read on here where someone mentioned getting the Ebtech 2 Channel Hum Eliminator. So while looking at the product I noticed they have a Ebtech 2 Channel Line Level Shifter with the Hum Eliminator built in just like the first mentioned.

    Would buying the Ebtech 2 Channel Line Level with the Hum Eliminator built in be the best way to go so that I can get -10dBV for my pedals plus get the Hum Eliminator together?

    https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Hum--ebtech-he-2-2-channel-stereo-hum-eliminator

    https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/LLS2--ebtech-lls-2-2-channel-line-level-shifter

    Trying to save my Earthquaker Devices pedals if I can lol. Thanks
     
  2. elvis

    elvis Hamfisted String Banger

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    The only reason to get the LLS is if your FX loop is super hot. I have not found that to be the case with my Archon, though YMMV. If you aren't clipping the pedals in your loop, then the LLS will just add noise. You always want to keep the signal as high as you can. If you attenuate and then gain up, you are attenuating guitar but not noise, and then gaining guitar and noise. So you get more noise.

    If you ARE clipping stuff in the loop, the LLS is a pretty good way to go.

    It's also possible that the Earthquaker device can be made quiet by other means. Can you run them on batteries? If they are still noisy then, the HE2/LLS won't help. If they do get quiet on batteries, run them from your Pedal Power.
     
  3. Lyric

    Lyric New Member

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    Thanks for the quick reply Elvis

    Unfortunately the Earthquaker Devices pedals run via AC adapter only, no battery option.

    Reason I thought the LLS would help was because PRS supposedly said because the Effects Loop is tube driven along with being a high gain amp that it made the Effects Loop pretty hot. Most amps that I’ve played are tube that are tube recommend to run effects pedals in Effects Loop set at -10dBv but if your running say Rack Mount Effects to run them higher or at say “0”. I’ve read that the Archon’s Effects Loop was aimed at or meant to run better with Rack Mount Effects. So in other words I’ve noticed typically Rack Mount Effects are ran at “0” while Effects Pedals are ran at -10dBv on amps that typically allow you to adjust the Effects Loop.

    This was the reason for my thinking the LLS would work.

    I may have this all wrong and if so sorry. I confuse myself at times lol.
     
  4. elvis

    elvis Hamfisted String Banger

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    No worries - these things are VERY confusing, and the Archon manual is not terribly helpful.

    FX loop signal level varies from amp to amp, and has nothing to do with whether the loop is tube buffered or not. Some amps have the master between the preamp and the loop, so master volume becomes an FX loop send control by accident. This can be a problem if the setting you want for the master volume is too low or too high for the loop effects. Other amps have Master volume after the loop, but the loop send level still depends on input volume/gain, as well as whatever gain stages there are in the way to the loop.

    Short answer - put the effects box in the loop, turn the amp up to the loudest you will likely run it. If the effects don't clip, you're done. If the effects clip, you will want a loop attenuator or level shifter.

    I have run some of the TC delay pedals in the Archon's loop. I don't think it's particularly hot. It also depends on the pedal, though. I also run a G System with it. No issues with level there, even though other amps have clipped it.
     
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  5. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Archon owning member

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    I've found some pedals are noisy by nature and others that may seem to be, but just require special care. I thought for the longest time that my Custom 50 loop was annoyingly noisy, then found out for sure while troubleshooting, that it was my 10 band MXR EQ which was at the end of the loop pedal chain. Took it out and it cut the noise in half. Tried everything when I put it back in, moving power cables, reversing the plug, etc, and found I could quiet it a lot but it was still a noise maker. Right now the loop has TC Dreamscape, Flashback and Arena, and it is quiet with the Archon and very quiet with the ATMA. The other night when I tried to re-introduce the MXR into the ATMA loop, it immediately because noisy so after a few quite tonal experiments, back out it came.

    Some pedals are more noisy. Some are just more prone to noise and require special care to minimize. Not too close to power cables or supplies, etc. Some pedals that sound great otherwise can be so noisy you eventually decide to move them on down the pedal highway. And, some just don't match well with others. Sometimes it not one bad pedal as much as it's one pedal that doesn't work well with another. Designers can build input and output buffers to any spec they want and sometimes they just don't mate well.
     
    #5 DreamTheaterRules, Apr 17, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
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  6. Lyric

    Lyric New Member

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    Sounds good and makes sense.

    I searched for a couple years no joke for the right amp. Tried everything within my reach and even dropped over 3K on a halfstack Orange that I thought was what I liked in store but quickly found out I was making more frowns than smiles lol. Tried several Mesa Boogies, Laney and more. When I found out about the Archon online everything seemed perfect with a super beautiful clean channel, a killer lead channel and the build as well was almost unheard of these days. I appreciated the power tubes and preamp tubes bring chassis mounted, somewhat semi torrent board build for easy repair, hand wired to some degree I guess, point to point soldering and more. I bought blindly and it was one of the first times I felt like something was perfect without trying it out.

    Basically pedals can come and go. If I cannot get these Earthquaker Pedals to work in the effects loop then they’ll stay upfront or be replaced with something else because this amp head is here to stay :)

    And so far I gotta commend this forum for being so friendly and helpful. Beats the heck out of some forums, just saying lol
     
  7. Lyric

    Lyric New Member

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    Sometimes all it takes is one bad apple or pedal that is a little fussy lol. I’ll either learn to place these in the front input or move on to something that works because this Archon is staying :)
     
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  8. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Archon owning member

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    DILLY DILLY! My Archon, as they say in the south "ain't goin' nowhere"
     
  9. bodia

    bodia Authorities said.....best leave it.....unsolved

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    Likewise!
     
  10. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Archon owning member

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    And neither is that "other one." ;) (which reminds me, HOLY CRAP do I have some news on that front for you!)
     
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  11. bodia

    bodia Authorities said.....best leave it.....unsolved

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    Likewise, on that one for me too!
     
  12. LSchefman

    LSchefman Hears Tones

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    Just wondering if perhaps a simple buffer in your effects loop might help things; just for a test you could put a Boss pedal (they’re all buffered, even when bypassed) ahead of the first pedal in your loop, and see if that might help.

    If it works, you could try a dedicated buffer pedal; several companies make good ones.
     
  13. Lyric

    Lyric New Member

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    Two of my pedals have buffers built in which are the TC Electronics Polytune 3 and the Earthquaker Devices Palisades Mega Overdrive V2. I run the Polytune as my first pedal being that it’s a tuner. I have the Palisades as like my 3rd pedal in the chain. You suppose possibly just for s**ts and giggles I could place the Palisades last in the chain after the modulation pedals but just keep it disengaged but have the buffer set to the on position? I’m not sure if this would work or not being that it’s an overdrive pedal.

    Btw I just finished playing for two hours and it was hard to stop playing on the Archon but the fiancé was getting tired sleepy and probably tired of hearing the crap in the house shake lol :D I swear this amp is kind of a hidden gem that not many guitarist have discovered just yet even though it’s been out for awhile.
     
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  14. bodia

    bodia Authorities said.....best leave it.....unsolved

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    You hit the nail squarely on the head!
     
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  15. elvis

    elvis Hamfisted String Banger

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    I had to buy mine blind. Few stores carry them. And a lot of folks just dismiss PRS amps, as they are not generally known as an amp company. It's unfortunate, as I went through half a dozen Mesa and Bogner amps trying to get what the Archon gives me.

    I find that when people envision tone, they do it through the lense of either a particular amp company or a particular artist. Nobody out there (besides MT, and even he's just had the Archon as a backup for an Uber) is obviously using the Archon, and PRS doesn't have a "PRS amp sound" that attracts people. When I gig my Archon, a lot of people ask about it. Usually it starts with "PRS makes AMPS??"
     
  16. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Archon owning member

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    I bought mine under duress. I was almost blind. My pusher said do it or else. I waited. He gave me "a little taste" and I waited. He sent Reverb links and then extended a variable interest rate line of credit with a 0% APR. I was hooked. Now I'm addicted, and I don't want help or any 12 step program. A 12 speaker program, maybe.
     
  17. bodia

    bodia Authorities said.....best leave it.....unsolved

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    I try to help. Honest, I do.
     
  18. elvis

    elvis Hamfisted String Banger

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    Duress?!? All the trouble we gave you and you call it duress? King of understatement...

    I feel so unappreciated.
     
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  19. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Archon owning member

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    You're correct, because "peer pressure" is far worse than normal "duress." :)
     
  20. bodia

    bodia Authorities said.....best leave it.....unsolved

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    You and me both! I need to work on my game!

    Although, I must be doing something right because it worked on him twice!
     
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