CE 24 Pre 2008 and Post 2016 Debate

Toddman

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I am not sure why but, I have experienced people comparing the pre 2008 CE 24 model with the post 2016 CE 24 model. They are vastly different guitars. I personally prefer the pre 2008 model as it has the core specs with the exception of the bolt on maple neck. Some differences I have noticed between the two eras are: Post 2016 has thinner maple cap; the neck is 5 piece and includes a scarf joint; the trem block is not brass; the back trem cover plate and electronic cover plate are not counter sunk; the pickups are different (of course the tone quality is subjective depending on personal taste); and the bridge is not the same metal and the saddles are not brass; the body is not a violin carve; all parts are not American made.
None of these differences means the post 2016 models are inferior but it would be nice to compare apples to apples, not apples to oranges... especially when some people assert that the post 2016 model is superior.
 
I'm a big fan of the older CE24's and I find they even compare favorably to Customs of any era given their price point. I recently had a chance to try the recent CE24 S2 models and I was a bit underwhelmed at the specs, especially considering the price point at about 60% of the price of a Custom 24. Personally, I would choose a used older CE24 model over a new or used post-2016 CE24, but that's just my personal opinion and preference. I just like the specs and the pickups in the older ones and someone would have a hard time trying to convince me the post-2016 CE24 are better, even though they still remain excellent guitars.
 
I think that the pre 2008 model should be considered core but also think PRS wants to have product in specific categories to match price point; the new CE specs aren't close to core and to have one CE model categorized as core and the other model not core would be a marketing disaster. They really should have given the new CEs a different name, in my opinion.
 
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The main difference as I see it is that they were aiming for a different market...

The original CE's were a lot more 'expensive' relatively speaking and you could save yourself a few hundred bucks by opting for a CE over a core - not a big saving because the only real difference was the neck material and the way it was attached to the body. Perhaps it stopped selling in sufficient numbers due to the fact that you could pick up a 'Core' Cu24 for around the same price or less (sales, used etc).

When PRS introduced the S2, a way of reducing their 'costs' and therefore reduce the price of US made PRS guitars at about 1/3rd of the price, the success of that enabled them to target a 'new' audience - one that wanted something a 'bit more' premium with US made Pups, but still not as 'high-end' as a core which commands a 'premium' price range. To offer a US made Bolt-On neck PRS that isn't a couple of hundred less than a Core and have it compete 'directly' with their Core instruments, they had to reduce 'costs' - something they had experience of with their S2 range.

There are some that will claim a scarf neck joint doesn't affect the playability or tone, having steel instead of brass (or other materials) may not sound the same, but not necessarily better/worse, more/less premium - a cheaper manufacturing process no doubt. Some prefer the shallower carve top too as they find the edge on the Violin carve digs in to their arm when playing, Some may argue that the Pups are 'better' today than the pups PRS were making pre-2008 and whatever other 'changes' PRS has implemented as 'improvements' over what came before - like Phase 3 tuners for example. There are others who swear that the older ones are superior because they were 'core' instruments that were [almost] as expensive. Save a small amount by having a bolt-on...

Anyway, my point is that the newer Bolt-On's are not targeting the same market. These are aimed at those that either want a 'Bolt-on' specifically for its more 'snappy', more attack like feel and playability or those that want a Custom 24 with US Pups but can't afford or justify spending over 1k more for a 'set-neck' Core version. The 'new' bolt-on range is aiming for a different price-point, a different 'tier' than older ones...

At the end of the day, you have to accept what the used market has, whatever condition, colours, modifications etc and these are only likely to get more difficult to find one. On the other hand, the new ones will let you choose what colour, what condition etc as they are still being produced - I assume with the Nitro over CAB finish and TCI processed pick-ups...

I am NOT saying pre 2008 CE's were better/worse than the most recent CE24's, just that they are not necessarily targeting the same market today. They are, as originally pointed out, 'different'. The older style is no longer available so you have much more limited choice and availability. Cost too maybe a factor as some can be as expensive, if not more so than buying a 'new' CE24 in your prefered colour and of course, in 'brand new' condition too. Is a 1985 Cu24 the 'same' as a 2022 Cu24? NO!! but that's how things have 'evolved'. If you 'prefer' the older ones with Brazilian Rosewood boards, shorter heel, rotary and sweet switch, different Pups, wingnut tuners, different bridge, single action truss rods etc, then you have to buy 'old' - same as if you prefer the 'older' CE's too...

It's more important to get an instrument that works for you, regardless of where it was made, when it was made, how it was made etc and inspires you to pick it up and play it. I don't think there are 'many' guitars that can compete with the 'new' CE's at their Price Point but then they aren't in the same Price bracket as the Cores like they once were.. The difference in price between a CE and Core Cu24 back then would be like paying to upgrade from Vintage tuners to Phase 3 Locking tuners on the McCarty range, now you could buy a CE and S2 (or at least an SE) for the price of a core - that's put it in a different price tier and competing in a different market so I think its unfair to compare when they aren't really in competition and were built for a different market and that price difference also reflects that - like the SE range, and then the S2 range later on, PRS had a quite a big price 'gap' between S2 and Core which has now been 'filled' by their Bolt-on range - which now also includes the Silver Sky, Fiore and Dusty Waring models too. Instead of being a 'slightly' cheaper Core, the CE24 is now a more 'premium' S2 line and PRS often include their Bolt-on production numbers in with the S2's - Make 45-50 Core a day and 45-50 S2's (which includes Bolt-ons as they have the same Neck making procedure) and I assume, a similar thickness Maple cap too...

In conclusion, yes there are differences and reasons why too but the only CE you can buy 'new' today is the newer version and you have to get 'lucky' to find an older 'used' CE in the colour, condition, price point etc you want (or willing to tolerate - I couldn't tolerate a blue guitar regardless of everything else) but if you do find one, then you have a decision to make before someone else snaps it up...
 
What is the difference with the 2008-2016 era?

When I purchased my CE Reclaimed Ltd I was very disappointed with the quality of the trem hardware on it. I immediately noticed the difference from my core trem models. Which is a shame because the whole reclaimed wood idea was super.

Is there any way to fit the core hardware into the newer CE models?


IMG_2954.JPG
 
The main difference as I see it is that they were aiming for a different market...

The original CE's were a lot more 'expensive' relatively speaking and you could save yourself a few hundred bucks by opting for a CE over a core - not a big saving because the only real difference was the neck material and the way it was attached to the body. Perhaps it stopped selling in sufficient numbers due to the fact that you could pick up a 'Core' Cu24 for around the same price or less (sales, used etc).

When PRS introduced the S2, a way of reducing their 'costs' and therefore reduce the price of US made PRS guitars at about 1/3rd of the price, the success of that enabled them to target a 'new' audience - one that wanted something a 'bit more' premium with US made Pups, but still not as 'high-end' as a core which commands a 'premium' price range. To offer a US made Bolt-On neck PRS that isn't a couple of hundred less than a Core and have it compete 'directly' with their Core instruments, they had to reduce 'costs' - something they had experience of with their S2 range.

There are some that will claim a scarf neck joint doesn't affect the playability or tone, having steel instead of brass (or other materials) may not sound the same, but not necessarily better/worse, more/less premium - a cheaper manufacturing process no doubt. Some prefer the shallower carve top too as they find the edge on the Violin carve digs in to their arm when playing, Some may argue that the Pups are 'better' today than the pups PRS were making pre-2008 and whatever other 'changes' PRS has implemented as 'improvements' over what came before - like Phase 3 tuners for example. There are others who swear that the older ones are superior because they were 'core' instruments that were [almost] as expensive. Save a small amount by having a bolt-on...

Anyway, my point is that the newer Bolt-On's are not targeting the same market. These are aimed at those that either want a 'Bolt-on' specifically for its more 'snappy', more attack like feel and playability or those that want a Custom 24 with US Pups but can't afford or justify spending over 1k more for a 'set-neck' Core version. The 'new' bolt-on range is aiming for a different price-point, a different 'tier' than older ones...

At the end of the day, you have to accept what the used market has, whatever condition, colours, modifications etc and these are only likely to get more difficult to find one. On the other hand, the new ones will let you choose what colour, what condition etc as they are still being produced - I assume with the Nitro over CAB finish and TCI processed pick-ups...

I am NOT saying pre 2008 CE's were better/worse than the most recent CE24's, just that they are not necessarily targeting the same market today. They are, as originally pointed out, 'different'. The older style is no longer available so you have much more limited choice and availability. Cost too maybe a factor as some can be as expensive, if not more so than buying a 'new' CE24 in your prefered colour and of course, in 'brand new' condition too. Is a 1985 Cu24 the 'same' as a 2022 Cu24? NO!! but that's how things have 'evolved'. If you 'prefer' the older ones with Brazilian Rosewood boards, shorter heel, rotary and sweet switch, different Pups, wingnut tuners, different bridge, single action truss rods etc, then you have to buy 'old' - same as if you prefer the 'older' CE's too...

It's more important to get an instrument that works for you, regardless of where it was made, when it was made, how it was made etc and inspires you to pick it up and play it. I don't think there are 'many' guitars that can compete with the 'new' CE's at their Price Point but then they aren't in the same Price bracket as the Cores like they once were.. The difference in price between a CE and Core Cu24 back then would be like paying to upgrade from Vintage tuners to Phase 3 Locking tuners on the McCarty range, now you could buy a CE and S2 (or at least an SE) for the price of a core - that's put it in a different price tier and competing in a different market so I think its unfair to compare when they aren't really in competition and were built for a different market and that price difference also reflects that - like the SE range, and then the S2 range later on, PRS had a quite a big price 'gap' between S2 and Core which has now been 'filled' by their Bolt-on range - which now also includes the Silver Sky, Fiore and Dusty Waring models too. Instead of being a 'slightly' cheaper Core, the CE24 is now a more 'premium' S2 line and PRS often include their Bolt-on production numbers in with the S2's - Make 45-50 Core a day and 45-50 S2's (which includes Bolt-ons as they have the same Neck making procedure) and I assume, a similar thickness Maple cap too...

In conclusion, yes there are differences and reasons why too but the only CE you can buy 'new' today is the newer version and you have to get 'lucky' to find an older 'used' CE in the colour, condition, price point etc you want (or willing to tolerate - I couldn't tolerate a blue guitar regardless of everything else) but if you do find one, then you have a decision to make before someone else snaps it up...
Thanks for your thoughtful reply. FYI, my profile pic is my 2003 CE 24...I love the color. It came with the original hard case and case candy, all for a fabulous price.
 
Foolish to compare the 2. As others said the previous CE was core level. I personally like that they offered wide fat and wide thin options. The newer models only come in wide thin. And yes hardware is cheaper to make it a fraction of a core. I do think the modern wiring is better than previous iterations. It’s a lot more intuitive now than before for those of us that like to tinker.
 
What is the difference with the 2008-2016 era?

When I purchased my CE Reclaimed Ltd I was very disappointed with the quality of the trem hardware on it. I immediately noticed the difference from my core trem models. Which is a shame because the whole reclaimed wood idea was super.

Is there any way to fit the core hardware into the newer CE models?


IMG_2954.JPG
Yeah! You can swap the trems, Jo.
 
I dug up an old Guitar World price guide from 92-93 and noticed that the CE24 was only $300 less than a Custom 24 with no 10-top or birds (about 85% of total price of the CU24). I also remember vaguely in an interview that either Paul or Jack said the difference in workmanship time between making these 2 models came to about an hour, which made the CE24 less profitable and a better deal for the customer - basically a bolt-on core from back when there was nothing but core.

I agree the modern CE24 S2 is a different guitar and comparing to pre-2008 isn't particularly fair, especially at a considerably lower price point compared to the modern cores. I find a lot of the improvements that have transpired over the years have trickled down nicely into the more affordable S2 line. One thing is for sure, I hope that PRS will always keep a carved-top bolt-on in their roster for years to come, I think it is a critical need - mostly because they are my favourite! :)
 
I dug up an old Guitar World price guide from 92-93 and noticed that the CE24 was only $300 less than a Custom 24 with no 10-top or birds (about 85% of total price of the CU24). I also remember vaguely in an interview that either Paul or Jack said the difference in workmanship time between making these 2 models came to about an hour, which made the CE24 less profitable and a better deal for the customer - basically a bolt-on core from back when there was nothing but core.

I agree the modern CE24 S2 is a different guitar and comparing to pre-2008 isn't particularly fair, especially at a considerably lower price point compared to the modern cores. I find a lot of the improvements that have transpired over the years have trickled down nicely into the more affordable S2 line. One thing is for sure, I hope that PRS will always keep a carved-top bolt-on in their roster for years to come, I think it is a critical need - mostly because they are my favourite! :)
That's cool you were able to find the old ads. My buddy has an older CU 24, a little older than my CE 24, and it has a 10 top...the interesting thing is that the top on mine is as good or better than his but 10 tops were not a thing for the CE series, I guess. My neck is also flame maple and body is Honduran mahogany (1piece). I am starting to think I was quite fortunate with acquiring it.
 
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I have an '89 ce and 2019. 2 totally different guitars. The 89 has a 5 way rotary which to me, the sounds I get makes it as flexible as a 513. So far the 2019 is really pretty.
I like the way the coils get split with the rotary...I actually don't mind it at all and maybe that is because I don't typically switch between pups during a song as I usually use the volume to control tone and clarity. I really think PRS should have called the post 2016 CE 24, something else.
 
I like the way the coils get split with the rotary...I actually don't mind it at all and maybe that is because I don't typically switch between pups during a song as I usually use the volume to control tone and clarity. I really think PRS should have called the post 2016 CE 24, something else.

Long & McQuade (biggest chain music retailer in Canada) lists them as PRS S2 CE24. I assumed that was the distinction but this is L&M's error, not PRS. The PRS website lists them as CE24 separate from S2. The S2's have asymmetric bevel top carve while CE24 are listed as violin top carve. In the PRS marketing materials, they do seem to advertise it as a continuation of the classic CE design. I agree, they probably should have added a qualifier to the name of the post 2016 models. I really liked the 85/15. I'd be curious to drop a set in my CE24 to see how it sounds.
 
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