Archon Discontinued?

So this doesn't help the "Archon is discontinued" rumor...the dealer that has these on clearance are doing so because the metal players in this town go right for Marshall/EVH/Peavey. They ordered two Archons to test the PRS waters as far as amps go, and they didn't move so they dropped the price to make them move.

Guitar Center did with Mesa when they stopped carrying them, and Mesa is still around. :)

Just posting something I saw, not trying to fan flames. Personally, I've not heard a PRS amp (aside from the Grissom and whatever Mayer is playing now) that I thought sounded good, especially for the price.
 
Personally, I've not heard a PRS amp (aside from the Grissom and whatever Mayer is playing now) that I thought sounded good, especially for the price.

Tastes are very personal on this stuff. We all want to hear different things from an amp.

Having lived with the HXDA 50, the HXDA 30, and the DG 30, it's been my experience that PRS is making the finest sounding amps I've ever heard/lived with, regardless of price.

I've had more expensive amps, and less expensive amps, going back in time to then-new 60s Blackface amps, and none of them touch these amps or come even close, except the Two-Rocks I've owned that were both more expensive, and not as well suited to the music I play (mine were Dumble style amps).

In addition to owning an awful lot of amps, especially since starting my studio 25 years ago, I've had every conceivable type of amp come in with session players, and most of them were very, very good sounding amps (picked and brought in by the pro players I hired for session work, obviously). In fact, the session guys who come in occasionally still, have nothing but great things to say about the PRS amps in my studio.

To that note I'll add that I've spotted two HXDAs and a Grissom amp (not sure which one) in Tim Pierce's studio (famed LA session player). So that leaves me wondering if you and I are simply worlds apart when it comes to tastes in amps.

So out of curiosity, what amps are you playing through now that sound better to you than the PRS amps? Take price out of the equation for the moment, and talk tone, because value is a completely separate concept.
 
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There's a difference between they (PRS) are discontinuing the Archon, and they (sometimes even employees refer to the upper management at a shop at which they work as "they") are discontinuing the Archon.
 
Tastes are very personal on this stuff. We all want to hear different things from an amp.

Having lived with the HXDA 50, the HXDA 30, and the DG 30, it's been my experience that PRS is making the finest sounding amps I've ever heard/lived with, regardless of price.

I've had more expensive amps, and less expensive amps, going back in time to then-new 60s Blackface amps, and none of them touch these amps or come even close, except the Two-Rocks I've owned that were both more expensive, and not as well suited to the music I play (mine were Dumble style amps).

In addition to owning an awful lot of amps, especially since starting my studio 25 years ago, I've had every conceivable type of amp come in with session players, and most of them were very, very good sounding amps (picked and brought in by the pro players I hired for session work, obviously). In fact, the session guys who come in occasionally still, have nothing but great things to say about the PRS amps in my studio.

To that note I'll add that I've spotted two HXDAs and a Grissom amp (not sure which one) in Tim Pierce's studio (famed LA session player). So that leaves me wondering if you and I are simply worlds apart when it comes to tastes in amps.

So out of curiosity, what amps are you playing through now that sound better to you than the PRS amps? Take price out of the equation for the moment, and talk tone, because value is a completely separate concept.

I'm basing my comments on the PRS demos that use the HXDA and Archon amps. The overdrive tones are harsh, brittle on the top end, lacking bottom. Just watch the demo of the 2015 McCarty - the cleans are decent, but when Bryan rolls up the volume - horrible, imho. The Grissom DG amp demos have more richness to my ears. I play a Mesa Express, but the tones I like the most are Super Reverbs and Two Rocks. I've not personally played a PRS amp, but my feeling is the current offerings are geared more towards high gain playing. Just my opinion.
 
I'm basing my comments on the PRS demos that use the HXDA and Archon amps. The overdrive tones are harsh, brittle on the top end, lacking bottom. Just watch the demo of the 2015 McCarty - the cleans are decent, but when Bryan rolls up the volume - horrible, imho. The Grissom DG amp demos have more richness to my ears. I play a Mesa Express, but the tones I like the most are Super Reverbs and Two Rocks. I've not personally played a PRS amp, but my feeling is the current offerings are geared more towards high gain playing. Just my opinion.

I agree on the subject of the 2015 McCarty demo, and frankly some other clips of PRS amps as well. However, I can tell you that I heard Paul play an HXDA in person, and it was surreal. And of the PRS amps I've heard and played, "lacking bottom" is definitely not an issue. I think it may have more to do with the way those amps are mic'd than the actual amp's tone, especially in the PRS official videos - sadly, I don't think they always do their amps justice.
 
I'm basing my comments on the PRS demos that use the HXDA and Archon amps. The overdrive tones are harsh, brittle on the top end, lacking bottom. Just watch the demo of the 2015 McCarty - the cleans are decent, but when Bryan rolls up the volume - horrible, imho. The Grissom DG amp demos have more richness to my ears. I play a Mesa Express, but the tones I like the most are Super Reverbs and Two Rocks. I've not personally played a PRS amp, but my feeling is the current offerings are geared more towards high gain playing. Just my opinion.

Well, just goes to show that you can't reach an opinion on an amp from clips on a website, you have to play the amp. And you have to have a clue how to set it up. Otherwise, you really don't know what they're about. The HXDA is NOT a high gain amp by any stretch of the imagination, nor is it intended to be.

But since you don't know what the amp is really about not having played one, or heard one in person, I'll explain.

The HXDA is perhaps the finest sounding amp I've ever owned, and for more on that, see below, but it has a buttery, fat low end that is to die for. It's as smooth and creamy sounding an amp as you'd want, or you can crank the treble a bit (as I sometimes do) if that's where you're going with it. The amp will do whatever the player wants, for better or for worse.

Bryan Ewald set up that amp very badly in his demo of the McCarty - at least in the sense of what its potential is. He turned up the gain, but must have turned the master down, probably to keep the volume low so he could talk over it, and thus got only preamp breakup. It didn't do the McCarty justice, either, except clean. The power tubes need to be involved with a Plexi style amp! And the gain was too high on the dial. I felt the same way about the tones he dialed in on the HXDA 30 demo. IMHO the amp does not get dialed in to sound its best at all, not even close.

Why they chose to demo it through a 4x12 with him sitting next to the cab is none of my business, but obviously they didn't have the amp set up to do what it does best - for that, the amp's master needs to be set high, and the gain set lower. You can't do that with a guy with his head next to the cab.

Done right, the amp blooms in a way that no amp I've ever had does, except for old, real Plexis that have come into my studio with great session players (Laurie Wisefield, a Marshall player who was with Wishbone Ash back in the day, and who worked with me on a couple of projects in Europe a few years back knew how to freakin' set up a Marshall Plexi style amp!).

Having owned these Two-Rocks - Onyx, Onyx Signature Prototype, Onyx Signature, Artist, Custom Reverb Signature I, and Custom Reverb Signature II - I can say without qualification that the PRS HXDA Amps are their equal in every way. Incidentally, Two-Rock amps ALSO need a lot of volume to sound their best, in fact, they need to be substantially louder than my PRS amps. But that's another story. Set them up wrong, and they don't reach their potential either. Preamp fizz is preamp fizz no matter how it's sliced.

I've recorded a lot of Super Reverbs, another amp that has to be recorded loudly to get a good tone.

The DG amp demos sound great because being a great session player, DG knows how to set up his amps for demos. I have a DG30, great amp, and if you set it like he does, it sounds like his amp. Set it wrong, and it's not going to sound its best, in fact, set wrong, like any amp it can make you wonder what it's about. Took me a couple of weeks to really get the right settings for the amp to record it!

I like Mesa amps, too - in fact, I have a Lone Star 100 Watt- but in no way does any Mesa on the market including the Mark V (had one) come close to the 3D sound, the complexity, or the beauty of the HXDA's tones. And I'll especially include the bottom end on that comparison. It's not even worth discussing.

Then again, you have to set it up right.

The Two-Rocks are great amps, but again, they need to be LOUD to sound their best. Like most amps. Grissom demos his so loudly that they actually had to set the cabinet they were recording on its back, aimed at the ceiling, to not make the audience deaf in one of the demos. And yep, LOUD is how it sounds its best, too. Not as loud as a Two-Rock, though. Man, I cut so many tracks with those amps, and they could be heard down the street (and I lived on a one acre lot with the house set way back from the street)! I used to stick the cabinet in my recording booth at my old house that was pretty good at blocking sound, and run the heads in my control room connected with a 35 foot cable, and still the walls would shake in order to get what I thought was good tone.

In any case, since you haven't heard one live, you really ought to before making a pronouncement on the way it sounds. It's very, very good indeed. As is the Archon, though obviously, that's a higher gain amp on purpose.

Play one, with the master at 2:00 to dimed, the way it was designed to be played. Then talk about how it doesn't have bottom end and is all brittle. But I won't believe you. Because I've had a 50 and own a 30, and I know what they sound like through a good cab.

Capturing that sound to tape or disk - well, that's another subject entirely, and it's never easy with any amp.

Put the mic too close to the dust cap, and it's all screech and honk, too close to the edge and it's mud, and so on. Too much bass in the track, and you can't hear the kick or bass guitar, so you have to carve out the bottom end and somehow make up for that on the high end. Not simple. There are times I get a great tone in the room, but by the time I've screwed around fitting it into the mix, I've sometimes dialed out a lot of bottom end. Kind of a shame, but I need the room in my tracks for other parts sometimes, and I like to play keys and hear them, too.
 
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I can assure you, I have more bass in my PRS amp than anything Mesa/Boogie produces and, I'd venture to wager, 90% of most other amps out there. Granted, it's not an HXDA but it's of the same lineage and shares some of its characteristics. I'd fault the demos for not addressing a broader taste range of potential customers than anything else. Because, again, I can assure you, my amp is not aimed at the high gain crowd.
 
Les,
All good points you've raised. My local shop (NStuffmusic.com) doesn't carry the PRS line of amps now. Last time I was there they had one of the SE line on clearance (they've made a big push to Suhr gear now, I was told by my salesman that PRS isn't selling much in the Western PA region any longer - they had 6 PRS guitars and 4 were SEs).
Back to amps - I'm a home player these days, haven't gigged out since college (mid-80s), so my needs and tone are far different from yours and others. You're knowledge is far beyond mine, being a Fender amp player for 35 years, I switched to a Mesa last winter as I tried of poor built quality with several Fender amps and I had always wanted a Mesa since my youth as I was a huge Santana and Lukather fan.
 
With all this talk, I just have to reiterate how much I wish PRS would introduce a low-wattage, pedal friendly amp for home use and home recording. The PRS amps are amazing if you can turn them up. Single channel, el84, 5-10 watts, with some kind of attenuator.

I once had a chance to buy a Sweet 16 head on clearance for $499. Didn't. Stupid, stupid, stupid...
 
I have Sweet 16 head number 5. I'm only telling you to rub it in...

[muffled maniacal laughter]

You animal.

It had a cool, fuzzy sound when the gain was cranked. Though I enjoyed it, I didn't think I would use that tone often. What I failed to see was that I could pair it with my 1x12 cab and have a blast running pedals into it at home. DUH!!!
 
Yeehaaa! (not that I ever thought any different).
 
Les,
All good points you've raised. My local shop (NStuffmusic.com) doesn't carry the PRS line of amps now. Last time I was there they had one of the SE line on clearance (they've made a big push to Suhr gear now, I was told by my salesman that PRS isn't selling much in the Western PA region any longer - they had 6 PRS guitars and 4 were SEs).
Back to amps - I'm a home player these days, haven't gigged out since college (mid-80s), so my needs and tone are far different from yours and others. You're knowledge is far beyond mine, being a Fender amp player for 35 years, I switched to a Mesa last winter as I tried of poor built quality with several Fender amps and I had always wanted a Mesa since my youth as I was a huge Santana and Lukather fan.

Well, of course I'm not knowledgeable on where PRS sells or doesn't...I know that Jack Gretz sells an awful lot of them near Scranton, but that's not Western PA.

And I don't want to say anything negative about Mesa amps...I love my Lone Star! I have it in the studio because it does a different, more compressed-Fendery-sounding, thing than my PRS amps, that make it spot-on for certain kinds of rhythm tracks; plus my son tours with one, so when he's in town, he's got an amp he's familiar with in case he wants to lay something down at my studio. And I can switch it down to 50 or 10 watts if I want. Nice for practicing at 10 watts.

So - It's a great amp. Just not as great as my PRS amps for the things that they do so well, namely, serve up very complex, warm and buttery tones. That's simply a rare thing these days, in my experience. And yes, even warmer and more buttery than my former Two-Rocks, though of course the style of amp is very different, too. The TRs are great at that Carlton/Ford tone, but they can snarl rock and roll when pushed, that's for sure. Um... did I mention they're LOUD? ;)

I also think Mesa did a great job with their Express series. So you'll get no criticism from me using Mesa!

I think the Suhr amps sound good, too...but they lean a little more modern-sounding to my ear when compared to the PRS HXDA, even the SL68. There's a Suhr dealer near me. I was impressed with their little 5 watt amp, thought it really sounded cool for the wattage.
 
The Archon has NOT been discontinued, it is listed on our 2016 price list and continues to be available for order.

I'm not surprised. It's hard to believe that folks will jump all over some salesman's ridiculous rumor-mongering.
 
There's a Suhr dealer near me. I was impressed with their little 5 watt amp, thought it really sounded cool for the wattage.

+1 on the Corso...love it for those times I don't wanna fire up my HX/DA or Archon (or SLO, Lonestar or Marshall). As others have repeatedly stated...I think PRS would really do well with a low wattage amp like this...focused on recording and home use.
 
I would have been surprised if the Archon was actually discontinued. It seems to be a good seller for them and many people in the high-gain community speak very highly of these amps. I really want one :(.
 
+1 on the Corso...love it for those times I don't wanna fire up my HX/DA or Archon (or SLO, Lonestar or Marshall). As others have repeatedly stated...I think PRS would really do well with a low wattage amp like this...focused on recording and home use.

I guess they might, simply based on the responses around here, although I do feel that many of the little 5-watt amps on the market are truly compromised for professional recording, compared to a bigger amp. They tend to lack bottom end, and sound raspy when pushed.

While that can be cool in the right hands, it can also be a serious limitation.

Sure, Page used an old Supro on a Zep album, and Clapton used a little Champ on Layla, but those were still hand wired amps of the era, that were a cut above most of the junk on the market today masquerading as recording amps.

The Suhr's a good amp, though. I've heard it in use. It's expensive for a little 5-watter and no wonder!

So if PRS makes one, I hope they do it at the highest tone quality level possible for a small amp. I'd hate to see PRS compromise their lineup with anything less than the best.
 
I guess they might, simply based on the responses around here, although I do feel that many of the little 5-watt amps on the market are truly compromised for professional recording, compared to a bigger amp. They tend to lack bottom end, and sound raspy when pushed.

While that can be cool in the right hands, it can also be a serious limitation.

So if PRS makes one, I hope they do it at the highest tone quality level possible for a small amp. I'd hate to see PRS compromise their lineup with anything less than the best.

Do you think the 5-ish watt amps are compromises because companies position them as entry level, budget conscious amps? I suppose some of the higher end companies are probably more serious about them, but many of the low and mid level companies naturally put 5-watt amps as the entry to their lineup. Which, I feel, is where a lot of those "meh" amps come from.

If PRS could hit the sweet spot, where they can spend enough on components and build to make a simple, great sounding amp, but price competitive enough that people would still be willing to pay for it, I think they'd sell. We've had plenty of visitors here looking for the best PRS amp for home or apartment use, but most of the current models are overkill for that. A single channel, 5 watt amp, TMB stack, bright switch, perhaps inspired by the rhythm channel of the Custom 50, would be killer. And, I would assume, could be done for around the $1000-1200 mark, or considerably less if they could work the kinks out as an SE offering. "Lacking bottom end" is the last thing I would say about my SE amp, in fact it would be a case of taming low end if made similarly.

5's can be cool. I tricked out a Valve Jr., as much as my knee-jerk reaction is to regard it as a toy, it actually sounds pretty good, considering I've got all of $300 into the head and matching 1x12. They sound like complete crap stock, but with a tone knob, boost, and 3-way voicing switch, and an oversized Hammond OT, the thing kicks now. I'm still surprised how many compliments I get on it. Of course, comparing it to what PRS would do is apples and rocket science. But, my point is, they can be simple, fun, and well done.
 
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