Amp Feel: A Thing.

László

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I've had this discussion with some of my fellow musicians from time to time: if you can't easily hear the difference between two amps on a recording, what's it matter which one you play?

I think it matters, and not just for how a particular amp inspires the player.

When we talk about how amps respond to one's playing, to one's pick attack, whether it has a lot of sustain, whether it accentuates the note attack or rounds it off...so many factors that can be discussed, these are things we simply lump into a category, Feel.

For me, the way an amp Feels is a Thing. An important thing. In fact, one of the most magical things about my HXDA is how well it responds to picking dynamics, how elastic it feels, how the notes attack and sustain, etc. I love how the amp works with me, instead of working against me. My other amps work in different ways, all good, but their feel is undeniably different.

One reason I'm not crazy about modelers is that they feel different, but that's a topic for another time ('m talking about hardware at this moment, not software or things that employ software to create a sound, such as a hardware modeler).

As much as I dig the sound and functionality of, for example, my Lone Star, the feel of the two single channel PRS amps I have puts them in a different league -- not necessarily better for the given player -- just different.

The feel of the DG30 is, when I play it, immediate. The attack is fast, very percussive, pick attacks come through very nicely, etc. It decays a bit faster than the HXDA, which makes it very well suited to certain styles.

Conversely, the HXDA has a more searing attack, sustains longer, breaks up earlier, and has a more forgiving and elastic feel.

Both of these amps sound so gorgeous (to me) that I would have a hard time doing a project without both of them.

The Lone Star has a crapload of headroom on the clean channel, so I mainly use it for that, or for a slight crunch. The gain channel is certainly very cool, but I like the feel of the HXDA's response for soloing, it just is a better fit for me (and it's also smoother and more elastic).

So what say you on the question I started this post with -- if you have two similar sounding amps, that would be hard to tell apart on a recording, does it matter to you whether the amps have a different feel? Is feel even a thing you care about, or is it just the tone?

After we're done with this, we can address the question of whether black tolex'd amps sound different from paisley, and whether I would sell/trade body parts for a leather covered PRS amp. ;)
 
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Ok, as a strictly hack bedroom/basement wannabe player, I would say that this does matter. Much in the same way that the feel between two different, but similar guitars. I'm by no means an amp guru, but I know that I enjoy playing more through some than I do others. Example; I had a Mesa MkV that was a GREAT amp, but there was just sooooo much to it that I felt constricted by it. Enter the Archon, not the same beast at all, but something that puts me at ease and delivers a smile whenever I plug it in, and turn it up. You could say similar realms of sound, I suppose. I'm probably more aware of this with guitars than amps, buts that's just because I'm a hack. Love me some Strat, but hate the feel of the neck all day, every day (except the soft V on the Clapton). Get me something that I can split and get reasonably close, and I'm happy all day long. Bottom line....it matters.
 
I think it matters...how a particular amp inspires the player.
The feel of an amp is part of what inspires me. That "breathing" thing, that temperament with pick dynamics, that ability to pick up the difference between using the flesh of my fingertips vs. using the tips with nails. All that stuff that makes me grin. Then when I dig in and sweep across all of the strings for a power chord with the two highest notes breaking up the speakers. :cool:
 
Also being a (living room) hack, I also think it matters. How one responds/feels/breathes in response to my particular mood that day makes a difference. My Archon 25 gets all the work( I have a Backstar that only gets plugged in when company is playing). Not two amps, but two channels. Most days it's the lead channel, but sometimes the clean channel with the KTR or Burnley pedal just hits it better.
 
Guys, there are no "hacks!"

Music isn't a contest. And no matter what you do in life, you can find someone you think or worry might be able to do it better.

Thing is, when it comes to making music, a player can do different things, even finger gymnastics on the highest order, and yet not move people.

Think about Neil Young's solos, f'instance. Dude moves people. I think it's because he really, really means it. But there's some kind of magic there, whatever he does.

Besides, most of you play more skillfully than I do, yet I get paid for it, which is truly amazing. I'm sure anyone here could do a great job on a recording or whatever if they wanted to.
 
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When I'm playing at home, I like the spongiest feel possible. When I'm playing in the band, I quickly get frustrated with my amp if it's too spongy.
 
I can't articulate it, but I get it. I play through a Suhr/CAA PT100 and a Marshall VM. On paper and by price tag the PT should be the far superior amp. (The cleans are far superior) But the VM has that feel that is just right for what I do. Funny thing is two weeks ago I would have sworn the VM was in serious need of a rebias. But each of this week's sessions with 3 different guitars resulted in THE sound sans rebias.
 
I can't articulate it, but I get it. I play through a Suhr/CAA PT100 and a Marshall VM. On paper and by price tag the PT should be the far superior amp. (The cleans are far superior) But the VM has that feel that is just right for what I do.

That's why it's good to have both, right? You have one for when you want its superior cleans, and another for other stuff you do.

My own take on the two amps is that the Suhr PT-100 gets its most killer sound at big-stage volume levels, i.e., the kind of stage levels that Pete Thorn needs for his high end touring shows, and is truly a great amp, but so is the VM. If memory serves the VM is used by Robin Trower these days. So it's no slouch!
 
To me it is about which amp dynamics work best with my hands. I will always sound like me through any guitar and any amp. The way I experience different guitars and amps is how hard it feels/how tired I get making it sound like me. And the easier it is, the less I think about it while I play.

A great amp or guitar for me feels effortless, so I can let go and just listen to what comes out.

As such, there is no single guitar or amp that is a grail for me. There are lots of great amps that I feel very comfortable playing.

One more aspect about it is that I may want to get a certain bite or saturation. Some amps will do it by themselves, some with a drive pedal in front. Recordings of me through an RA100 and my Archon sound identical to me. But I had to use an OD808 with the RA to get there, and the Archon just feels better to me.
 
My Custom 50 has something that feels different than her little sibling the SE30 - despite being very similar designs, the Custom 50 feels like it has less "sag," a more immediate and precise feel especially to low end notes. At first one would be tempted to think it's all in the bass EQ, but I've tweaked that from one extreme to the other with a 10 band EQ on the SE30, and no matter how much bass I dialed out, that squishy feeling never went away. I should note, it wasn't a bad feeling, just different. So, now, although I have the amps EQ'd to be nearly identical, there's more to the sound and feel than that, which is apparent to me, and probably would be to a keen listener as well.
 
Is it safe to assume that you are using the same pickups and guitar when you compare the different amps? Historically I have always looked for or observed those differences you described when comparing different models of pickups but I find it to be very interesting that you have detailed these differences in the amps. Now that I think about it, it does make sense. I have deliberately made a habit out of thinking about the amplifier side of the signal path whenever I am evaluating the tone I get from a particular set of pickups, because the two (pickups and amp) are essentially inseparable. They both work together to produce tone but it never occurred to me till now that the amp side of the relationship would have that detailed of a contribution. In other words, I knew it was important but didn't realize it was important to that level.
 
I can't speak for Les, but I know I have compared amps with the same guitar(s), and found the difference in feel can be dramatic.

Example: I have played through a Tone King Comet since 2006 (2007?), and I bought a Splawn Quickrod in 2013, for giggles mostly; side by side, the Quickrod was MUCH stiffer/more aggressive feeling than the Comet. Wildly different. I was expecting the sound difference, but the feel difference made playing the amp uncomfortable at first. I eventually grew to enjoy playing it, but sadly it never was something that I could get away with in my decidedly not-rock band. It was too heavy to justify taking it to shows for 5-6 songs, and too expensive to sit in my house, so I sold it. I think I may try one of the Lo Vo models somewhere down the road!
 
I will always sound like me through any guitar and any amp.

I always sound like me, but I sound like me different through different amps, and with different guitars. ;)

Seriously, I could post links to a bunch of clips that demonstrate this, but you've heard them already.
 
There is no simpler or more clear way to demonstrate this "feel" effect, than by playing something with several different power output options, such as a Mesa Trans Atlantic 15. The amp offers 3 power stage choices. 5 watt SE Class A, 15 watt push pull Class A, and 25 watt Dyna Watt (A/B). I said many times at TGP that you didn't just select one based on volume, but rather feel. The Hi 1 (Marshall) setting with the 5 watt SE output stage was THE bedroom Marshall tone I always wanted because it had that vibey, loser Class A feel and sounded really good. The 15 watt setting also sounded very good and felt very good. The 25 watt sounded more like a "real" Marshall, because it was tighter and punchier, and it sounded really good. But the 5 watt mode was so nice you could just play it all day and love it.

Many times when I hear guys go on and on using terms like "juicy" and "fat" cleans, it's the feel of the amp that they love. The opposite of stiff and tight, these cleans don't sound sterile at all and are lovely and fun and easy to play.
 
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