58/15 S pickups...in the SE Hollowbodies

[DogPhishHead]

I've had my standard hollowbody for a few months now, played with the pickup heights, tried 3 brands of strings (D'Addarios, NYXL and E Ball) and I'm just kind of "meh" about these pups. Just not getting a great depth on the neck (seems rather dull, mid heavy ?) and the middle is lack luster in the "bouncy" sound. The bridge doesn't seem to have more output than the neck. Maybe it's just me wanting more as the SE Paul's guitar pups are punchy, deep and well defined in the top end and of course the 57/08s in my McCarty are my favorites.

Anyone else ? Thoughts on these 58/15 "S" pups, variations on heights ? I'm playing through a Mesa Express 5:25 with a Vintage 30 speaker.

 

[Aahzz]

I've had my standard hollowbody for a few months now, played with the pickup heights, tried 3 brands of strings (D'Addarios, NYXL and E Ball) and I'm just kind of "meh" about these pups. Just not getting a great depth on the neck (seems rather dull, mid heavy ?) and the middle is lack luster in the "bouncy" sound. The bridge doesn't seem to have more output than the neck. Maybe it's just me wanting more as the SE Paul's guitar pups are punchy, deep and well defined in the top end and of course the 57/08s in my McCarty are my favorites.

Anyone else ? Thoughts on these 58/15 "S" pups, variations on heights ? I'm playing through a Mesa Express 5:25 with a Vintage 30 speaker.

When I first got my SE HB II, I was quite pleased with them, but the more I play them after switching back and forth with my CE, I'm thinking they just sound a bit dull and muddy by comparison - though they still sound great when I'm playing with my band, so maybe it's just comparisonitis - either way, haven't decided yet, but she may be getting a set of Railhammers in the future...

 

[DogPhishHead]

When I first got my SE HB II, I was quite pleased with them, but the more I play them after switching back and forth with my CE, I'm thinking they just sound a bit dull and muddy by comparison - though they still sound great when I'm playing with my band, so maybe it's just comparisonitis - either way, haven't decided yet, but she may be getting a set of Railhammers in the future...

Best I can do is use my SP Compressor with the guitar. Low compression, blend at 9 oclock...sorta gives them some clarity and "pop".

 

[PRSnewb]

To put it lightly, I’m not a fan of them.

edit: I’m talking about 85/15s, sorry.

 

[Aahzz]

To put it lightly, I’m not a fan of them.

Didn't you have the SE Standard? That has 85/15 S, not 58/15 S. Slightly confusing because of the similar names, but rather different pickups.

 

[PRSnewb]

Didn't you have the SE Standard? That has 85/15 S, not 58/15 S. Slightly confusing because of the similar names, but rather different pickups.

You are correct sir! Wow just the first two digits swapped, my bad.

 

[CandidPicker]

The SE HB is a different guitar, because of the all-mahogany build. Sounds deeper, more structured for chording than leads. The SE HBII by comparison is brighter because of the maple laminate top and back. They're 2 separate tone machines, and it's not possible to get one to sound like the other without some external EQing or compression.

Regards the 58/15s pickups, my SE HBII Piezo sounds "great" from a subjective viewpoint. While some may think the 58/15s lack specific qualities, I have no personal compliant against them.

I think what you hear may be the result of the SE HB's build structure. Not sure what to suggest since the SE HB was your initial choice.

 

[John Beef]

I think the bridge and middle positions sound great on my SEHBStandard, but the neck is just too dull sounding. I wasn't really planning to change pickups on the guitar, but I found a DiMarzio Bluesbucker (great neck pickup I had kind of forgotten about) on TGP for like $50, and I have a bridge non-TM 57/08 looking for a good home, and lots of spare CTS pots and stuff, so I guess my guitar is going to get a complete electronic makeover.

What's interesting is I usually find stock SE pickups great for the neck and sort of harsh in the bridge position, but this guitar was the opposite.

 

[DogPhishHead]

I think the bridge and middle positions sound great on my SEHBStandard, but the neck is just too dull sounding. I wasn't really planning to change pickups on the guitar, but I found a DiMarzio Bluesbucker (great neck pickup I had kind of forgotten about) on TGP for like $50, and I have a bridge non-TM 57/08 looking for a good home, and lots of spare CTS pots and stuff, so I guess my guitar is going to get a complete electronic makeover.

What's interesting is I usually find stock SE pickups great for the neck and sort of harsh in the bridge position, but this guitar was the opposite.

I do like the bridge, gets into the John Scofield range with a little drive and tone knob roll off. The middle is ok, maybe I need to raise the bridge pickup a tad higher to compensate for the neck ?

 

[dogrocketp]

Candid picker is dead on the money about the Standard. I put NYXL’s on it, it dropped the pickups, raise the polepieces, and had a killer jazz neck sound. Remember, these are TRUE hollowbodies. You’ll never get them to sound like solid bodies because, well, they’re not! Learn to hear them as hollowbodies. They do that better than some guitars that cost three times as much. There will always be more air in the sound, because that’s how hollowbodies sound. When they’re broken in, they’ll vibrate like there’s no tomorrow and you get to find out why hollowbodies are so special. My only non-PRS guitars are my hollowbodies that I’ve played for years. They’re in the back of the rack since I got the PRS SE Hollowbody piezo. I was happy with the Standard, but Jack had to go have the piezo made in blue, so I was powerless. I can only realistically keep one.

 

[OGORMANIA]

Get out a screwdriver and start fiddling with pickup heights. It's free and can help shape the tone of your guitar. I'd suggest just starting with the basic height adjustment screws and not the pole pieces.

Measure them and make sure they are PRS recommended specs via their website.

Then tweak from there. I found my bass side of the neck pickup was set too close from factory making it overly boomy.

 

[CandidPicker]

My hope is to round out the tone balance, putting T-I .10-.46 jazz strings on, and using a Radial PRO DI direct box between SE HBII Piezo MIX output and FRFR108 powered speaker.

My intuition tells me that the T-I strings will soften and create a more balanced tone, especially with the wound G. The Radial enhances the balance but not so much curtails the higher frequency treble transients. If anything, I've taken steps to protect the guitar's tone response from being too bright, but not being dark, muddy, nor lacking clarity.

Also, theoretically, you could adjust the pickup heights, but not the overall pole heights, and test the string volume response (Either your ears or a dB meter. Some DAW plug-ins are loudness meters, I think I own a Waves plug-in of this type). Set your amp for clean response, and test at several volume levels. You'll want consistency and clarity across the volume level ranges. Then set the amp for crunch and/or lead tones, and repeat the tests again. If your pickup heights are within PRS specs (give or take some mild variance), the pickup response should be clear, articulate, well-defined, and balanced across treble, midrange and bass.

If perhaps you'd like slightly more pronounced frequencies, small pickup height adjustments will accomplish this. It might be helpful to make notes for those who wish to learn from your research. My thanks in advance to the folks who will perform these tests and present their findings. Here is the PRS Support Page link for those who might need some guidance before trying this...

https://www.prsguitars.com/index.php/support/article/pickup_height_adjustment

 

[Number6Photo]

I’m with others on this thread that find the neck pickup on the SE HB II dull. I have some experience with other hollow bodies that have clear and beautiful sounding neck pickups, so it’s not like I’m comparing the PRS to a solid body. I owned a custom fully-hollow Heritage Prospect (which I sold), and I currently have a Gibson ES-390 with P90s. Both those guitars are thin-line and made with laminated maple tops and backs, fairly similar to the SE HB II. Those other guitars have beautiful neck pickup tone, regardless of the pickup/pole heights. The bridge pickups on those guitars are just OK. Oddly enough, I really like the bridge pickup on the SE II HB: it has a nice snarl.

But the neck pickup tone on this SE II HB is dull and muffled, regardless of pickup height. I think I’m going to take the wiring harness out to see if there’s is an extra capacitor strapped across the neck pickup circuit because I’ve never heard anything so dark and lifeless and I didn’t think it was possible for a magnetic pickup to sound that muted on its own.

 

[OGORMANIA]

I’m with others on this thread that find the neck pickup on the SE HB II dull. I have some experience with other hollow bodies that have clear and beautiful sounding neck pickups, so it’s not like I’m comparing the PRS to a solid body. I owned a custom fully-hollow Heritage Prospect (which I sold), and I currently have a Gibson ES-390 with P90s. Both those guitars are thin-line and made with laminated maple tops and backs, fairly similar to the SE HB II. Those other guitars have beautiful neck pickup tone, regardless of the pickup/pole heights. The bridge pickups on those guitars are just OK. Oddly enough, I really like the bridge pickup on the SE II HB: it has a nice snarl.

But the neck pickup tone on this SE II HB is dull and muffled, regardless of pickup height. I think I’m going to take the wiring harness out to see if there’s is an extra capacitor strapped across the neck pickup circuit because I’ve never heard anything so dark and lifeless and I didn’t think it was possible for a magnetic pickup to sound that muted on its own.

Interesting. My neck pickup does not emit those characteristics. I love the neck pickup on my HBII. Get nice bell like chime passed the 12th fret. And low strings are tight and not boomy.

 

[BeerGolfGuitars]

I have the all mahogany SE Hollowbody, but I wouldn’t describe the pickups as dull or lifeless at all. They’re definitely warm and I do keep the tone knob all the way up. Playing around the the pickup heights really got them into a balanced sweet spot for me — was able to add a good bit of clarity and avoid any booming or muddy low end. The overall mellow warmth, though, gives the guitar a nice contrast to my other electrics.

 

[CandidPicker]

I have the all mahogany SE Hollowbody, but I wouldn’t describe the pickups as dull or lifeless at all. They’re definitely warm and I do keep the tone knob all the way up. Playing around the the pickup heights really got them into a balanced sweet spot for me — was able to add a good bit of clarity and avoid any booming or muddy low end. The overall mellow warmth, though, gives the guitar a nice contrast to my other electrics.

Will agree here. When you listen to the YT PRS videos that showcase each of the PRS SE HB line, the standard mahogany seems woolier/woodier/lower midrangy/crunchy(?), designed for rhythm chording, whereas the HBII and HBII Piezo brighter because of the maple laminate, designed for both chords and cutting upper midrange leads, with a little more snap and presence. I'd dare say that the HB Standard was designed to be a rhythm instrument more than a lead one, but that is what the video seems to display; YMMV.

Congrats on finding a happy alternative to ditching the pickups, though; sometimes it pays better to try the test and tweak method before considering swapping pickups...

P.S. Welcome to the forum!

 

[dogrocketp]

To my ears the standard has the true jazz tone with no modifications whatsoever. IF I didn't have my old jazzboxes, it would still be in the apartment. It's a great guitar.

 

[Number6Photo]

I have the all mahogany SE Hollowbody, but I wouldn’t describe the pickups as dull or lifeless at all. They’re definitely warm and I do keep the tone knob all the way up. Playing around the the pickup heights really got them into a balanced sweet spot for me — was able to add a good bit of clarity and avoid any booming or muddy low end. The overall mellow warmth, though, gives the guitar a nice contrast to my other electrics.

I think you're hitting on another aspect: you like the tone, but you keep the tone knob turned up all the way. I can say I'm definitely used to brighter sounds out of the neck pickup, and usually turn the tone knob (and/or the volume knob) down a notch or two to roll off some of the high end on my other guitars. So it seems to me PRS has tried to voice the neck pickup as a darker sound than normal, and for my tastes, went one notch too far. But I can see how others may like this tone, especially if you're into jazz (which I am not).

Anyway, glad to hear you and others are enjoying it. I think I could really love this guitar with a brighter neck pickup. We'll see.

 

[BeerGolfGuitars]

I think you're hitting on another aspect: you like the tone, but you keep the tone knob turned up all the way. I can say I'm definitely used to brighter sounds out of the neck pickup, and usually turn the tone knob (and/or the volume knob) down a notch or two to roll off some of the high end on my other guitars. So it seems to me PRS has tried to voice the neck pickup as a darker sound than normal, and for my tastes, went one notch too far. But I can see how others may like this tone, especially if you're into jazz (which I am not).

Anyway, glad to hear you and others are enjoying it. I think I could really love this guitar with a brighter neck pickup. We'll see.

This is a really fair point and I definitely get where you’re coming from. This is the only guitar I’ve had where I don’t feel like there’s a situation where I really need to dial back the tone. If it were my only guitar, I could see myself looking at changing the pickups. But since it isn’t, I like that the 58/15s aren’t a redundant sounding pickup in the lineup.

 

[NBW]

I’m having the opposite reaction to my SE HBII I think the neck sounds pretty good compared to my Ibanez semi hollow with upgraded Giovanni HB-2s. For me the bridge is a bit too trebly. I was able to get a great jazz tone out of the Ibanez in the middle position, on the HBII it’s a bit more jangly than I like.