12 Amp comparison by Tim Pierce

[László]

I like this video. I watched it again and it seems more ‘variations on a theme’ than a bunch of wildly diverse tones in one room.

I find that interesting!

I think I’m that way, too, maybe most of us are; I dial in my basic ‘Les tone’, and then tweak the controls on a given amp that bring out its distinctive sounds without losing my basic sound - - as opposed to using one amp for blues, another for rock, a third for alternative, etc.

I like a certain ratio of gain to clean that I dial in, I want certain harmonics to jump out, etc. Once that’s done, I’ll let the amp do its thing, but it’s no wonder that I could do most sessions with any one of my amps.

I’d love to read other folks’ approaches to using a variety of amps!

 

[Deleted member 5962]

I like this video. I watched it again and it seems more ‘variations on a theme’ than a bunch of wildly diverse tones in one room.

I find that interesting!

I watched this video three times when the thread was started, but as you’ll see I never commented. The only reason I didn’t, was because I was shocked at how similar the amps all sounded! Oh, I can hear differences in every one. But it was very much like he dialed them almost as if he was trying to make them sound the same... which goes along with your theory. I think he’s dialed in his Tim Tone on each and they definitely end up as variations of a theme, rather than the diversity of tones one would expect. Given the variety of things, styles and music he plays on, it makes this even more surprising to me. You’d think he’d have a couple dial super clean, some mild breakup, some crunchy,and some gainy. He has a lot of them dialed very close to the same gain range. And I too find that interesting.

 

[László]

I watched this video three times when the thread was started, but as you’ll see I never commented. The only reason I didn’t, was because I was shocked at how similar the amps all sounded! Oh, I can hear differences in every one. But it was very much like he dialed them almost as if he was trying to make them sound the same... which goes along with your theory. I think he’s dialed in his Tim Tone on each and they definitely end up as variations of a theme, rather than the diversity of tones one would expect. Given the variety of things, styles and music he plays on, it makes this even more surprising to me. You’d think he’d have a couple dial super clean, some mild breakup, some crunchy,and some gainy. He has a lot of them dialed very close to the same gain range. And I too find that interesting.

Right?

The person dialing in his sounds hears the differences from his/her usual tones, but for a listener they come off far more subtle than I might otherwise expect.

Like, he’s got the Diezel, and I’d expect djent, djent or chug, chug, but no, he’s got it dialed in similar to his Marshalls. Yes, it’s different, but the gain structure isn’t all that far off.

Of course, we’re not hearing it smokin’ in the emotion of a session.

The other thing is that his voice mic picks up the acoustic sound of the guitar being played, which is not something that shows up on a recording. I find that a little disconcerting.

Anyhow, I listened back to a few recordings I’ve done and sometimes it’s easier to tell than other times. For instance, the DG30/594 Soapbar combination is immediately obvious.

 

[Boogie]

... The DG50 sounded like he really needed to cut the bass knob back. Bottom was way too loose. Surely that was not a great representation of it. Maybe he was past the SWEET SPOT!

The precursor to the DG50, the Super Dallas, counts on that huge bass to do very unkind things to the speakers in a 2x12. Mic technique will quell much of the rumble, but other mics in the area will pick it back up. My rig would compete toe-to-toe with our bassist with his beastly Ampeg rig as to who was shaking the stage more! Speaker excursion and distortion can make for the most amazing tonal influence. I’m guessing he hadn’t set it optimally.

 

[Black Plaid]

Like, he’s got the Diezel, and I’d expect djent, djent or chug, chug, but no, he’s got it dialed in similar to his Marshalls. Yes, it’s different, but the gain structure isn’t all that far off.

It may be what he intended for this comparison, showing how each amp is different (or similar) at the same sort of general purpose setting he might typically use.

I think he even says something like "I have the Diezel because some things need that.", which makes me think he really does choose and tweak amps based on the sessions needs.

 

[László]

It may be what he intended for this comparison, showing how each amp is different (or similar) at the same sort of general purpose setting he might typically use.

I think he even says something like "I have the Diezel because some things need that.", which makes me think he really does choose and tweak amps based on the sessions needs.

No doubt you’re right!

Still, it’s interesting to hear the similarities in the settings.

 

[jak3af3r]

I'd love to read other folks’ approaches to using a variety of amps!

If I do studio stuff, I always try and get as much info as possible so I only have to bring one or two amps that suit the producers needs or wants.

My road gigs, I'll take whatever I feel like since it's a big variety between classic country, classic rock, 80's hair rock, some blues, and modern country.

However, I'll sometimes take a "F" style amp if it's a two-steppin' all night kind of gig. More recently I've been taking my infamous "D" style amp which does all the "F" amp sounds plus has that overdrive. I used to take a "V"everywhere and I still sounded like me. Just varying versions of me that sometimes react differently to the amps if that makes any sense.

And why can't these amp makers start with another letter that isn't so...in the gutter.

 

[Tosca]

And why can't these amp makers start with another letter that isn't so...in the gutter.

This crew can drag all 26 letters into the gutter.

 

[Boogie]

Life is more amusing in the gutter...where you’re perpetually 13 years old.

 

[László]

More recently I've been taking my infamous "D" style amp which does all the "F" amp sounds plus has that overdrive.

I was a Two-Rock player from 2003-2013. I had several models, but my favorite was the Onyx Signature v2. The clean channel was their classic Dumble/Fender clean, and overdrive was kind of a blend that went from Fender to Marshall to Dumble, depending on its settings. I pretty much recorded exclusively with TRs.

Each TR was my main, and often only, amp during those years. Later on, I switched to their classic Dumble style model, but I missed the Onyx, and after a year or so with a Mesa (whose amps I’ve also always found useful), I landed on PRS’ HXDA and DG30, and they’ve remained my main amps since 2014.

In any case, I love Dumble style amps - they work so well in any number of situations!

 

[dmatthews]

In any case, I love Dumble style amps - they work so well in any number of situations!

Such a great platform.

 

[jak3af3r]

I also just got a voltage regulator/attenuator which has really helped in the separation of sounds from each amp.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

I also just got a voltage regulator/attenuator which has really helped in the separation of sounds from each amp.

Details please

 

[jak3af3r]

Details please

I bought a 1964 Supro Thunderbolt which is supposed to run at 117 volts over a year ago sort of as a working collector's piece.

Recently I listened to a podcast with Skip Simmons (some vintage amp guru) and he was going on about running old amps at proper or lower voltages for component life and health. And I thought my old Supro needed a regulator/attenuator.

I got the brown box (the bigger more expensive one) because it has enough juice to handle my 135 watt twin plus another amp AND it has more than two wall voltage settings.



For those interested keep reading here for operation, otherwise skip ahead to the results. So what you do is plug it in and turn the unit on. It spits out the wall voltage reading on a screen when set to "bypass." Then there's a voltage selection knob you turn to match the wall voltage and a reduction knob that goes down to 10% under wall voltage. Then you plug the amp in the box and then the amp on and it will display the voltage to the amp and the current draw. From there you can play around with the reduction levels to get the amp in its happy place.



Back to results.

What it does is almost like the amp can breathe. The highs aren't as harsh and the whole amp sort of mellows out. So far the most noticable difference has been on my dumble clone and Princeton reissue that both really really like running on 110V. The Princeton doesn't hum as much, the dumble is totally silent and they just sound more like themselves. It's difficult to explain and I don't know that an A/B recorded demo would fully capture the difference. I'll try it and if it does, I might record something to upload of people are interested in that sort of thing.

 

[László]

I
What it does is almost like the amp can breathe. The highs aren't as harsh and the whole amp sort of mellows out. So far the most noticable difference has been on my dumble clone and Princeton reissue that both really really like running on 110V. The Princeton doesn't hum as much, the dumble is totally silent and they just sound more like themselves. It's difficult to explain and I don't know that an A/B recorded demo would fully capture the difference. I'll try it and if it does, I might record something to upload of people are interested in that sort of thing.

I’m a firm believer that the AC power (and how it’s delivered) matters. In my workstation area I use an Equi-Tech isolation transformer that puts out the correct voltage and converts the system to balanced power, which measurably reduces noise by around 8-10 dB. For the amps I use a Furman PF 1800 PSR that doesn’t regulate voltage, but does have a 45 amp power reservoir. There’s an audible difference with the amps.

I’m also one of those nutty guys who uses special power cables with the amps and audio gear, and find that doing so makes a clear difference. I should get a voltage regulator for the amps, too.

 

[jak3af3r]

I’m a firm believer that the AC power (and how it’s delivered) matters.

A power conditioner is on my short list of things to get.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

I still believe that power differences (varying voltage levelss and dirty power) are the main reasons our amps sound better one day than the next.

 

[László]

A power conditioner is on my short list of things to get.

Most conditioners don’t do much of anything. Some won’t even stop a surge properly, and some cause noise (this was proven to me years ago by my old studio tech using an oscilloscope; he sadly passed away and his clients miss him!).

The Furman stuff is reputable; the PF1800 PF-R is a very solid piece of gear.

I still believe that power differences (varying voltage levelss and dirty power) are the main reasons our amps sound better one day than the next.

I tend to agree. I’ve noticed that my wall outlet puts out 120V on a good day, and up to 125 volts on a bad one. I do need a regulator, and Furman does make one designed for studio gear and amps. I could plug the amps into my Equi-Tech unit, but I’ve got only recording gear plugged into it, and I like to keep that separate from the amps.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

Most conditioners don’t do much of anything. Some won’t even stop a surge properly, and some cause noise (this was proven to me years ago by my old studio tech using an oscilloscope; he sadly passed away and his clients miss him!).

The Furman stuff is reputable; the PF1800 PF-R is a very solid piece of gear.



I tend to agree. I’ve noticed that my wall outlet puts out 120V on a good day, and up to 125 volts on a bad one. I do need a regulator, and Furman does make one designed for studio gear and amps. I could plug the amps into my Equi-Tech unit, but I’ve got only recording gear plugged into it, and I like to keep that separate from the amps.

I've seen 117 to 128 in the amp room. Several times in the last few months I had checked it, only because I thought the amps didn't sound that great. But my whack readings were the clue that my meter was going bad... which relates to me not knowing the bias was off on the Custom 50 before deciding to sell it. It was probably the bias, not the wall voltage that made me think the C50 was expendable.

 

[jak3af3r]

I don't need a conditioner for home as I'm fortunate to have 120-121V at the wall where I am currently. There used to be this place we played semi-regularly that would make my amps sound like it had a microphonic tube no matter what amp/pedals/guitar I took. They closed thankfully. I may still take the brown box out just to see how different the power is in places even if I'm just running through my helix.


That really sucks about the custom 50. Biased correctly and with the right voltage, I'm sure it would've been a killer amp.