Experience = NAD?

Which amp do you like best?


  • Total voters
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Note that the difference between 0.05% and 0.0005% is 100x, or 40dB.

A couple of things. THD is a ration of signal levels not a signal level itself. It is misleading to attach a dB to a percentage.

Also, a difference of 100X in things that are measured in dB is a difference of 20dB, not 40.
 
Volts is 20*logX. Power is 10*logX. So yes, 100x is 20dB for power, but it's 40dB for Volts. I rarely work in power so I didn't think about that. Either way, it's >>3dB.

It is standard practice to attach dB to any ratio. % is another way to express a ratio, but they are no different. You will find THD in %, but THD+N or SNR as dB. They are the same.
 
Somehow, I think I agree with you all. I guess my point has always been that worry less about the absolute numbers and more about the sound quality generated when all of the components are working in harmony. Manufacturers can control what you want to read and hear.
 
Somehow, I think I agree with you all. I guess my point has always been that worry less about the absolute numbers and more about the sound quality generated when all of the components are working in harmony. Manufacturers can control what you want to read and hear.

Exactly.

Spec sheets are always interesting, but generally the ears rule.
 
So I realize it's not really in the same league as the amps we've been discussing, but what are peoples' thoughts on the Fender Bassbreaker 15? It seems to be pretty highly regarded so far (Chappers says it's the best amp Fender has ever made), and at that price, I could probably swing a P245SH or McCarty at Experience.
 
So I realize it's not really in the same league as the amps we've been discussing

You just answered the question. It's not in the same league as the amps we've been discussing.

A great amp might be the best, most impactful, tone investment a guitar player can make. A compromise there compromises the tone of every guitar you play through it. A great amp enhances the tone of every guitar you play through it.

A crummy amp is a stopgap, won't be a keeper because it's inherently compromised. My belief with gear is simple:

Do it right, you do it once, or at least less often. In the long run, you save by making a good investment.

I've yet to hear a demo of these Bassbreaker amps that sounds more than marginal. Clean, they sound merely OK. Well what doesn't? They sound progressively worse to me as they break up and distort.

Chappers is in the business of hyping product to sell. The amp is "reviewed" for a music store. It's a sales tool, nothing more. Take it for what you will. Fender has made some of the greatest amps in history; the original Tweed amps; the Vibro Verb, the Twin, the Bassman, the Deluxe, the Vibro King, and numerous others we've all heard on countless records and in concerts. To call this amp the best ever from Fender is really just a complete load.

If you have had to compromise on your guitars - I don't know what you're playing - well, great, start upgrading there, and get a great guitar ahead of a great amp. I can see that.

But if you have great guitars already, don't skimp on the amp. There's no mileage in it.
 
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I figured it couldn't hurt to ask, but I also guessed the answer would be along those lines. And I do agree strongly with your philosophy about doing it right.

I don't think I'm too compromised when it comes to guitars. I've got a Vela (which I probably spend the most time with), a 2004 Hollowbody 2 (no piezo), and a 1994 American Standard Strat. I've just been GASing pretty hard for a P245. I think I was probably just hoping somebody would tell me I could have my cake and eat it too. :p
 
So I realize it's not really in the same league as the amps we've been discussing, but what are peoples' thoughts on the Fender Bassbreaker 15? It seems to be pretty highly regarded so far (Chappers says it's the best amp Fender has ever made), and at that price, I could probably swing a P245SH or McCarty at Experience.

I tried one a while back... I was unpressed. I think with more time to tweak it, and try it in a more controlled environment, it's probably a pretty good sounding amp for that price range. But any sound I could want out of the Bassbreaker, I can get with the Custom 50, and better.

The Bassbreaker 15 reminds me, in some ways, of the Egnater Tweaker head I had a while back. Fun amp, had a good vibe and was definitely useful, but didn't just flat out floor me the way the Custom 50 does.
 
While I still plan to do quite a bit of testing (I'm off work the week leading up to Experience, and I think I've even identified a dealer in driving distance with an Electra Dyne), it really is sounding like the Custom 50 is likely to be the pick. Guess I'll just have to keep on GASing for that P245 SH.
 
While I still plan to do quite a bit of testing (I'm off work the week leading up to Experience, and I think I've even identified a dealer in driving distance with an Electra Dyne), it really is sounding like the Custom 50 is likely to be the pick. Guess I'll just have to keep on GASing for that P245 SH.

It's good to have GAS... err, goals!
 
IMHO the Custom 50 is a phenomenal amp, and the only alternative I'd even consider at this point that does similar things, would be the Mesa Petrucci 2C+ amp. But the Petrucci is $600 more than the Custom 50, and its clean channel doesn't sound as good IMHO.

What I like about the Petrucci amp is that when it's crunchy, it sounds like my old '94 Tremoverb. I used to be addicted to that tone, so there's that.

Still, I'd buy the Custom 50, have a better amp, and pocket the $600 change.
 
1But the Petrucci is $600 more than the Custom 50, and its clean channel doesn't sound as good IMHO.
Kind of surprised by this, I'm (eventually) getting it just for the clean channel. I love that clean channel. Sounds like nothing else I've heard, but then if you want it to break up a little bit, I could understand your disappointment.
 
Kind of surprised by this, I'm (eventually) getting it just for the clean channel. I love that clean channel. Sounds like nothing else I've heard, but then if you want it to break up a little bit, I could understand your disappointment.

No, I wouldn't want its clean channel to break up. I have other amps that do that.

Hey, we're all different, right? We want different tones.

Some Mesas have clean channels I dig - the Lone Star is one - and some don't. On the other hand, I don't love the dirty channel on the Lone Star at all, and yet I bought one even though I have yet to find a tone I really like with it.

And one of my favorite amps of all time was my old Tremoverb, and I wasn't crazy about its clean channel either. I sometimes get an amp just because it does certain things I like, even if it does other things I don't love.

But the clean channel on the Custom 50 sounds even better to me than the clean channel on my Lone Star. That's the amp I wish I'd bought instead.

I think I just love the tone of PRS' cleans more than Mesa's cleans. Nothing wrong with that. At some point I'll get a Petrucci amp just for its Channel Two. I really like that, it's different from my PRS amps.
 
Hey, we're all different, right? We want different tones.
Yeah, sure, wasn't trying to convince you to like the clean channel, just ...not so much arguing, as just discussing. I went to an instore, and it sounded delicious. I wonder if it's because the East Coast rep (who gave the demo) knew what he was doing combined with hearing it in person as opposed to via YouTube. You know, like that "opening up" you discussed in the Arturia collection thread.
 
No, I wouldn't want its clean channel to break up. I have other amps that do that.

Hey, we're all different, right? We want different tones.

Some Mesas have clean channels I dig - the Lone Star is one - and some don't. On the other hand, I don't love the dirty channel on the Lone Star at all, and yet I bought one even though I have yet to find a tone I really like with it.

And one of my favorite amps of all time was my old Tremoverb, and I wasn't crazy about its clean channel either. I sometimes get an amp just because it does certain things I like, even if it does other things I don't love.

But the clean channel on the Custom 50 sounds even better to me than the clean channel on my Lone Star. That's the amp I wish I'd bought instead.

I think I just love the tone of PRS' cleans more than Mesa's cleans. Nothing wrong with that. At some point I'll get a Petrucci amp just for its Channel Two. I really like that, it's different from my PRS amps.

So, Les, you could sell that Lone Star and get a Custom 50 head and not have to deal with a 90lb amp! Of course, the Mesa is probably on wheels, but I bet you like to get it off the floor.

So far, my experience with the Custom 50, is that the clean channel is one of those tones that just makes me go, "oh, yeahhhhhhh" every time I play through it - and I'm not even using the recommended speakers at this point. It's a warm, lush tone that can work in a good amount of sparkle, without sounding harsh. It's got a lot of bottom, but nicely tuned, and makes it easy to add a tubescreamer without getting instant tinnitus. Plus, something I notice about both my PRS amps is that they have a clean tone similar to and just as instantly satisfying as a good Fender, but have more midrange available than most Fender amps, which is nice to have access to.

I'd be interested to put the Custom and a Lonestar side by side and A/B the drive channels. To me, it sounds like the Lonestar has a very American inspired crunch tone, where the Custom has a little bit of Marshall influence and perhaps some of the Mesa Mark series in there too. It's no clone of anything, but it can get close, especially playing with the mids, and the subtle, yet useful, mid shift, which can add or remove girth from the low mids. Some people say it's got a modern, metal and heavy rock vibe, but I don't totally buy that... well at least not with my current speakers. It doesn't have the tight, low end thump and blistering bite of the Rectifier or Archon flavor. It certainly has cut, but it's warmer on top and looser on the bottom. Probably something a Mark V could emulate more so than a chug machine, but here I go again talking about amps I've not tried.

I had also been pondering a Mesa Stiletto Stage II, and that probably isn't over, but I'm glad I got the Custom first. I think the hot, JCM tone would be right up my alley, but I highly doubt the clean channel would come close to the Custom, nor would the amp be as useful as an all-around tool. If I've got to haul an amp to gigs, I want to love all of it, not have to face a compromise on one channel.
 
I wonder if it's because the East Coast rep (who gave the demo) knew what he was doing combined with hearing it in person as opposed to via YouTube. You know, like that "opening up" you discussed in the Arturia collection thread.

Could be. I definitely liked the YouTube Sweetwater demo a LOT more than the factory demo, so you make a good point. I'll reserve judgment until I can play one.

There's a certain quality to some clean tones I really like, and over the years, it's been hard for me to find. The PRS amps have it. Two-Rocks have it. Some Mesas have it. The Fender Vibro-King has it. The classic Vox amps and their Matchless/Bad Cat clones have it.

Yet they're all very different amps and different tones, so it's very difficult for me to put what that "it" is in words.
 
The clean channel of my Custom 50 along with either my NF3 or my 25th Anniv. C22 Semi Hollow LTD are THE best clean tones I've ever played. Now that my V30s in my PRS cab are breaking in(finally!), they are getting ever better! Both of these guitars just sound HEAVENLY through this amp. My others sound great as well, especially the C24 w/59/09s (far left in avatar pic). But these two are just off the charts great.
 
So, Les, you could sell that Lone Star and get a Custom 50 head and not have to deal with a 90lb amp! Of course, the Mesa is probably on wheels, but I bet you like to get it off the floor.

Believe me, once I heard the Custom 50 I thought "gosh, shoulda, woulda, coulda," but...my LS was a special order with the leather covering and trim...and it does some things I really need from time to time.

Plus, my son tours with one, so when he visits - he's flying here from London to attend a wedding this weekend - he's all set up and ready to go if he feels like a jam with the old man, or wants to lay down a track in my studio.

So it's going to stay. The question is whether I'd get a Custom 50 head in addition!

So far, my experience with the Custom 50, is that the clean channel is one of those tones that just makes me go, "oh, yeahhhhhhh" every time I play through it

That's exactly what I said when I heard it. Um...after buying the Lone Star. :(

I'd be interested to put the Custom and a Lonestar side by side and A/B the drive channels. To me, it sounds like the Lonestar has a very American inspired crunch tone, where the Custom has a little bit of Marshall influence and perhaps some of the Mesa Mark series in there too.

I'd agree. The only objection I have to the LoneStar crunch tone is that it's a bit harsh compared to the two PRS amps I have - maybe that's how it's supposed to be - but I can't seem to dial that harshness out. Then again, I haven't given that channel the 100% effort I might give it if it was my only amp. Because it's so EASY to dial in a great lead tone on the HXDA, I just move along to that amp instead. I should probably work with the Mesa a little more. It probably has some nicer tones if I dialed them in appropriately.

I had also been pondering a Mesa Stiletto Stage II, and that probably isn't over, but I'm glad I got the Custom first. I think the hot, JCM tone would be right up my alley, but I highly doubt the clean channel would come close to the Custom, nor would the amp be as useful as an all-around tool. If I've got to haul an amp to gigs, I want to love all of it, not have to face a compromise on one channel.

My son had the Stiletto Stage II in my studio before he moved to LA. I think you hit the nail on the head. It's a fine amp. But it isn't as versatile as the amp you already have, IMHO.
 
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